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Hi Angela,
The I-69 project, has been going on for a number of years, so I'm not sure I can answer your question adequately, but I'll be glad to give it a shot. I started working on the 'Archaeological Records Check and Southwestern Indiana GIS Archaeological Database' with Landmark in March of 2002. I've only been working full time since June of last year, so I have limited knowledge about what had transpired prior to my employment.
First off, let me explain that this is not a cemetery study. It is the final stage of the I-69 Tier 1 Environmental Impact Statement (EIS). A part of this EIS focuses on the identification of cultural resources in a series of proposed alternative routes. Many different types of sites are being identified during this research. Cemeteries are just one important consideration.
It was felt that, while we have recorded a fairly large number of cemeteries that have been identified and appear in existing records, there are many more that do not. These more obscure sites are, in some instances, known only to folks like yourself and others on this list that are engaged in cemetery preservation and restoration at a more local level. Since we want to ensure that no cemeteries are adversely impacted by future development, the most logical course of action would be to enlist assistance from people who are knowledgeable about the pioneer cemeteries and other important sites within their respective regions. The volunteer assistance that we are asking for is intended to augment and refine the work that has already been accomplished and to include as many significant sites in the EIS as is possible.
I really don't know how long Landmark has been engaged as a consultant, so I guess I haven't really answered your question. But, thanks for another opportunity to explain what we're trying to accomplish, as well as the chance to thank the conscientious members that have already come forward with cemetery locations and information. The valuable assistance from volunteers involved with the INPCRP is very helpful.
Best Regards,
Rich Green
Landmark Archaeological & Environmental Services, Inc.
4338 Hadley Court
West Lafayette, IN 47906
Office: (765) 464-8735 Mobile: (765) 427-4082
www.landmarkarchaeology.com
----- Original Message -----
From: GTielking
To: INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com
Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 2:51 PM
Subject: [INPCRP] Cemetery survey question
Dear Rich,
May I ask when the state hired your firm to begin the cemetery study along the I-69 extension? Just curious.
Angela Tielking
Henry Co., Ind.
==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
THIS IS A CEMETERY -----
"Lives are commemorated - deaths are recorded - families
are reunited - memories are made tangible - and love is
undisguised. This is a cemetery.
"Communities accord respect, families bestow reverence,
historians seek information and our heritage is thereby enriched.
"Testimonies of devotion, pride and remembrance are carved
in stone to pay warm tribute to accomplishments and to the life -
not the death - of a loved one. The cemetery is homeland for family
memorials that are a sustaining source of comfort to the living.
"A cemetery is a history of people - a perpetual record of
yesterday and sanctuary of peace and quiet today. A cemetery
exists because every life is worth loving and remembering - always."
--Author unknown -- Seen at a monument dealer in West Union, IA
Dear Rich,
May I ask when the state hired your firm to begin the cemetery study along the I-69 extension? Just curious.
Angela Tielking
Henry Co., Ind.
I have been work on a cemetery project for the Indiana Genealogical Society
for the last two and a half years. Our project (originally started in
1990) is to give driving directions to each cemetery, or former cemetery,
in the state. I have about half the counties finished, and half the rest
mostly done. The rest are in one stage or another of the typing process.
Our information comes from several sources: Information submitted to IGS
in the early 1990's. Information currently available on various web sites
(genealogical societies, historical societies, public libraries). And
information available at the Indiana State Library. As part of this
project, I am reading the topographical maps for each area.
Several times I have found information that a cemetery "was known to be
..." Sometimes this information will only give a section number.
Sometimes it will give the name of a landowner, usually from the 1930's.
Sometimes a cemetery is shown on older topo maps, but is not on the most
recent one. I am more confident of locating "all known" cemeteries when
the information was submitted to IGS, than when I have had to find a
county's information on my own.
I was able to take the program Rich sent me, identify the section numbers
that the routes overlaid, figure out which townships those sections were
in, and look for the cemeteries in each. It took a very short time to do
this because of the work I had already done.
I know that there will always be new cemeteries discovered. We can't hope
to find all of them the first time. I have a feeling that the current
revival in cemetery information, started in the mid-1990's, is the second
time around. The first time was in the 1930's and 1940's. Many have been
lost in those years, and many found.
