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This was posted on the other list I belong too. I thought I would just
forward it here and see if any kind soul can give Neil a little direction.
I realize this area might not fit in here, but there is probably somebody
who would know what and where he should go.
Thanks a bunch to everyone who helps out
----- Original Message -----
Sent: November 30, 2001 2:36 PM
Subject: Important Search
> Hi All,
> This message has absolutely no humor in it. In fact it is a desperate
> plea. I need to locate the name of the father of a Detlef Schwartz who
> was born in Wilhelmshaven, Germany on February 7, 1954. I know nothing
> about records in Germany. I have talked to someone at the West Los
> Angeles FHC who has worked with German records and was told that
> government birth records are not released for 120 years, except for some
> or all Jewish records. This person said that church records could be
> searched but didn't know if any from Wilhelmshaven had been filmed. I
> tried http://familysearc.org and think I determined the only church
> records from Wilhelmshaven were for a Catholic church, and 2 Mormon
> stakes. However, I don't use familysearch.org and may not have found the
> correct information. Can some expert verify that records from 1954 are
> not on film, or tell me if they are. If they exist it would be of great
> help if someone who knows how to get and search the films could do this
> for me, maybe even the Catholic records.
> This is a personal matter of great importance to my family. It would
> take too long to explain what is going on except that we are trying to
> find the father of Detlef Schwartz and his second wife. I hate to not
> explain, but it is a complicated situation and I just don't feel up to it
> at this time. I have seen small miracles happen on the List and I
> figured if anyone could help it would be you people.
> Please send any data to me OFF THE LIST.
> Neil, not Kneel, to show I am serious.
> GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
> Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
> Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
> ==== NORWAY Mailing List ====
> Learn how to of Norwegian research by reading Niels Newbie Notes
> at the Norwaylist website
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Surnames: Kreidler of Oberamt Horb
Message Board URL:
Message Board Post:
Does anyone know if this place exists? I am researching the family name of Kreidler. Specifically Lorenz(Lorentz) Kreidler, his parents were John & Marie Kreidler. He was born in about 1826, & emmigrated in about 1850 to WI. Have this info from his obit. Don't know if the town is spelled correct. Does it soun familiar to anyone???
I have received a number of inquiries about how to buy the LDS $5 home
version of the FHC Library CD. It can be purchased on the Internet.
The home CD is the March 2000 version of the catalog and it contains more
films under many of the titles than the older version still in use in many
The Internet version of catalog is the September 2000 version which would
indicate that it contains more films than found on the home version. However
the Internet version of the catalog is locality-based which makes it somewhat
difficult to search. If you don't know the name of the place that had the
parish church for your village you have to search every place name for places
nearby and look at the film details to see which one might name your village
Most of the 2664 military records film titles do not include a place name
(some field hospitals have place names associated with the military
churchbooks - death records - there) so you have to know the author or title
of the film you want in order to find them. You also have to be able to
spell the author or title correctly in German - umlauts are not required.
Sometimes you can pick out authors and titles that might work by using the
index links on the "place name home page" and studying the display. But you
may have to go through a LOT of titles in German in order to find the best
ones. It takes patience, persistence and crossed fingers in hopes that you
are not bumped off line at the moment you have found something.
If you have the home CD you can study the catalog at your leisure with
keyword searches that simplify finding film numbers and then go to the
Internet with a film number or an author and title you have found just to see
if the film details there have more films listed (usually including more
years) than are found on the home CD.
Never pass up looking at all the details on a title of interest on the home
CD or on the Internet just because the years in the title do not seem to
include the years you want. Film details will often show additional years.
To buy the CD on line:
Log onto the site: http://www.ldscatalog.com/
Click on Individual shopper
Click on the word "Search" on upper right of screen.
Type the number: 50081 in the space provided.
You will get a description of the CD with the option to order it.
