Beginning March 2nd, 2020 the Mailing Lists functionality on RootsWeb will be discontinued. Users will no longer be able to send outgoing emails or accept incoming emails. Additionally, administration tools will no longer be available to list administrators and mailing lists will be put into an archival state.
Administrators may save the emails in their list prior to March 2nd. After that, mailing list archives will remain available and searchable on RootsWeb
The following was posted by Roy Harper on CompuServe's Genealogy Forum this
morning. I don't know where he got his information - I have heard nothing
about it, but it might bear further investigation.
>>M.P. Keith Darvill is presenting a Bill in Parliament in October to place
all records of Births Marriages & Deaths for the UK on the Internet. To
make sure the Bill passes into Law, all Genealogists need to send an e-mail
of support to Keith Darvill at pio(a)parliament.uk This is URJENTLY
needed in the next two weeks<<
~~ Jeanne Bunting (nee Attersley) Ash Vale, Surrey, UK
Merryl Wells of Hemel Hempstead, Herts.
GOONS Mem. No. 1757. Reg. ONS: Bawtree; Gullick/ock;
Mem. of Wells Assn. (GOONS Reg.); Other ONS: Moist.
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeanne Bunting, UK <firgrove(a)compuserve.com>
Sent: 29 September 1999 09:07
Subject: Re: [SOG] Fiche vs CD
> I wonder what devotees of the 1881 census CDs would say if they had been
> published in .PDF format!!
What's that??? No, don't answer. I'm one of those people who really
struggle with my computer, mainly because I have a very bad memory on
anything to do with numbers. Whenever I need my computer (called "Lala") to
do anything different or something I have not touched for a few months my
mind goes blank and I have to ask my son or resort to a book. Have the same
problems setting the video player!
My 1881 census CD set were a birthday present. Although they were very
cheap, CDs are much too expensive for me, being on Income Support. I have
to weigh up the expenses of microfiche against the amount of useful
information it is likely to contain before I buy fiche as well. I once
wrote to a FHS who were publishing their 1851 census index on fiche to ask
if they could send me those which contained the surname I was researching,
but they returned my cheque saying they did not have time to look for me -
and I could not afford to make a guess.
I would expect there are many people who buy fiche or CDs who find they are
of little or no use and consign them to the back of a drawer as having been
a bad buy. Is there somewhere on the Internet where one could buy
second-hand family history fiche/CDs/books at half-price?
> Am I alone in thinking that the September issue of the Society's GM was
> a little on the thin side?
> that many of us hold back from making submissions to it because we
> perceive that it's either too highbrow or divorced from the mainstream
> of genealogy.
> Barney Tyrwhitt-Drake
Spot on, Barney. There are three words to describe this month's
magazine: dull, dull, dull. From the front cover to the back,
there is not a picture or a story to make you want to read on
-- or stay a member of SoG.
Yours sadly, Ian Richardson
On 30 September 1999 21:39, Famresearch(a)cs.com [SMTP:Famresearch@cs.com]
> I have a computer and a fiche reader. I have yet to discover the value
of family history CD's.
For some of us I suspect that it is the ability to take large amounts of
data, reprocess them into a format that we can use and then integrate it
into our working databases etc. Personally I cannot stand retyping data
when I can simply "massage" what has already been captured. I recognise
that not everyone is going to be able to do this but there are now a
>I think the big advantage of fiche is that it allows the publication of
small quantities of data onto a medium that can be sold
> cheaply and so is affordable for many. Typically fiche are sold for ?1
to ?1.50 each.
The cost of data on CD (given that most are upto 640Mb in size) is far
superior to fiche.
> I don't suppose there is any real reason why photographic images of
parish registers etc cannot be printed onto CD. I
> have absolutely no idea how many pictures one could get onto a CD. I
also suspect that most people would like a CD with a search engine. This
> that the CD would need some kind of index. Making the production more
time consuming and costly.
CD's are ideal for photographic images and the number you get depends upon
the quality of the image but assuming that it was a compressed image then
the answer is probably several thousand per CD. The question of a search
engine is more vexing and would be limited to something that searches for
the name of the document unless a full index of all of the entries was
required. If the transcription had been done to fulfil the needs of
indexing (or had been done previously anyway) then both the transcription
and the image of the original source could be contained on the CD thus
allowing a "primary source" check against the transcription. Search engine
technology is widely available and should not present too many problems.
Just to add a little more fuel to the debate <bg>...
Let's start thinking about some modern technology like DVD's instead of
those antiquated CD's. We are fast approaching the era of "Internet Lite"
with interactive digital TV when "the masses" will have access to web
technology and we should be grasping these new technologies if we want
Genealogy to progress at an appropriate rate. We should also be recognising
that Gedcom is approaching a major limitation in terms of the richness of
what it provides us and is not something that lends itself very readily to
internet technologies. I suspect that Mike Kay may well have some words
that he could add on where XML (specifically GedML) might take us in the
future. I know that many people are still struggling to come to terms with
PC's (or other varieties of system) and yes I too have a fiche reader
because until recently it was the only way to get remote access to these
records (but I have thrown out my card index).