The new law says that the ground cannot be disturbed within 100 feet of a
cemetery. There is a cemetery in Bartholomew County, along I-65, which had
extra dirt piled up around it to make the interstate overpass. This was
done in the early 1970's. The ground where the stones are is still flat.
Were there unmarked graves that were covered by the dirt? Who knows?
But, they were not disturbed.
I also know of three cases, in two different counties, where a state
highway was put right over the top of a cemetery. Mention was made that
the stones were removed, then lost. In one case, someone thought to record
the information on the stones. In another case, they were lost before
being recorded. No mention was made of the stones, if any, in the third
case. These road were done in the early-to-mid 20th Century.
If there are any of you who are working on a county and would like a copy
of what I have done, please let me know. All I ask is that you read
(proofread) what I have done for the whole county and correct any errors.
(I'm notorious for thinking east and writing down west. Also road names
and number may have been changed in the last few years.)
Sharon Howell
sshowell(a)indy.net
To the list,
I think Ernie has struck most of the recent points squarely on the head; at least with opinions that I think the majority will agree on. While risking sounding like a broken record, I would only add punctuation to one of his comments.
The first order of business in a competent statewide cemetery preservation plan should be to accurately record all cemeteries. It is much more difficult to ignore a cemetery site that has been surveyed and is publicly recorded. I believe that the Indiana Cemetery Registry sets out to accomplish this rather monumental task (no pun intended). Unfortunately, a project this large will take time to complete and in the meanwhile the wheels of progress continue to turn.
An Environmental Impact Statement (EIS) like the one undertaken in advance of I-69 construction is an opportunity to be certain that previously unrecorded or inadequately documented pioneer cemeteries and other cultural resources are considered in advance of highway development and, at the same time, documented within a permanent and public record.
Finally, there are still a few counties that are not impacted by the Governor's choice where we don't have any volunteers working to add unknown or obscure cemeteries existing within the respective Study Bands. But these Study Bands are still an important and integral part of the EIS. As I said when I answered my friend Jon's e-mail, we will complete our work for the final Tier 1 EIS document and this includes all of the alternative routes and permutations thereof.
We don't have volunteers yet for Lawrence, Owen and Vigo counties. If anyone on the list is interested in assisting with the identification of cemeteries in these counties, please don't hesitate to e-mail me at the earliest convenience.
Best Regards,
Rich Green
Landmark Archaeological & Environmental Services, Inc.
4338 Hadley Court
West Lafayette, IN 47906
Office: (765) 464-8735 Mobile: (765) 427-4082
www.landmarkarchaeology.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Ernie & Connie Lasley
To: INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: [INPCRP] I-69 and Cemeteries.
List,
I just came home from a 24 hour shift at the fire department, and
downloaded more INPCRP mail in one day than I have seen in some months! I
am going to respond to several of the posts here:
Re: Cemeteries being destroyed by highways;
Rich Green etal are involved in a study to hopefully prevent that from
happening. Now, and in the future. But they cannot find them
all! Everyone on this list that has an interest in Indiana Pioneer
Cemeteries should get busy and make sure these old unrecorded cemeteries
are accurately placed on the map. Someone mentioned I-70 cutting through
cemeteries. When the earthmover cuts through a cemetery it is too late in
the construction phase to say "wait, there's a cemetery there! NOW is the
time to make sure these are mapped so they can be avoided in the planning
and engineering phase. If they know where they are, you can rest assured
that I-69 will avoid them! Someone wanted to know what the odds were of
the I-69 project finding a cemetery in the path during construction. I
would say the odds are pretty good in the counties that DO NOT have people
involved in this study, and slim to none in the counties that are out there
locating them and sending in the data.
Re: Now that the route has been selected - - -
Map them anyway. This will be valuable information now, and for years to
come in all types of construction, not just interstate highways. Rich
stated somewhere in a post that this information will be shared with the
Department of Natural Resources, Division of Historic Preservation and
Archaeology, maybe this will help the Cemetery Registry Project gain some
headway. I would suggest that you also share your information with the
IHS, local officials, and anywhere else that it will become a "cemetery of
record".
Re: The DNR and "studying remains"
Someone stated that there is no good reason to study remains, we already
know all about them from obits, family histories, etc. I think this is a
mis-conception about the DNR studies, in most cases they have no clue who
they are, and in some cases, have no clue what century they were buried
in. But when their studies are completed, usually they can tell you. I
am basing this on my very limited knowledge of DNR studies, but I recall
two cases in Gibson County where remains were discovered. In one case they
determined that the remains were from an 800 year old grave of a Native
American female, and in another case determined the remaind were of a
female buried around 1845. They even had specifics of age, size, and what
they most likely died of. All valuable information if you are attempting
to find a name for this person.