There will be a conference of the combined East European genealogy
associations in Regina, Saskatchewan (about 165 miles north of Minot, ND) in
Those joining in presenting the conference include the FEEFHs, SGS, and EEGS,
(Bohemia, Moravia, Hungary, Slovakia) as well as individual associations for
Poland and Vohlnya (Canadian sggee), Galicia, Bukowina and Germans from
The conference program will not be published until next year but there is
preliminary information on dates, participants and costs at:
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Message Board URL:
Message Board Post:
Searching for the marriage date and death date of Anna (Pekny) Morgan born circa 1853 Bohemia, came with her family to McHenry County IL about 1865, married --- Morgan circa 1873. Was residing in St. Paul, MN in 1890, according to her father's will. She was the daughter of Frantisek and Barbara (Strnad) Pekny.
Hier jetzt ein paar Triebitzer aus meiner direkten Linie...
Amalia Meitner,geb.Rotter geb.:3.2.1878 in Triebitz 24;
Eduard(?) Rotter geb am 17.11.1855 in Triebitz 56;
Genovefa(?) Rotter, geb.Zorn, geb.:8.7.1855 in Triebitz;
Prokopp Rotter, Theresia Rotter(geb.Neugebauer), Johann Zorn und Barbara
Zorn(geb.Müller) waren deren Vorfahren.
(?)= rel.unleserlich, da nur handschriftlich erhalten
There are currently 450 subscribers to GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L and 184
subscribers to GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-D.
Information about the list is available at
includes information on unsubscribing and a link to the list archives.
If you haven't already visited the German-Bohemian Heritage Society
web site, you should. Go to http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/. You will
find information about the Society, the new Library, publications,
and resources for research.
German-Bohemian List Admin
I saw this on a "users group" site ... it might be useful to some
of you ....
"Unknown birth dates can be estimated by using known birth dates of
other family members.
This is the formula that professional genealogists use to estimate
birth dates for when you don't know the birth date.
Precede estimated birth year with "Abt or Est"
Estimate the father's birth year by: subtracting 26 years from birth
year of first child. .... OR subtracting 4 years from birth year of
wife .... OR by subtracting 25 years from marriage year.
Estimate the mother's birth year by: subtracting 22 years from birth
year of first child .... OR adding 4 years to birth year of husband
... OR by subtracting 21 years from marriage year
Estimate birth year of other children by: adding 2 years to birth year
of previous child
If birth date of child is unknown:
Add 25 years to birth year of father ... OR 22 years to birth year of
(List Admin. for)
Brown County, MN Mail List ... MNBROWN-L(a)rootsweb.com
Researching surnames: SCHWEISS .. MEIER .. SCHMITT/SCHMIDT ..
STADTHER(R) .. MEHLTRATER
My Genealogy Site:
Die Familie meiner Schwiegermutter ( HONDL - HUDETZ - HAMELE - MORAFKA ) kommt aus
dem Ort Triebitz Kreis Landskron.
Gibt es hier vielleicht Verbindungen ?
> Thomigsdorf (heutzutage Damnikov) ist ein kleiner Ort einige km
> suedwestlich von Landskron im Schoenhengstgau, der sich ueber Ostboehmen
> und Nordmaehren erstreckt.
> Meine Ahnen lebten fuer mindestens 300 Jahre in Landskron und Umgebung
> und daher wuerde es mich nicht wundern, wenn sie mit den Ihren irgendwie
> verschwaegert gewesen waeren. Ich besuchte fuer kurze Zeit in 1944 das
> Landskroner Gymnasium and ich glaube, mich ganz dunkel daran erinnern zu
> koennen, dass der Klassenerste, den jeder bewunderte und sehr
> respektierte, auch Meitner hiess.
Hallo, Ralph -
Thomigsdorf (heutzutage Damnikov) ist ein kleiner Ort einige km
suedwestlich von Landskron im Schoenhengstgau, der sich ueber Ostboehmen
und Nordmaehren erstreckt.
Meine Ahnen lebten fuer mindestens 300 Jahre in Landskron und Umgebung
und daher wuerde es mich nicht wundern, wenn sie mit den Ihren irgendwie
verschwaegert gewesen waeren. Ich besuchte fuer kurze Zeit in 1944 das
Landskroner Gymnasium and ich glaube, mich ganz dunkel daran erinnern zu
koennen, dass der Klassenerste, den jeder bewunderte und sehr
respektierte, auch Meitner hiess.
