Hi Sue,
In England and Wales the general public do not have access to copies of the
BMD registers. Unless you are lucky enough to get copies from someone who
has already purchased the certificates you want to see, you have to buy
them yourself. Some local registrars are cooperative and do their best to
ensure that the certificate you buy is the one you want but when you don't
know where a person has died you don't know which local registrar to ask
for help. If you buy from the GRO it is harder to avoid buying irrelevant
certificates.
Relatively inexpensive electronic copies of Scottish BMD registers are
available online but that's still not true for England and Wales. Lots of
people would like the system changed.
Seán
On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 7:44 AM, Susan Haines <sehaines42(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you, Sean. The reason I'd like to "see" the
death certificate is
that it gives the place where the person died and the person who reported
the death ( at least that information is on the death certs that I have
bought). Those two pieces of information might help me figure out if that
person was my gr gr grandfather. I know I could just buy them but there
are several and I fear these are not my gr gr grandfather. I thought if
someone had access to look at them???
As to moving - that is the very real possibility that my gr gr grandfather
did remarry (abandon my gr grandmother) and move to England.
All remains a mystery. I am trying to work on possible siblings of his to
learn about their parents.
Sue
On Aug 19, 2014, at 12:50 AM, Sean Duggan <seanduggan2(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Susan,
I'm not sure I understand "Is anyone able to look at information on a
death certificate?".
Perhaps you want to know if any "sensitive" parts are redacted, as they
are in some jurisdictions in the United States, unless you prove that you
are, for example, a direct descendant of the deceased. It is not like that
in England and Wales. If you buy, or otherwise obtain, a certificate for
a death in England and Wales, you should be able to see everything recorded
when the death was registered.
"If I don't find him on freebmd, does that mean that he probably didn't
die?" No. There are many reasons reasons why one sometimes cannot find a
death on FreeBMD. First, there is a small chance that the death wasn't
registered or that it wasn't indexed by the GRO. There is also a chance
that the relevant GRO index hasn't yet been transcribed and included in
FreeBMD (though for the period you are interested in FreeBMD coverage is
very nearly complete). There is a larger chance that the death was
recorded under a different name or a name so mis-spelled that it is hard to
find. Finally there is a very good chance that the person left England and
Wales and died elsewhere.
During the period you are most interested in, many men left Dowlais (and
other parts of Merthyr Tydfil). Some moved to other parts of England and
Wales, for example to the northeast of England; their deaths should be
included in FreeBMD. Some moved to Scotland. Some Irishmen must have
returned to Ireland. Many other men joined the army and died (sometimes in
battle, more often from disease) far from home. And a very large number
emigrated to the United States, to Canada, to Australia, to New Zealand,
and to other countries such as Ukraine. Concerning Donetsk, now very much
in the news, Wikipedia has: "In its early period [after 1869], it
received many immigrants from Wales, especially the town of Merthyr Tydfil
<
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merthyr_Tydfil>."
I cannot tell whether the James Shea who married Mary Quirk is your
ancestor. But neither of the difficulties you mention definitely rule him
out. Many Irishmen at that time reported ages that were too low, often by
as much as 15 percent. And many Irishmen were known not only by their own
baptismal names but also by their father's. James Shea's father may have
been known as Michael and as Bartholomew.
Yours is an interesting problem!
Best wishes, Seán (Montreal)
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 5:57 PM, Susan Haines via <glamorgan(a)rootsweb.com>
wrote:
> Is anyone able to look at information on a death certificate? I am
> looking for information about my gr gr grandfather, James Shea. He may
> have died in Dowlais some time between 1865 and 75. He was born about
> 1840-2, so would have been 23- 33. If I don't find him on freebmd, does
> that mean that he probably didn't die? (There is a James Shea who died
> in 1882 at age 37 but I believe he is the one who owned the Bird in the
> Hand and is not my gr gr grandfather - alas).
>
> There is another possibility that he remarried a Mary Quirk, had a
> family and moved to England. But there are problems with this fellow
> being my gr gr grandfather ( he is too young, he gave his father's name
> at marriage as Michael; mine was Bartholomew). They did both have the
> same occupation, that of iron wheeler.
>
> I have asked this before and I apologize.
>
> Sue
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