Re: The DNR and storage of remains.
I, too have problems with the methods and timeliness of DNR's "studies" and
"storage". About 18 months ago I mentioned in a post here, the problems I
was having obtaining information on a DNR "study" on a cemetery discovered
in Gibson County during a construction project. I was promised by a DNR
official that I would receive that information, and about two months later
was told I would have the information "hopefully next week". So 15 months
have gone by, and still no information. I agree with Kyle, UEB and
others on this point that studies should be minimal. If remains are found,
study and identify them in a timely manner, then let's figure out where to
re-bury them, let's not store them in Indy forever.
RE: Toyota and studies.
Yes, every square inch was, and everything near the property. Toyota even
deed searched, surveyed, and fenced a nearby cemetery for us that was
off-site. And when bones were found during off-site highway construction,
work was stopped, the remains were excavated and studied in a timely
manner, and the bones were determined to be those of a pre-historic animal
(I think dinosaur?) No stone was left unturned in this project, and the
archaeological, environmental and engineering firms hired to do all this
did a very professional and thourough and timely job.
Re: The proposed route.
I will not even go there. Some of the posts on this topic concerning "new
build", "damage to wetlands", "farmland", "endangered species", etc seem to
be very uninformed. It is off-topic and I will not argue the
mis-conceptions here.
Re: Relocating a cemetery.
I do not think that will be an issue on this project. IF we let them know
where these cemeteries ARE! Some that I have platted in the last two
weeks have no stones or any visible means of identifying it as a cemetery,
and is not in the State database. If I had not turned in the location and
data, they very well may have been discovered by the earthmover during
construction, and at that point it is too late to move the highway,
relocation will probably be the only option. That is why it is important
to identify these locations now, during the study phase.
Re: Kicking the DNR.
I covered that under "studies and storage", but another point - - - At one
of our cemeteries where stones were removed and the cemetery destroyed we
discovered a casket handle, proof that a cemetery existed. No follow-up
from officials on that. And the reporting of a farmer putting stones in a
pile so he could farm the cemetery land. No follow-up on that. And the
case of the reporting of a property owner hauling off stones from a
cemetery in his back yard. No follow-up on that. At one time, the
locals around here called the local DNR Conservation Officers "possum
cop". If the guy ran over some wildlife while hauling off the stones,
maybe I could get them to do something.
Re: Rich Green.
I would like to thank Rich for the assistance he has provided me in
locating and mapping cemeteries, his assistance will provide far greater
benefit than just the I-69 study band. With the knowledge I have gained
from him, I hope to have the 200 plus cemeteries in Gibson County
accurately located and mapped by the end of the year.
Sorry about this post being so long. But I think some important issues
were raised and discussed in all of the posts. I learn a lot from this
mail list, I hope I have been able to contribute something of value for others.
Ernie Lasley, Coordinator
Gibson County PCRP
PCRP Page: http://members.sigecom.net/elasley/inpcrp/index.html
Cemeteries Page: http://www.usroots.com/~jmurphy/gibson/gibcem/gibcem.htm
==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
If we cannot respect the dead, how can we respect the living?
You have much more faith in the state than I have. I am not concerned with
them bulldozing our cemeteries in Morgan County BECAUSE they have been
documented. My concern is the fact that they will want to MOVE them. They
may not want to go around them, just move them out of the way. The entire
process of disinterment is an unknown entity to me, what will happen to the
integrity of the historical significance of the cemetery if it is moved. I
have seen the results of cemeteries that have been moved in the past, and it
has been very disconcerting. I do not feel that just because they know a
cemetery is there that has a dozen burials in it that they will say "OK
let's just move our road". The historical and cultural value of a cemetery
in its' original location can never be reconstructed somewhere else. Again
it comes down to the "final resting place".
We are in the process of getting our mapping done for Rich Green. I
wholeheartedly agree that this is a very important part of the planning of
this new road.
Please forgive me for posting the previous note twice, I didn't think it
went through the first time since there was a six hour delay posting to my
email.
Helen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ernie & Connie Lasley" <elasley(a)sigecom.net>
To: <INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: [INPCRP] The cart before the Horse.
