The report was essentially a report of the joint work of the Royal Commission and the
group conducting the surveys - thus limited to a certain number of homes to determine the
parameters of surveys and the effectiveness of investigation methods and techniques.
As I understand it, the group conducts surveys if they are invited to do so, so the
database will evolve over time, and is likely to include a range of old buildings
including barns.
I mentioned Maesafallen because there appears to be uncertainty about when the present
house was built. The application of the group’s techniques might help determine the age
of the present house, and might also reveal further information about the development of
the farm and the settlement of the Hirnant Valley.
Ken Richards
On Feb 12, 2015, at 12:45 PM, I Thompson <joscyn(a)hotmail.com>
wrote:
The RCAHMW report is not great where it comes to non gentry houses as you suggest - lots
of early properties were missed as not interesting enough.
I don't know about Hearth Tax for the parishes around Bala but those for the Lleyn
Peninsula hardly contain any house or farm names at all.
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 11:59:02 -0500
> To: wls-merionethshire(a)rootsweb.com <mailto:wls-merionethshire@rootsweb.com>
> Subject: Re: [MER] finding earlier information re ancestors who migrated
to pennsylvania c 1680s -90s
> From: wls-merionethshire(a)rootsweb.com
<mailto:wls-merionethshire@rootsweb.com>
>
> Part of the difficulty here may be the attribution of responsibility over the parish
of Llanuwchllyn by a vicar/rector of another parish, such as Llangower.
>
> Here’a a recap of notes that I prepared in 2012:
>
> 1) Life and Public Services of J.Clancy Jones written by Charles Henry Jones,
published in 1911:
>
> Page 11: Rev William Jones, rector Llangower parish,
> Lived at Maesafallen farm
> Rev, William Jlones - graduate of Jesus College, Matriculated March 1 1680 or 1681
at age 18, received BA degree in 1684
> Family had relatives in the Welsh Tract, Pennsylvania.
>
> 2) Esgobaeth Llanelwy: A history of the Diocese of St Asaph by DR Thomas (available
online in North America):
>
>
https://archive.org/details/esgobaethllanel00thomgoog
<
https://archive.org/details/esgobaethllanel00thomgoog>
<
https://archive.org/details/esgobaethllanel00thomgoog
<
https://archive.org/details/esgobaethllanel00thomgoog>>
>
> Thomas includes a history and lists of vicars/rectors for all parishes in the
diocese. (See pages 683 to 725 for the United Deanery of Penllyn and Edeyrnion)
>
> The following dates were noted:
>
> William Jones - Llangower Parish, 1688 to 1689
> William Jones - Gwyddelwern Parish 1689-1691
> William Jones BA, Llangower Parish 1701-1752
>
> This may not be the same William Jones, but the sequence of appointments seems
logical.
>
> 3) The parish of Llanwuchllyn may have been under the supervision of the Rector of
Llangower from 1681. Unfortunately, there is a gap in the Thomas account until 1781 when
he notes the formalization of arrangements for the ‘Joint management” of the two parishes
which remained in effect until 1861. The parish records for Llangower and Llanuwchllyn may
clarify who was in charge of the two parishes between 1701 and 1752. (Available at Gwynedd
Archives - Dolgellau).
>
> Further comments:
>
> Having discussed the location of Maesafallen extensively in the past few days, the
question arises as to why the Rev William Jones lived there instead of being on the spot
at either Llangower or Llanuwchllyn. I cannot answer that. Only to note that Maesyfallen
was part of the Aberhirnant Estate (Parish of Llanfor), and that the farm may have been a
large one. The tithe schedule (1840’s) indicates an acreage of about 600 acres of valley
and mountain land. The Diocese may have been granted access to land with prospects to
supplement the offerings from the parishes of Llangower and Llanuwchllyn. This is
conjecture on my part based on what Thomas has to say in “Esgobaeth Llanelwy."
>
> The lack of evidence of an “old house” on the data base of the Royal Commission of
Historical and Ancient Monuments of Wales (Coflein) suggests a “recent" property.
Peter’s evidence about “Maesafallen" from the Hearth Tax is noteworthy in this
respect. The work of organizations involved in dendro dating would be useful regarding the
age of the present farm at Maesafallen:
>
>
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/lifestyle/nostalgia/welsh-history-month-old-...
<
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/lifestyle/nostalgia/welsh-history-month-old-...
>
> A final proviso. The two sources that I have quoted are secondary sources, and that
the written records of the time, such as the Hearth Tax that Peter mentions, wills and
parish records are more likely to either confirm or disprove what I has been noted to date
from these sources.
>
> Given what has been recorded online to date, I suggest that you consolidate our
collective notes by saving them into a separate file, consider the evidence in total
(which is substantial), then draw up a plan to refine your search.
>
> Ken Richards
>
>
> > On Feb 11, 2015, at 5:51 AM, Peter Evans via
<wls-merionethshire(a)rootsweb.com <mailto:wls-merionethshire@rootsweb.com>>
wrote:
> >
> >
> >>> The place name "Maesyfallen" may be Maesyfelin which means
meadow of the
> > mill. Others may offer their explanation.
> >
> > Before sending off my reply about 4 days ago I checked the Hearth Tax of
> > 1662 for Merioneth.
> >
> > This has been transcribed in the Journal of the Merioneth Historical and
> > Record Society. (Volume 2 Part 1, 1953.)
> >
> > The parish of Llanuwchllyn is quite detailed in comparison to other
> > parishes.
> > This meant I was easily able to check for the existance of a farm
> > Maesyfallen.
> >
> > Lets look at Llanwyllyw (= Llanuwchllyn). On p21-2 are the townships of
> > Pennaran and Y Pennant Llin. On p22 is the township of Castell.
> > I am not sure whether the township of Cynllwd is represented in the
> > transcript.
> > I suspect those entries are included in the township Pennaran.
> >
> > Pennaran lists about 33 different properties.
> > Y Pennant Llin lists about 30 different properties.
> > Castell lists about 10 different properties.
> > That is a total of about 73 different properties.
> >
> > None of these properties are Maesyfallen or like spelling.
> >
> > Since then I have checked the parishs of Llangower and Llanfor.
> >
> > Langower (= Llangower) is on p22, 25-6. Not many properties listed but
> > Maesyfallen not mentioned. Unfortunately not as detailed as per
> > Llanuwchllyn.
> >
> > Llanfor is on p19, 20, possibly 26. Not many properties listed. Maesyfallen
> > is not mentioned. Unfortunately not as detailed as for Llanuwchllyn.
> >
> > The result for Llanuwchllyn is not surprising given the findings of others
> > who place the farm in a different parish altogether.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Peter Evans
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
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