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I am new to this area German-Bohemian rootsweb. I looked on my Bavaria map,
and didn't find that town.
You might try the German chat on AOL ON Wed evening 10 p.m. eastern std time.
in the Golden Gate room
My surname that I am researching is OEHMIG.
Something all amateur genealogists should consider when making searches in
records dating back into the 18th century:
A shareware program called "Calendar Explorer." Version 1.86
Calendar Explorer is a 32-bit program for Windows 95 and Windows
NT 4.0; it will not work on earlier versions, is a "calendar
utility" with many applications. An application specific to genealogy is
conversions between Gregorian dates and Julian Dates.
A christening date from a church register entry -- 2 Dec. 1735 -- which is
thought to be a Julian date is converted by the program to Dec. 13, 1735 in
today's Gregorian calendar.
The Julian Calendar was introduced by Julius Caesar
in 45 B.C. It served well but had a minor inaccuracy. By the year 1583
the Spring Equinox had drifted by ten days. Pope Gregory XIII ordered
a new calendar which was not widely adopted in western Europe and
North America until the 1700s. Some countries did not adopt it until
the 1800s, and a few, such as Russia, did not change to the Gregorian
Calendar until early this century. Many records of your ancestors show
dates in the Julian Calendar.
Calendar Explorer version 1.86 can also convert between a Gregorian Date and
equivalent Islamic Civil Calendar date and the Indian Civil date.
Another feature is a Week Day finder that finds the week day for a
given date -- for example, when your birthday will happen on a Monday.
Calendar Explorer also can display the American Secular Holidays.
Additionally, Calendar Explorer will calculate the phases of the moon
for any year, dates in the Western Church Year, the date of both
Eastern and Western Easter through the centuries, and the number days
These calculations help genealogists pinpoint Easter's date which helps to
identify the lenten period during which such things as weddings generally did
not take place.
Reference "tombstone dates" -- such as "Died January 3, 1815 at the age of
75 years, 5 months and 12 days." The better genealogy programs have
calculators that can figure out birth dates from such information, but
Calendar Explorer cannot.
Calendar Explorer will print calendars in B/W or color. It will also save
graphics files which you can later import into word processors or
Calendar Explorer 1.86 is shareware with a $17 registration fee.
CompuServe members may register it online in the Software
Registration section at GO SWREG. On CompuServe's Genealogy Forum Look for
the file name CALEXPLR.ZIP. or look at:
For our Canadian members:
- Family Tree Maker Canadian Edition
Broderbund has released a new "Canadian Edition" of
Family Tree Maker for Windows. It comes with a "Canadian Genealogy Index"
CD-ROM in the box. Otherwise it is no different from the regular version of
Family Tree Maker Deluxe.
The Canadian Genealogy Index disk contains more
than two million records..."is the result of 20 years of research from over
sources (such as city directories, marriage records, birth records,
land records, census records, and more). This collection of names
represents one of the largest indexes to historical Canadian records
You simply enter a surname followed by a comma and then the first name. The
matching names on the CD-ROM appear almost instantly. The French names
even had all the proper diacritical marks and other letters unique to
that language. Once the name is displayed, you can click on an icon to
Broderbund's web page should give more info: http://www.familytreemaker.com/
The product is so new it may take a while before the Canadian edition listed
Looking for current day place name for LAFFELT, BAVARIA, GERMANY.
Horn ancestors immigrated circa 1848 from this area to Seneca Falls, NY,
and to Winneshiek County, IA, abt 1854; may have been German-Bohemians.
Please advise of any information, suggestions for finding this place.
Thanks, Betty Horn
I was born in Deutsch Liebau February 1944, I have been in the United States
since 1970, My mother and my grandparents are all from that area. I am also
looking to find some inforamation on the Gebauer Family, they also lived
inthat area, Seitendorf, any information is greatly appreciated. Thank you
for our trouble. Linde Brittain
I did it again...posted prematurely.
My last message commented on a 14-year service requirement. But that is
incorrect. The soldier in question entered the service in April 1864 and was
obligated to serve until Dec. 1874. The December date seems related to his
December promotion to Corporal and reflects six years from the date of that
During the same period a private was obligated to serve 8 years active duty
with the term based on the date he was inducted. He did not always remain on
active duty the whole eight years.