Gruesse aus Kanada
Elfriede Steiner Grillmair
Ralph Meitner by way of Paula Goblirsch wrote:
> Moin, moin from Hamburg!
> Can anyone tell me, where is the little village Thomingsdorf?
> Hallo aus Hamburg!
> Kann mir irgendjemand sagen, wo sich das kleine Dorf Thomingsdorf befindet?
> Maybe in the North of Moravia-
> Vielleicht im Norden Mährens- Vielen Dank Ralph Meitner!
> family.com meitner-site
> ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ====
> Forgotten how to UNSUBSCRIBE?
> Visit http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/mailinglist.html
Moin, moin from Hamburg!
Can anyone tell me, where is the little village Thomingsdorf?
Hallo aus Hamburg!
Kann mir irgendjemand sagen, wo sich das kleine Dorf Thomingsdorf befindet?
Maybe in the North of Moravia-
Vielleicht im Norden Mährens- Vielen Dank Ralph Meitner!
To Tim Janchowski,
If you wish to find the parish records for your families, I am happy to
append the information below.
Vernerice (German name Wernstadt) kept its records right there in Vernerice.
They are stored in the Litomerice Archives and begin in 1669. The judicial
district for Vernerice was in Decin.
Litomerice (German name Leitmeritz) kept its records in Litomerice. They are
stored in the Litomerice dekanstvi (Deanery) Archives and begin in 1626. The
judicial district was also in Litomerice.
Some records were also kept in the Litomerice Dom archives and begin in 1655.
This information is found in Felix Gundacker's books: Dictionary of Bohemian
Parishes in the Czech Republic, and the Register of Vital Statistics in the
Czech State Archives for Bohemia, part 1.
For further information, including the address of the archives, please go to
Mr. Gundacker's web site at <http://ihff.nwy.at/index.htm>. If you need
professional help, please contact Mr.Gundacker at <IHFF(a)netway.at>.
The very best of luck in your research!
I now have Karl Brandstadter of Newark NJ picking up his brother Gustov (my
grandfather) at NY . passage was paid by Fother Frank Brandstatter of Newark
NJ.mother of Gustov and Karl Magdalena Brandtadter was in "Kernlen
Stcuermark W?e Willige sorry the hand righting bad on address"
looking for any info the family.
Ship Manifest ,Brandstadter, Gustov ,Austria, German Bettelkrin, Austria
October 12, 1908 , 25y, M S Rotterdam ,Rotterdam, South Holland, The
----- Original Message -----
Subject: BRANDSTATTER, BRANDSTETTER BRANDSTATTER
> looking for any information or persons who connect with this family. I do
> know that my GGrandfather Business is still in Newark . I know about his
> Business and his family here in the US .I know there were other family
> menbers in Bohemia His first wife and ther children ,My grandfather was
>from the first family.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Surnames: Polansky, Webster, Wagner
Message Board URL:
Message Board Post:
These, my great grandparents arrived in Minnesota through NYand were farmers.Names of the children who came with them: Anna(later Mrs.Webster), George, Sophia, Mary(later Mrs.Wagner), and John. A son Mike had preceeded them. I believe they lived out their lives in America in Pennington county, MN. Anna died in Thief River Falls in 1922 and is buried in the Catholic cemetery. Anyone with information please contact me at jcareypearce(a)shaw.ca
In a message dated 11/21/2001 11:05:41 AM Mountain Standard Time,
> gr-grandfather and his
> brothers served in the military and were from just outside Pilsen (Mantau).
They were most likely in IR 35 - at least that is a good place to start.
Check Jaeger Battalion 5 if you don't find them in IR 35. If you have no
luck there check the Cavalry that was recruited there - it might be the 6th
Dragoon (light cav) regiment.
> I have not yet gotten to the point of researching that service; I only know
> (via so-far unsubstantiated family stories) that he served in Crimea and was
> in "one of the very famous battles."