> Ok,
>
> Let me try this one more time before everyone rushes out to hire lawyers,
> etc, to fight the State over these old cemeteries.
>
> ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS TELL THEM WHERE IT IS!!!
>
> That is the reason for proposing different routes, and doing extensive,
> costly studies of these proposed routes. They identify anything that
needs
> to be planned around, INCLUDING CEMETERIES!
>
> We are all up in the air, ready to fight the State to protect these
> cemeteries, when all we need to do is let them know where they are
> at. Rich Green posted a message on this list asking for assistance from
> the affected counties for that very reason. The ones that are already
> mapped are no problem, it is the hidden and virtually unknown cemeteries
> that they are concerned with. I would like to make a suggestion here,
and
> I think will make better use of our time. Rather than debating what is
> going to happen to these cemeteries and if they are in danger, get out
your
> cemetery records and plat maps and make a list of the cemeteries that you
> think may be in/near the proposed route. Post the name of that cemetery
> and it's location here on this mail list. If you do that, I will
guarantee
> you that the I-69 bulldozers and earthmovers will not wipe out your
> cemetery! If you do not have GPS coordinates, give the best location
that
> you have. Here are some examples:
>
> Rickard Cemetery, Columbia Twp. Gibson County. GPS 38.37059 N, -87.33525
W
>
> E.H. Grubb Cemetery, Gibson County. NW corner of NW 14; Sec 13; T2S; R9W
>
> Providence Cemetery, Gibson County. Behind Providence Church on County
> Road 550S, Barton Twp.
>
> McCurdy Cemetery. 350 feet East of US 41 on Richland Creek Drive, then
> North 250 feet into the woods.
>
> Note that all four of these use different methods of location, but all
give
> a good enough location that the survey crew will find it. I just spent
> the morning out in freezing, windy weather obtaining a GPS on the last one
> on our list for Gibson County, Rickard Cemetery. It was not on an
official
> map, and we had no record of it's exact location, so I went out and talked
> to the landowner, he pointed to a clump of trees in a fence row at the
edge
> of a woods about 2000 feet across the field from his house, and I walked
> across the field and found it. (and it was a cold walk, both
> directions) Later on today I will send Rich Green our final list. I
> probably could have told him "it's 2000 feet East of farmer So-&-So's
> house" and he would have found it. But before I send him that
information,
> neither he or the State will have any clue that Rickard cemetery exists,
or
> what part of the State it is in. After I turn my list in, I will rest
> easy knowing that he has told the State where it is and they will plan
> around it.
>
> Act, not react.
>
> Ernie
>
> At 02:12 PM 01/11/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>
> > - - - -I intend to fight for the preservation of each of these
cemeteries.
>
>
> ==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
> "Show me your cemeteries, and I will tell you what kind of people you
have."
> Benjamin Franklin (1706 - 1790)
>
Ok,
Let me try this one more time before everyone rushes out to hire lawyers,
etc, to fight the State over these old cemeteries.
ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS TELL THEM WHERE IT IS!!!
That is the reason for proposing different routes, and doing extensive,
costly studies of these proposed routes. They identify anything that needs
to be planned around, INCLUDING CEMETERIES!
We are all up in the air, ready to fight the State to protect these
cemeteries, when all we need to do is let them know where they are
at. Rich Green posted a message on this list asking for assistance from
the affected counties for that very reason. The ones that are already
mapped are no problem, it is the hidden and virtually unknown cemeteries
that they are concerned with. I would like to make a suggestion here, and
I think will make better use of our time. Rather than debating what is
going to happen to these cemeteries and if they are in danger, get out your
cemetery records and plat maps and make a list of the cemeteries that you
think may be in/near the proposed route. Post the name of that cemetery
and it's location here on this mail list. If you do that, I will guarantee
you that the I-69 bulldozers and earthmovers will not wipe out your
cemetery! If you do not have GPS coordinates, give the best location that
you have. Here are some examples:
Rickard Cemetery, Columbia Twp. Gibson County. GPS 38.37059 N, -87.33525 W
E.H. Grubb Cemetery, Gibson County. NW corner of NW 14; Sec 13; T2S; R9W
Providence Cemetery, Gibson County. Behind Providence Church on County
Road 550S, Barton Twp.