I am not sure if a private had to serve in the reserves beyond eight years
total service. My ggdad was inducted in 1860 and mustered out into the
reserves as a private in 1867. Until now I had believed that his obligation
was fulfilled as soon as eight years had passed after his induction and he
would have been free to go anywhere by November, 1868. However, there is
family lore that indicates he thought he had to "sneak" out of Bohemia when
he emigrated. This may be because his military obligation was not yet
Does anyone have any definitive information on this subject?
I have received a soldier's Grundbuchblatter from list member, Bill Chapman.
It is especially interesting because it is for a soldier in the 73rd
(Klattau) Regiment which was first established in 1860 and because it is for
a soldier who apparently had to serve right to the end of a prolonged
military obligation of 14 years when his reserve duty was included. The
record shows that he was first an officer's orderly (assigned to care for the
personal needs of a regimental officer - sort of like a personal valet) until
shortly before the Austro Prussian War.
During the July 3 battle of Koeniggraetz he became a Prussian prisoner and
was repatriated the following September. In Nov., 1866 he was promoted to
Lance Corporal -- which is "Gefreiter" in German. I had mistakenly believed
that a "Gefreiter" was the same as "Freiwilliger" or volunteer. I hope
this clears that up.
By 1867 he was a Corporal and in 1868 he was mustered out into IR 73
reserves. There is a note that he is obligated to serve as a reserve,
subject to recall for six years -- until 1874.
I had not found that specific information -- six years in the reserves after
8 years of active duty -- before now. I intend to find out if that applied
to all soldiers or only to non-coms.
A subsequent note indicates that he was transferred to IR 42 (listed in the
1854 Schematismus as headquartered at Teresienstadt) in 1873 but it is
unclear if he was placed back on active duty at that time. In 1874 he
received a "war medal" and on December 31 he was reassigned to the 42nd
"Home Defense Batallion."
My personal interest in Austrian military history ends with 1867 and I have
not studied military events that occurred after that date. But this
particular record merits a little research into what the Austrian army was
doing in 1873 and 1874 that would produce a "war medal" for a Corporal. The
quickest way to get a reply to that question would be a direct letter to the
Kriegsarchiv -- or a FAX -- asking that specific question. I would also ask
for clarification of what IR 42 and the 42nd Home Defense Batallion were --
and where they were located -- if they are the same as the Teresienstadt IR
That is because it seems strange that a man in the reserves would be assigned
to a unit that is not in his home district unless he was actually on "active"
status. The difference between this soldier and another is that he is a
Corporal. That may have been the deciding factor because good non-coms were
hard to come by in the Austrian army of the 1860s.
I want to thank Bill for sending me this record in particular because it is a
relatively "rare" one. Because of my on-going research about what can be
found in the Kriegsarchiv I would like to ask if any other list members have
a Grundbuchblatter or soldier's record they are willing to share with me. I
would like to have as many examples as possible for my October talk on the
subject in Minneapolis. Records from all wars would be helpful -- not just
19th century service.
For those of you who had ancestors who were in the battle of Koeniggraetz,
the general staff reports for the day show that the Prussian army was split
in two and until 3:00 p.m. the Austrians greatly outnumbered the Prussians on
the line. But they did not move to take advantage of that fact and they
failed to protect their right flank where the second Prussian army simply
"ran through" when they arrived around 3:00 o'clock. The result was a
collapse of the entire Austrian line and ultimate defeat.
The Prussians had breech-loading rifles that let them load and fire from the
prone position and also enabled them to fire about twice as rapidly as the
Austrians with their muzzle-loading muskets. At first the Austrians were
quite steadfast and sometimes overwhelmed Prussian positions -- showing
great courage in the face of such fire -- but as the day wore on the high
casualties they took began to take its toll on those where survived. They
began to refuse to obey orders to charge again and again because it was
Officers led these charges and by days end a lot of the Austrian units had no
officers or non-coms left. This added to the confusion and leaderless units
simply began to leave the battlefield.
There were more than 500,000 soldiers on the field that day. The Austrians
lost 29,000 killed or wounded and another 11,000 taken prisoner. The
Prussian losses were much smaller because their tactics did not hold the same
high risk of taking casualties as the Austrian tactics.
A Cholera epidemic had started among soldiers on both sides before the
battle. "Kirchenbucher" -- field hospital records -- document almost as many
deaths from Cholera as from wounds. It was the Cholera in the Prussian ranks
that finally led the Prussians to agree to an armistice when they were on
More web sites:
<< > Check out the Germanic Conference web page:
> Current (temporary) location is: http://www.megamed.com/cgei
> Future (permanent) location is : http://www.germanic.org.