The debate over fiche and CD has had interesting points on both sides but
if we are going to debate "technology" rather than discuss research
techniques or interesting sources etc then lets at least look forward a
little more. How about "What are we doing to influence "Joined up
Government" to provide greater access to archives, how those archives are
made available, who is going to champion GedML, what plans are there for
making "our own" records in the SoG more readily available (I've been a
member for nearly 20 years and used the Library once since I simply cannot
rush down to London to do some research).
After you with the flameproof suit, box, helmet and protective padding
Membership No. 598C
Would the SOG mind if I laminated my membership card? It gets a bit
tatty and it would keep it nice.
It might not fit in the plastic wallets I saw last time I came, but if I
could punch a hole in the top, I could put a chain through. Chains
suitable for this may be available at large stationery outlets, e.g.
Office World, Staples. I have one for my ID pass at work.
Camberley, Surrey, UK
I am currently putting together the program for next years events and could
do with a few volunteers for a number of talks ands also if anyone has any
fresh ideas of talks/courses.
All should be computer orientated and I am certain there are a number of
experts out there. If you have any ideas or are willing to give your
time/expertise please reply off list.
There are 36 slots for the computer sub-committee and so far we have filled
15, it's early days - plenty of time to volunteer ....
Chairman - Guild of One-Name Studies
The Scottish Genealogy Society has an extensive list of publications for
sale, including Scots emigration to Australia, New Zealand and more.
Check their site at http://www.sol.co.uk/s/scotgen.soc/
Their journal 'The Scottish genealogist' published quarterly, give news
of local family history events. These events are of course focused on
Scottish family history.
Maureen in the UK
Am I alone in thinking that the September issue of the Society's GM was
a little on the thin side?
Donning my flameproof suit, box, helmet and protective padding, here is
my synopsis of the editorial contents:
1. Article on the CAREW family. Erudite but likely to be of little
interest to the mainstream of SoG members who don't come from families
researched by John Horace Round.
2. Article on Indian Parish Registers. Excellent article - many of us
have ancestors who served in India, and the description of his recording
techniques for registers was most interesting.
3. One page article on Medieval and Royal genealogy update. My
Republican leanings are well known, but I wonder how many members get
anything of value from this chestnut of a column?
4. Summary of the AGM that looked like a death announcement.
5. Book reviews. Good stuff, even if I do disagree with Else that
Burke's publications were ever scholarly... :)
6. Notes & News. The usual good content, although it was a little
strange to read so much about the Birmingham Fair *after* the event.
Federation News - interesting.
Then pages and pages of information on library accessions provide the
bulk of the magazine. So, one interesting article, two elitist ones, the
regulars of news/book reviews and an awful lot of stuff that could be
presented more usefully in a non-magazine format.
But where oh where are the thought provoking articles on genealogical
methods and experiences? Where are the contributions from the Library
staff? (The last one I remember was Anthony Camp's interesting article
on surname frequency). Is there really so little that's submitted to the
editor that's worthy of publication?
Speaking as someone who's submitted more than his fair share (too much
some would say) of articles to SoG publications in the last few years, I
hope nobody will brand me as a critic who is not prepared to put his
money where his mouth is.
As members of the Society, shouldn't we all be demanding more of our
quarterly journal and contributing more to it ourselves? Please note
that I am neither making nor implying any criticism of the Editor. I
appreciate it's a difficult job done with skill and substance. What I'm
concerned about is the lack of feedback from members, and the feeling
that many of us hold back from making submissions to it because we
perceive that it's either too highbrow or divorced from the mainstream
Drake Software web site: http://www.tdrake.demon.co.uk
On 27/09/99 10:15:58 WickingD(a)logica.com wrote:
<< I was amazed at the amount of fiche based material available at the Family
History Experience this weekend. I have been used to using fiche in record
offices, libraries and the SOG, but I was not aware that so many people are
happy to buy fiche to use at home.
For the three or four sets of fiche I might have bought, I am better off
waiting until I next go to the SoG. I am happy to buy CDs on the other hand
because I have already made the investment in computers.
First of all I wish to apologise to members for earlier incomplete posting.
My Compuserve 2000 software automatically sent the uncompleted e-mail, whilst
sending other e-mails.
I have a computer and a fiche reader. I have yet to discover the value of
family history CD's. I think the big advantage of fiche is that it allows
the publication of small quantities of data onto a medium that can be sold
cheaply and so is affordable for many. Typically fiche are sold for £1 to
£1.50 each. I have purchased a lot of parish registers from the
Leicestershire and Northamptonshire Record Offices on fiche. With fiche I
only have to purchase the fiche only for the registers I am interested in and
the big advantage is that I can look at it as many times as I like without
occurring any costs (eg travel) or damaging the original. I also get a frill
from seeing a photograph of the original record. To me, it brings the Record
Office into my home. This is really important to me as I cannot visit UK
Record Offices very often. I don't suppose there is any real reason why
photographic images of parish registers etc cannot be printed onto CD. I
have absolutely no idea how many pictures one could get onto a CD. I also
suspect that most people would like a CD with a search engine. This means
that the CD would need some kind of index. Making the production more time
consuming and costly.