McCurdy Cemetery. 350 feet East of US 41 on Richland Creek Drive, then
North 250 feet into the woods.
Note that all four of these use different methods of location, but all give
a good enough location that the survey crew will find it. I just spent
the morning out in freezing, windy weather obtaining a GPS on the last one
on our list for Gibson County, Rickard Cemetery. It was not on an official
map, and we had no record of it's exact location, so I went out and talked
to the landowner, he pointed to a clump of trees in a fence row at the edge
of a woods about 2000 feet across the field from his house, and I walked
across the field and found it. (and it was a cold walk, both
directions) Later on today I will send Rich Green our final list. I
probably could have told him "it's 2000 feet East of farmer So-&-So's
house" and he would have found it. But before I send him that information,
neither he or the State will have any clue that Rickard cemetery exists, or
what part of the State it is in. After I turn my list in, I will rest
easy knowing that he has told the State where it is and they will plan
around it.
Act, not react.
Ernie
At 02:12 PM 01/11/2003 -0500, you wrote:
> - - - -I intend to fight for the preservation of each of these cemeteries.
While I don't want to see the discussion on this list turn to a debate over
which route is best, I'm glad to see that we are bringing up points that need
to be addressed regarding this I-69 extension. I think Ernie hit it on the
head that those of you who are in the affected area and have proof or
suspicion that cemeteries could be affected, NOW is the time to find out.
And for those like Helen who have identified those in her area that could be
in danger, I suggest contacting the Indiana Dept. of Transportation, the
elected State Representative and State Senator, and your US Congressman with
a letter pointing out that you believe there could be a cemetery in this
proposed path and that you "trust all necessary steps will be taken to see
that the graves of our Indiana pioneers will not be disturbed in the process
of this construction"...then be sure to give the location of those that are
already identified...this is the documentation you will need down the road
when somebody at INDOT (I'm done picking on the DNR now) says "we didn't know
nothin' about that cemetery".... Don't waste time....start now.
Kyle
Hello,
I have been waiting with baited breath to see which route would be chosen
for the I-69 expansion. It did not matter what route was chosen through
Morgan County, we would have cemeteries affected. The route that has been
chosen at this time, the SR 37 corridor from Bloomington through Morgan
County, will possibly impact six cemeteries that are very close to the road.
I fear for all of them. These are all small family or Church cemeteries
that have long ago been closed for burial. I intend to fight for the
preservation of each of these cemeteries. We also have several large
"active" cemeteries within the band of the proposed route, but they are not
in danger as much as the small neglected ones. My question is this; When
the state acquires the land to build the road, will they meet with less
resistance in attaining the land that is supposedly "cared" for by the
trustees? Since the cemeteries don't have close family ties any longer in
the county with descendants and are not owned directly by the family that is
buried there, will they be swept up in all the rest of the land and handed
over to the state with no fight or concern for the disposition of the dead
buried there? Will this be an easy solution for them to the problem of
"caring" for cemeteries? I am not a "tree hugger" either, but I am a Stone
Hugger.
Helen Wildermuth
----- Original Message -----
From: "GTielking" <tielking(a)knightstown.net>
To: <INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 12:05 AM
Subject: [INPCRP] I-69 stats
> Hello everyone. In a local newspaper today were published facts about the
I-69 expansion. I thought I would pass them along.
>
> Estimated cost: $1.64-$1.81 billion
> Total length: 140-143 miles
> Total right-of-way needed: 5,500-6,090 acres
> Impovement in Indianapolis-Evansville travel time: 26 minutes
> Savings per day in truck operation costs: $155,000
> Potential bridges along route: 58-59
> Potential interchanges: 28-31
> Homes dislocated: 370-458
> Businesses dislocated: 51-75
> Farmland affected: 4,070-4,630 acres
> Prime farmland affected: 2,280-3,730
> Forest habitat affected: 398 acres
> Wetlands affected: 90-150
> Wetland mitigation: 266-570 acres
> Federal threatened and endangered species in route's path: 2
> State threatened and endangered species in route's path: 14
>
> Source: Daily Reporter, Greenfield, Indiana
>
>
> I wonder how many cemeteries we will lose because of the expansion????
>
>
> Angela Tielking
>
>
> ==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
> If you know of some good cemetery related links, send them to
LoisMauk(a)usa.net.
>
Let us jump in on this discussion...