Are you talking about WW I or an earlier war? During the notorious Crimean
war of the 1850s (1853??) Austria merely observed while everyone else shot at
each other -- it made those who expected Austria to side with them pretty
angry. Problem was that both sides, the Brits and the Russians expected
Austria's help. It was a lose-lose situation. But a large contingent of
Austrian troops did move down the Danube a ways just in case they needed to
jump into the fray. They never did. Soldiers returning from the Crimea
spread Cholera wherever they went.
I don't know if there were any famous battles in the Crimea other than during
WW I and the "Crimean War." If the time frames of those wars don't work for
you then the family story about the Crimea must mean something else....
> I'm still in the "names and dates" stage of the research, so the more
> interesting investigations and questions such as why my ancestors left
> Bohemia in the 1860s (could their being Catholic have had something to do
> with it?)
Religion was not incentive to leave in the 1860s. Bohemia was predominantly
Catholic then and the parish church was the center of much of the social life
of the majority of people. If anything, they faced losing a lot of the
religious quality of life they enjoyed in Bohemia when they emigrated.
The 1860s started out with several years of crop failures and an economic
depression along with inflation that caused a lot of farmers to lose their
farms to money lenders. Since those lenders were often Jewish the people
blamed all their problems on the Jews and there were pogroms in Pilsen,
Prague and elsewhere. Rinderpest also struck the livestock herds at the same
time. To top it off there was political unrest among nationalist and
anti-empire groups. The Kaiser was actually relieved when Austria went to
war in Denmark in 1864 because the war at least fostered unity among his
subjects. That war was short and the fruits of victory were short-lived when
Prussia and Austria began squabbling about the autonomy of Scheswig and
Holstein. Prussia occupied both provinces and Austria declared war on
Prussia. That war was extremely bloody and the Typhus and Cholera epidemic
it bred took as many lives -- maybe even more -- as war wounds.
To top it off, when Prussia won the war of 1866 they sent small groups of
soldiers to every district in much of the Austrian empire to collect that
district's share of the war reparations that Austria had to pay. Back then
the loser of a war always had to pay the winner reparations (Emperor Franz
Josef is said to have wished for a "good war" that would unify the people and
end by filling his nearly bankrupt treasury). The pro-rata share given a
district was then shared out among all the communities in the district like a
"war tax." The "tax" had to be paid very quickly and could take a large part
of the cash reserves from a community, putting many people in debt.
IR 35- the Pilsen regiment lost at least half its strength during that war.
Wawro writes about how nearly 800 men of one battalion got stuck in a swamp
during the nighttime retreat from Gitschin and were taken prisoner. That war
was on the heels of another disaster at Solferino in Italy in 1859 when the
same regiment had almost 50% casualties.
..>>and why my gr. grandfather came to chose the small town of New
> Washington in NW Ohio when his sisters all went to New Zealand
Most immigrants came to a place where they knew someone. A local parish
centennial book or town centennial book might tell where most of the 19th C.
settlers came from. People also often took up residence near their old
acquaintances. Look at the 1870 US census for the place he settled and see
where his neighbors came from.
There are some members of the German-Bohemian list who live in New Zealand.
You should post a question there about what attracted settlers to New Zealand
in the 1860s. It is very possible that his sisters went there because men
who promised marriage were already there or were traveling to New Zealand at
that same time.
I am sending this reply to an off-list question because it may be of interest
to other list members.
Men born in 1847 would have been inducted into the Austrian army in 1867
unless they volunteered during the callup for mobilization for the war in
1866. A lot of men volunteered at that time.
The Infantry Regiment recruited around Pisek was IR 11. However your photo
makes me pretty confident he was a Jaeger, not a regular infantryman.
I don't know which Jaeger (Jäger) Battalion was attached to IR 11 at that
time. You might be able to find that in a Militar Schematismus for 1860-1870
at the LDS FHC. You may also find that in a history of Infantry Regiment 11
if you can get copies of the pages covering the years 1866-1870 from the war
archive. You should not have too much trouble getting them translated if you
can't read German.