The following is the Max Kade Institute web page. Max Kade is presently
trying to collect personal narratives about German-American immigrants for a
national archive and research library. If you have any "stories," diaries,
or other items you think should be put in such an archive, contact Ruth
Reichmann. She is especially interested in family lore about first families
to arrive in the US.
Also check out our web page: http://www-lib.iupui.edu/kade/
Eberhard and Ruth Reichmann
Max Kade German-American Center
Indiana Univ.-Purdue Univ. Indianapolis
401 East Michigan Street
Indianapolis, IN 46204
317 464-9004 Office
812 988-2866 Home
317 630-0035 FAX
What do i have to do, to unsubscribe I allready sent
but it did not work. What am I doing wrong?
Topic: GBHS Newsletter
Reply to: Bob Liebl liebl(a)execpc.com
>>I was facinated by your stories in this edition. Not only did you hit home
on one of the stories but two. I was wondering if you had anymore
about these people.
The articles I wrote were basically translations of articles in the
Bishofteinetz Heimatbuch and similar sources. I don't always pay attention
to the names and places that pop up when translating such things. I
noticing the Liebl because it was familiar, but it was in my article only
because it was in the original German article in the Heimatbuch. I have no
further research on the name.
I think the name also appears in the "Tax Rolls of l654" book that Bob
Paulson reprints when there are orders for it. I don't know where I
put my copy at the moment or would look it up for you.
>>My great grandfather Johann Nepomuk Liebl was born on Jan 21, 1840 in
Hammerschleif, Schmolau, Bohemia. It is near Heiligen Kreutz. He had an
interesting life as a blacksmith and the town burgermeister. He was also in
the 35th Inf. Reg.
My great grandfather, George Grosam was born in July 1840 in Mariafels
and was also most likely a blacksmith because there was a forge in their
barn at St. George. His uncle was the district "Ortsamtmann." Sort of
like a chief magistrate or burgermeister, too. And Georg was in the
35th starting 1860. But he served through two wars and did not get out
The similarities in their lives is fascinating.
There is a possibility that your ggdad was literate if he was elected
Burgermeister. That is a real plus for the period -- few boys went to
school past the time it took to learn to count their money, figure their
taxes, and write their names. Many did not even learn that if the
nearest school was more than a few kilometers away.
>>I have been trying to find out more about his service record and can't seem
to find the correct archive.
Would you mind sending me copies of the papers that you have? Are you
sure it is only "discharge papers" and not his "Grundbuchblatter?" My
ggdad's discharge was noted on his "Grundbuchblatter" which has very
general information about when and where he served. To know more you have to
know where the regiment was stationed at the time he was in it and
assume that whatever the regiment did, he did it with them.
As far as I can tell from the regimental history (some of it will be in
the next newsletter) they were stationed in Debrecen, Hungary in 1860.
Our ggdads would have gone (marched) first to Pilsen where they would have
outfitted and assembled w/other recruits and then they would have set out
for Debrecen to join the regiment. I don't know if they got any basic
training before leaving Pilsen. If there were no trains available
(Pilsen may have been RR-connected to Prague by 1860) they would have to
march the distance. That could take as much as three months and several
pairs of boots! If trains were available they ended about 40 miles from
Debrecen and they had to march that last distance.
>> He only served a few months and I was wondering why. My dad remembers
he was very proud of his service
Being in the army was a sort of "rite of passage" for young men. It
separated them for those who were still "working for dad" and confirmed
the fact that they were now "MEN!" There was no other way to confirm
that fact in Sudeten society and until a man took a wife he was in a
sort of "limbo" between being a boy and a man. Of course, they were
more or less eager for this "opportunity" depending on whether there was
a war going on.
In general the Bohemian peasants had a real affection for the Kaiser --
the nearest thing to patriotism at the time -- and served more or less
>>>I have his discharge papers. On the papers it says that he was drafted on
27 Nov 1860 for 8 years but he was discharged 5 June 1861. The commander was
I think the commander mentioned was either a batallion or company
commander, not the regimental commander. His name will help you
identify the batallion and company he was in.
As for the reason he was discharged early, there are many possibilities.