We are concerned about the portion of the proposed I-69 route through Greene
and Daviess counties. We haven't seen a very detailed map yet. The one we
have seen appears to enter Greene County in Jackson Township. Then it
appears to almost go due west along the Greene County line with Martin and
Daviess counties, before heading south into Daviess County.
Washington Township in Greene County and Elmore Township of Daviess County
are of interest to us. Jan's 4great grandfather William Dellinger was buried
somewhere in this region in 1831. It is possible that he is buried in the
Old Slinkard cemetery just south of Newberry in Greene County. If he is,
then he's lost, as that cemetery was already destroyed when a factory was
located on the site.
The other possibility is the Weaver Cemetery, which is located just south of
the Greene-Daviess County line in the northeast corner of Elmore Township.
This cemetery is on farm land. The current owner is maintaining with respect
what remains of the cemetery. Prior owners grazed cattle there, destroying
at least 90% of the cemetery. If Weaver cemetery is William's final resting
place, we would classify it as a pioneer cemetery, since William bought land
in what was then Knox County in 1819, and is now in Greene County. The
current owner graciously has allowed us to explore the cemetery. We've done
some probing and found a few more stones, but so far not the stone we're
looking for.
We would be very interested to know how close the proposed I-69 route comes
to Weaver Cemetery. If we are reading the map correctly, it could go right
through it.
Bob and Jan Dellinger Woltz
When government projects like an interstate are undertaken, are any logs or
documentation kept that would reference the discovery of remains and the
disposition of the remains during the project? If so, who would have such
records after the project is completed?
Laurie Morris
mailto: lmorris(a)wt.net
----- Original Message -----
From: UEB <ueb(a)iei.net>
To: <INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 8:21 PM
Subject: RE: [INPCRP] kicking the DNR
> I agree with you Kyle on this. I was too late for the I-70 excavation
> through Henry county, Today there are several family cemeteries
obliterated
> forever, with no remaining evidence they ever existed. I know of three
that
> I am unable to locate along the I-70 right-of-way. I don't believe any
> archaeology work was ever performed during that "Government Project"
>
> UEB
> Henry County, IN
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: KidClerk(a)aol.com [mailto:KidClerk@aol.com]
> Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 8:52 PM
> To: INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: [INPCRP] kicking the DNR
>
>
>
> For the record...
>
> If my comments were considered as adversarial, it was not to the
profession
> of archaeologists, but to the authority granted a certain state agency in
> Indiana. And if they were taken in that context, then I must have done an
> adequate job of stating my opinion and observation. Sorry I got everyone
> in
> an uproar....I'll just stick to lurking....
>
> -Kyle
>
>
>
>
> ==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, send message consisting only of
> "UNSUBSCRIBE" to INPCRP-L-REQUEST(a)rootsweb.com
> or to INPCRP-D-REQUEST(a)rootsweb.com (for DIGEST version)
>
>
>
>
>
> ==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
> If you know of some good cemetery related links, send them to
LoisMauk(a)usa.net.
>
In a message dated 1/10/03 7:37:49 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ssilver1951(a)jps.net writes:
> You have a right to be offended by what I wrote under my mistaken impression
> that you were an archaeologist.
Sue,
I was not trying to interfere in your E-mail correspondence, but I felt
you may have misunderstood Rich's profession. I am neither "Friend" nor "foe"
of anyone. I am a member of the INPCRP list as we all are. And I know we are
all working very diligently toward the same goal, Cemetery or Burial Site
Preservation. I follow you very closely on several California County Lists
and I believe I understand your feelings. Having been a Californian for 10
years (1983-1993) I have some understanding how tough it is getting a point
across in a state with 30,000,000 different people, and most are new to the
state and think of cemeteries only when they attend a Funeral.. I do agree
with you on some of the blundering that goes on out there, and here in
Indiana as well. Hang on, you are doing a good job. I have been around the
country in the last 55 years, and Cemetery Preservation sure don't top the
List in any state.
jackbriles(a)aol.com
PO Box 444
New Albany, In. 47151-0444
(812) 282-6585
A cousin sent this to me and thought some of you might find it interesting.
Though I don't agree with the Hatfield decendants actions, as being the
property owner he does have every right to do what he's doing
PIKEVILLE, Ky. (Dec. 29) - Descendants of one of the nation's most famous
pairs of feuding families, the Hatfields and McCoys, will face off in court
to settle a dispute over access to a cemetery where three slain boys were
buried.