There are some individual soldiers records for IR 11 through 1869 at the LDS.
If he was inducted into IR 11 and then transferred to the Jaegers there
would be a record for him in IR 11 that says when he transferred. Search all
the records for the year following his 20th birthday.
If he was inducted directly into the Jaegers you would have to have the
battalion number in order to find a record. I know Jäger bat. 5 was at
Pilsen (IR 35) and 6 was at Eger (IR 73). In 1854 Battalions 6 and 18 were
recruited in the Neuhaus district which is in the same district as IR 11. So
JB 18 might be one to check. However, in 1860 the number of regiments
increased changing the borders of recruiting districts and also the number of
JB recruited. So your ggdad could be in a JB with a number higher than 18.
Unfortunately the LDS film title for JB 18 says they only have records
through 1860. However, when you look at the film details there are books
(Heft) of records that do not have a year date on them. It has been my
experience that the titles of films do not always match the actual data
available -- there will be later years than the title indicates. In the
case of JB 18 it would be worth it to get the film that does not have any
years in the title just to check if it includes years later than 1860. The
same would be true for any JB you would want to check out.
If you find that he volunteered in 1866 you can get good information about
IR 11 in the war of 1866 should be in Geoff Wawro's "The Austro-Prussian War"
and you can assume that wherever IR 11 fought, so did the Jäger battalion.
Wawro's book is the only history of that war written from the Austrian
There is also a Prussian General Staff Report on that war in English. It was
published by Battery Press and may be in some US Libraries and available for
interlibrary loan. I would guess that IR 11 served in the same army corps as
my ggdad's IR 35 (Pilsen regiment). That corps, headquartered in Prague, was
in the army group commanded by Count Clam-Gallas and the Prince of Saxony.
They fought the Prussians along the Iser (I think) river south of Liberc
(Reichenberg). There was a fight at Podol, one at Munchengratz and one at
Gitschin -- all of which got pretty bloody. I recall that one Jaeger
battalion took a lot of casualties in an evening fight in a forest before the
battle at Munchengratz. Another one was really "wasted" in an assault on a
Prussian position at the very end of the battle of Koeniggraetz.
Gordon Craig's book, "The Battle of Königgrätz" is another English history of
that war but it is more from the Prussian perspective.
You probably can buy Wawro's book. It was $59 when first published. If it
has been "remaindered" by the publisher it may be available at a deep
discount from someone like Amazon.com. If you want Wawro to autograph it I
can provide an Email address for him -- he is a prof. at a university in
If you get Wawro's book by ILL or purchase, there may be an Order of Battle
(OB) in it that describes which Austrian regiments were in which army group.
I believe there is also one in the Prussian General Staff report. I got the
PGS report and found that at Munchengratz my ggdad's IR 35 was facing the
Prussian IR 19 from Posen. I had another ancestor in the Prussian regiment
-- my two ancestors were shooting at each other!!
Hi Ray, The document is an Identity Card, a certificate off belonging to a
given community. The printing and script would be Gothic/Old German. The
translation is as follows,
Land - County this could be Bo"hmen , Bohemia.
Political District - Bezirk
Heimat Schein - Certificate of Nativity. (i.e. Identity)
The Municipality Certifies that,
Name - Name
Character or Profession
Age ( born in 1831)
Status - Married (Verheirated)
is a member of this Municipality.
Seewiesen, 31 (Month) 1880
Certified signature of person.
for the Municipality - Official Signature
Kingdom and Empire of Austria, Municipality of Seewiesen.
I hope this makes sense, But " Heimat " or Heimat Land ,is difficult to
translate into Englisch, it actually means ' Homeland '. Herb Schwarz ,
From: Ray Hilgart <rhilgart(a)citizen.infi.net>
To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L(a)rootsweb.com <GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 8:04 PM
Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Request for Help in Identifying a Form
>Can anyone identify for me the purpose of the form containing the line
>headings cited below. The right side of the form is German; the left
>side in Czech (or the Böhmisch). It would not appear to be a birth,
>death or marriage certificate. If not, then what?