I don't think that the content of the September is untypical and perhaps it
doesn't really satisfy the bulk of the membership. I do view the magazine as
more "High Brow" than the quarterly magazines from Family History Societies,
and look to the magazine to provide a better class of article. I personally
find the articles on Royal Genealogies uninteresting and would welcome more
articles on methods, techniques, theories on surname origins, migration,
emigration etc. I think some members would welcome some lighter non-academic
articles as well.
I think the membership at large should be encouraged to contribute more
articles. Is there anywhere in the magazine giving editorial guidelines as
to what type of article (ie. subject matter) is acceptable for publication?
I have no particular view on wearing a name badge or not. I wear what I hope
is a clear one, computer generated, at Yorkshire Consortium meetings which
gives my name and my interest in Calderdale - but these meetings are
occasions to chat.
I assume that people go to the SoG to research. If I see someone I know I say
hello but I do not expect to chat - we both want to get on with our research.
If someone asks me a question of course I will answer them but I assume they
do not want to chat.
My experience is that a fair number of people in the members' room are still
researching, checking through information while they have a break, They will
not want to be disturbed. I often read the paper while I have a sandwich, I
appreciate having a quiet time relaxing from getting boggle eyed at a fiche
reader or wrestling with early handwriting.
Perhaps some of us need to wear badges like those in hotels - DO NOT DISTURB.
Bill firth, the Yorkshireman in London
the Society will be closed for a slightly longer period than usual
this Christmas and New Year.
The opening times over this period are:
Thursday 23 December open until 8pm
Friday 24 December to Monday 3 January (inclusive) CLOSED
Tuesday 4 January Open as usual (10-6)
Sales & Marketing Manager
Society of Genealogists
14 Charterhouse Buildings, LONDON, EC1M 7BA
T +44 171 253 5235 FAX +44 171 250 1800
Visit the bookshop on Line
At 15:39 29/09/1999 -0400, Frank Hardy wrote:
>If it is really important, I am sure Sue Spurgeon at the Society could tell
>you from the membership computer.
I hope so as the society must have registered the membership computer under
the DPA 1984 and there is a requirement for the Society to make available
data it holds to any individual who requests it (and pays a fee if required)
Chris Broomfield (SoG 21210)
At 08:17 PM 28/9/1999 +0100, Geoff Beach wrote:
>Can anyone at SOG give me an answer to the question "How long
>have you been a member of the SOG?". I have been asked several
>times at the NEC over the weekend, and I cannot remember, my No.
>is quite low at 0781, I've found an old membership card dated 1987
>and a record in my earliest work books of a visit to the SOG in
>October 1986, but I am sure I joined earlier and made visits earlier.
Sue Spurgeon has membership details and could answer the question, though
she is not currently on the email system. An email to info(a)sog.org.uk
might well bring a result. However I have a list of members, and although
I do not have the full details I do have the dates when membership was
approved. In your case it was 15th July 1986.
Geoffrey Stone, SoG Mailing List Administrator.
Geoff Beach asks about length of membership and can it be derived from the
The simple answer is that with a number like 0781 it can't be!!
When the membership records were computerised, all members at that time
were given numbers generally working from the cards which were kept in
alphabetical order. Numbers higher that about 12,000 have been allocated
roughly in sequence of applying to join.
If it is really important, I am sure Sue Spurgeon at the Society could tell
you from the membership computer.
In message <199909290407_MC2-86DC-4BB(a)compuserve.com>, "Jeanne Bunting, UK" wri
>>>My understanding was that the original question related to facsimile
>publishing of old source documents,<<
>Sorry to disagree with you, but it didn't. It just said 'fiche-based
>I wonder what devotees of the 1881 census CDs would say if they had been
>published in .PDF format!!
The short answer is that it would be better than the fiche version of the 1881
census, but the database version as published by the LDS, with all its
quirks is superior. Fairly obvious, but I thought the discusion was
about fiche versus CDROM, and suitable formats to publish material on
CDROMs. Producing a PDF file is easy, and can be done by anyone with
Acrobat Distiller (for example). However, producing the database and viewer
that the LDS published the 1881 census on CDROM is not a trival task,
requiring expertise and time.
I am in favour of the use of name badges and would be happy to wear the
plastic name badge that I have for use at work at Society events etc.
However, as it does contain the company name I assume that this would be
viewed as unacceptable to the Society as it is not a Society badge and I
suppose it could imply that :-
1. My employer is endorsing / sponsoring the event which would not be the
2. My employer approves of its unofficial use which may not be the case.
Any views on this please ?
Re: email from Peter Rogers who said <<has anyone seen a leaflet from
I picked a leaflet up at Myddleton House last week entitled -
"Registration: Modernising a vital service. We want to Hear from You"
asking for views on a consultative document which can be viewed at
http://www.ons.gov.uk. Comments can be sent to the following email
address: alistair.macgregor(a)ons.gov.uk. Pam Reynolds in Hertfordshire.