``I really hate that we have to go to the court system to settle this,''
said Bo McCoy of Waycross, Ga., a plaintiff in the lawsuit against a
Hatfield descendant who blocked access to the family cemetery.
``We wanted to be gentlemen about it,'' McCoy said. ``We felt like we had no
other choice.''
The cemetery, which holds remains of three McCoy boys who were tied to
pawpaw trees and executed by the Hatfields in 1882, is too important
historically to remain closed to the public, McCoy contends.
Larry Webster, an attorney for Hatfield descendant John Vance, whose
property stands between the cemetery and the nearest road, said the case
pits an individual family that wants some privacy against the interests of
tourism and economic development officials.
Vance had posted ``no trespassing'' signs on the property before a judge
granted an injunction this year giving temporary access until a jury decides
the issue. The trial is set to begin Jan. 22.
``This was designed to get national headlines, and designed as a way to get
free advertising for people who hope to make a profit from these things,''
Webster said.
The feud between the McCoys of Kentucky and the Hatfields of West Virginia
is believed to have stemmed from a dispute over a pig. A court battle over
timber rights escalated the tension in the 1870s. By 1888, at least 12
people had died.
Bo and his cousin Ron McCoy, organizers of the annual Hatfield-McCoy Reunion
Festival in Pikeville, want the cemetery to be part of a tour highlighting
points of interest in the bloody feud. Economic development officials hope
the feud sites and cemeteries will draw tourists to the mountain
communities.
Angela,
Interesting stats. Being that a lot of this will be a "new terrain route"
you would think that they could build around any known cemeteries but that
won't happen. It did once that I know of when I-69 was build in Allen
County. They did go around Hatfield cemetery which the first burial was in
1836 but this state goverment doesn't care about the family farmers whose
farmland this route will go through, or it's wetland, or it's endangered
species. If it's willing to go through those, you can bet that cemeteries
are on the bottom of the list. Don't get me wrong, I'm NOT a "tree hugger",
I really don't care what route is used except for the new terrain route.
There are already established routes that can be used that can be re-done to
be interstates without affecting the small family farmers near as bad and
not affecting any wetlands or endangered species at all and costing
$700,000 - 1 billion less but they would only cut the Indy - Evensville
travel time by 15 minutes. I guess that we in Indiana have more money in the
state budget then what's reported, and everyone knows that the goverment
always stays in budget when any kind of construction is done.
Sorry, didn't mean to get on a soapbox.
Brian E. Smead
Terre Haute, Indiana
----- Original Message -----
From: "GTielking" <tielking(a)knightstown.net>
To: <INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 12:05 AM
Subject: [INPCRP] I-69 stats
> Hello everyone. In a local newspaper today were published facts about the
I-69 expansion. I thought I would pass them along.
>
> Estimated cost: $1.64-$1.81 billion
> Total length: 140-143 miles
> Total right-of-way needed: 5,500-6,090 acres
> Impovement in Indianapolis-Evansville travel time: 26 minutes
> Savings per day in truck operation costs: $155,000
> Potential bridges along route: 58-59
> Potential interchanges: 28-31
> Homes dislocated: 370-458
> Businesses dislocated: 51-75
> Farmland affected: 4,070-4,630 acres
> Prime farmland affected: 2,280-3,730
> Forest habitat affected: 398 acres
> Wetlands affected: 90-150
> Wetland mitigation: 266-570 acres
> Federal threatened and endangered species in route's path: 2
> State threatened and endangered species in route's path: 14
>
> Source: Daily Reporter, Greenfield, Indiana
>
>
> I wonder how many cemeteries we will lose because of the expansion????
>
>
> Angela Tielking
>
>
> ==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
> If you know of some good cemetery related links, send them to
LoisMauk(a)usa.net.
>
Hello everyone. In a local newspaper today were published facts about the I-69 expansion. I thought I would pass them along.
Estimated cost: $1.64-$1.81 billion
Total length: 140-143 miles
Total right-of-way needed: 5,500-6,090 acres
Impovement in Indianapolis-Evansville travel time: 26 minutes
Savings per day in truck operation costs: $155,000
Potential bridges along route: 58-59
Potential interchanges: 28-31
Homes dislocated: 370-458
Businesses dislocated: 51-75
Farmland affected: 4,070-4,630 acres
Prime farmland affected: 2,280-3,730
Forest habitat affected: 398 acres
Wetlands affected: 90-150
Wetland mitigation: 266-570 acres
Federal threatened and endangered species in route's path: 2
State threatened and endangered species in route's path: 14
Source: Daily Reporter, Greenfield, Indiana
I wonder how many cemeteries we will lose because of the expansion????