>The printed line headings are all in the old German style printing and
>difficult to decipher in some cases. Sorry, I don't know what this type
>of printing is called.
>Note that the entries in brackets [ ] are handwritten responses to the
>Also note the abbreviation "crths" within the brackets is my entry and
>means "cannot read the handwritten script"
>Also, would anyone be willing to help in translating the handwritten
>script?? I would mail the form with a return stamped envelope.
>Thanks. Ray Hilgart
>Politischer Bezirk [crths][P.N. 7b]
>HEIMAT - ??? (This is a header title partly masked by fee stamps)
>Womit von der Gemeinde bestätigt wird, daß [crths]
>Name [Ignatz Denk]
>Charakter oder Beschäftigung [crths]
>Alter [1831 geboren]
>Stand (ledig oder verheiratet) [verheiratet]
>in dieser Gemeinde daß heimatrecht besißt [crths]
>[Seewiesen] den [31 ???? 1880]
>Eigenhändige Unterschrift der Partei: (blank - No signature here)
>für die Gemeinde [officials signature crths]
>Following is contained within a circular official seal:
>==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ====
Can anyone identify for me the purpose of the form containing the line
headings cited below. The right side of the form is German; the left
side in Czech (or the Böhmisch). It would not appear to be a birth,
death or marriage certificate. If not, then what?
The printed line headings are all in the old German style printing and
difficult to decipher in some cases. Sorry, I don't know what this type
of printing is called.
Note that the entries in brackets [ ] are handwritten responses to the
Also note the abbreviation "crths" within the brackets is my entry and
means "cannot read the handwritten script"
Also, would anyone be willing to help in translating the handwritten
script?? I would mail the form with a return stamped envelope.
Thanks. Ray Hilgart
Politischer Bezirk [crths][P.N. 7b]
HEIMAT - ??? (This is a header title partly masked by fee stamps)
Womit von der Gemeinde bestätigt wird, daß [crths]
Name [Ignatz Denk]
Charakter oder Beschäftigung [crths]
Alter [1831 geboren]
Stand (ledig oder verheiratet) [verheiratet]
in dieser Gemeinde daß heimatrecht besißt [crths]
[Seewiesen] den [31 ???? 1880]
Eigenhändige Unterschrift der Partei: (blank - No signature here)
für die Gemeinde [officials signature crths]
Following is contained within a circular official seal:
If you are running Windows 95 or 98, take notice that developers of software
programs like OCR and translation, or photo programs will no longer get
support from Microsoft for versions of their programs that were designed to
run with older Windows versions. Microsoft will support program development
only for the latest versions of windows -- Win ME, Win 2000, latest Win NT
and Win XP. ME, 2000, and older NT will be supported only for a year or so.
I have already learned that my old Adobe Photoshop 3.0 will not run on
I have tried to install a downloaded patch that is supposed to make it work
but so far have had no success, am reluctant to buy the latest version of
Adobe because I don't know if that one will work without the patch, either.
Eastman's Genealogy Newsletter has published the following notice about
"Buried deep in the Windows XP announcements you can find a note
that Microsoft will cease to provide support for MS DOS, Windows
3.xx, and Windows NT 3.5x in December, 2001. At the same time,
support will become limited for Windows 95. In June 2002,
Microsoft will cease to provide full support for Windows 98 and
Windows NT version 4.0. This will leave the overwhelming majority
of current Windows users without operating system support.
Only Windows ME, Windows 2000 and Windows XP will be supported (for a while).
Microsoft has moved to a standard 3-year product lifecycle now.
That's all that anyone can expect to get by way of formal support
from Microsoft for all their products. The company will offer
limited "extended support" ( i.e., costing money) available another year.
Similar policies have been implemented (or will soon be implemented) on
Microsoft Word, Excel, PowerPoint, Money, Flight Simulator and
hundreds of other programs produced by the company. If you want to
see when Microsoft will pull the plug on support for your
software, look at
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycleconsumer.asp and at