Angela Tielking
I agree with you Kyle on this. I was too late for the I-70 excavation
through Henry county, Today there are several family cemeteries obliterated
forever, with no remaining evidence they ever existed. I know of three that
I am unable to locate along the I-70 right-of-way. I don't believe any
archaeology work was ever performed during that "Government Project"
UEB
Henry County, IN
-----Original Message-----
From: KidClerk(a)aol.com [mailto:KidClerk@aol.com]
Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 8:52 PM
To: INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: [INPCRP] kicking the DNR
For the record...
If my comments were considered as adversarial, it was not to the profession
of archaeologists, but to the authority granted a certain state agency in
Indiana. And if they were taken in that context, then I must have done an
adequate job of stating my opinion and observation. Sorry I got everyone
in
an uproar....I'll just stick to lurking....
-Kyle
==== INPCRP Mailing List ====
To UNSUBSCRIBE, send message consisting only of
"UNSUBSCRIBE" to INPCRP-L-REQUEST(a)rootsweb.com
or to INPCRP-D-REQUEST(a)rootsweb.com (for DIGEST version)
For the record...
If my comments were considered as adversarial, it was not to the profession
of archaeologists, but to the authority granted a certain state agency in
Indiana. And if they were taken in that context, then I must have done an
adequate job of stating my opinion and observation. Sorry I got everyone in
an uproar....I'll just stick to lurking....
-Kyle
When Toyota bought that land near P'ton for their plant was a survey done?
That is a lot of farm land plus the roads and maybe a test drive track??
Just wondering...thanks!
Marilynn
Rich,
I just read Sue's E-mail and your response. Due to the name of the
business you use on your E-mail, i'm sure it was a natural assumption on
Sue's part that you were in archaeology. Even I was surprised that you are
not. Sue is, like yourself, a very, very valuable contributor on the List.
The following is what probably mislead her. Your company name.
"Landmark Archaeological & Environmental Services, Inc."
>
> Best to all,
Jack Briles
jb502000(a)aol.com
Well Said!
Rich Green
GIS & Remote Sensing Specialist
Landmark Archaeological & Environmental Services, Inc.
4338 Hadley Court
West Lafayette, IN 47906
Office: (765) 464-8735 Mobile: (765) 427-4082
www.landmarkarchaeology.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Jb502000(a)aol.com
To: INPCRP-L(a)rootsweb.com
Cc: Rich Green
Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 5:34 PM
Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Governor picks I-69 route
Rich,
You are right in continuing to record. Unless I am mistaken, along with the building of the new I-69 there will be adjacent development to which ever route is chosen. This along with access ramps that will connect with the freeway at existing roadways, plus possible new ones added in strategic locations, will very likely cause large commercial, as well as residential development on connecting roads. This makes it even more imperative that ALL Burial sites be recorded because of the probable land grab that goes with this type project. I have seen this happen along I-64 in southern Indiana over 120 miles. And I-265 at New Albany. The locations of the Cemeteries in the path are merely the beginning of those endangered. Burial sites on Farm Land anywhere in the area are in grave danger of destruction due to the very fast movement to obtain prime land for building which will now begin full force. Time will be short.!!
Jack Briles
jb502000(a)aol.com
Rich,
You are right in continuing to record. Unless I am mistaken, along
with the building of the new I-69 there will be adjacent development to which
ever route is chosen. This along with access ramps that will connect with the
freeway at existing roadways, plus possible new ones added in strategic
locations, will very likely cause large commercial, as well as residential
development on connecting roads. This makes it even more imperative that ALL
Burial sites be recorded because of the probable land grab that goes with
this type project. I have seen this happen along I-64 in southern Indiana
over 120 miles. And I-265 at New Albany. The locations of the Cemeteries in
the path are merely the beginning of those endangered. Burial sites on Farm
Land anywhere in the area are in grave danger of destruction due to the very
fast movement to obtain prime land for building which will now begin full
force. Time will be short.!!
Jack Briles
jb502000(a)aol.com