The principal one is that the Austrian army was strapped for
money and often "furloughed without pay" (discharged) new recruits after only
18 months to 2 years of training for economic reasons. These men were called
"furlough men" and they were technically still in the army (not subject to
civil authority -- which many used to their advantage) until the full 8 years
of service passed. They were subject to recall at any time that the army
needed them. Most of them simply returned to their homes and lived life
as before. Some took the opportunity to disappear. Others gathered in
cities in unruly gangs that constantly harrassed police who could not
lay a finger on them.
If your ggdad was not recalled when there was a war in Denmark in 1864
or in eastern Bohemia in 1866 then I suspect he was discharged for some
other reason. He may have been sick or failed to pass physical tests.
Sickness was a serious problem in Austrian barracks until about 1870
when new facilities were built. Typhus, Cholera, Asthma, Dysentery,
Tuberculosis and other epidemic diseases would thrive in the crowded and
unsanitary conditions found in older garrisons. Men who lived in quiet
rural districts with little polution and little exposure to outside
"germs" may have looked robust but they did not have the acquired
immunity that a scrawny city-dweller had. They were the first to suffer
and they suffered the worst effects if any disease showed up in their
barracks. Some had to be discharged because of debilitating effects of
sickness. One of the most common causes that was not an infectious
disease was Asthma. It made it impossible for a soldier to make the
long marches with heavy pack that army life required. If your ggdad had
Asthma, there is a very good chance that was the reason he was
He may have had something else...like bad feet that prevented him from
marching. Or bad vision that prevented him from aiming well (although
there was little practice in that anyway).
All military records are kept at the Kriegsarchiv (war archive) in Vienna.
There are lots were filmed by the LDS and they include muster lists
and monthly reports and casualty/sick lists. You may find out more if you
through the records called "Standestabelle" for 1860 -61 for IR 35. Those
monthly reports. With the commander's name you should be able to find the
right pages/batallion and if your ggdad was sick it may be reported there --
the reports contain comments about every soldier who is assigned away from
the rest of the unit -- including those who are in hospital. I will be
giving a talk about using the LDS military records films in October in Mpls.
(Radisson Hotel). The files are massive and finding the right film may take
>>Secondly- The Glassblower story. My dad's other grandfather Georg Herdegen
was forman of the Friedrichshutten Glassworks also. At least that is what
stories say. I think that he would have worked there about 1880-1892. In 92
he came to the US and ended up in Grand Forks, ND only to die there a few
months later. He his buried here in Milwaukee.
I didn't know there was a glass industry in Grand Forks. A lot of
glassblowers ended up in PA and Ohio where there was a substantial glass
>>I had traveled to meet the cousins in GF a few years ago and found that
was a statue of the Blessed Virgin that he had blown up there.
Who are the cousins descended from if he died so soon after getting
there? If his family stayed in GF why was he buried in Milwaukee?
>>The border town where he worked in Bohemia is gone now. Well agian If you
have any info about the factory or my great grandfather I would be most
The only info I have is what I found in the Heimatbuch. However the
German who wrote the article for the book might still be living and
maybe you could get in touch with him. Also, you might look for books
on Bohemian glass making. But you may be out of luck if you don't read
If you have a family chart you should send it to Paula Goblirsch for the
GBHS family database.
Researching the families of Andreas Huttel, Gustave Sulc, and Katrina
from the Pilsen and Jerome areas. Families settled in New Jersey. Wish to
correspond with any of descendents of Andreas
The following may be of interest to list members:
<< To: HABSBURG(a)VM.CC.PURDUE.EDU (Multiple recipients of list HABSBURG)
Your tardy correspondent has now updated his listing of citations and
abstracts for articles of interest in _Slavic Review_. They may be found
at gopher://gopher.ttu.edu:70/11/Pubs/lijpn/HABS/contents/slavrev. Please
note that, since _Slavic Review_'s operations have moved to the University
of Illinois, the full text web archives of six issues for 1994 and 1995
has moved to http://ragnar.econ.uiuc.edu/~slavrev/upenn/postslav.html.
The link on the HABSBURG home page has been updated.
Here is the report for the first two issues of 1996:
Correspondent: Jim Niessen
Volume 55, Number 1 (Spring 1996)
Gale Stokes, John Lampe, and Dennison Rusinow with Julie Mostov, "Instant
History: Understanding the Wars of Yugoslav Succession," 136-60
The review essay surveys a large number of recent English language works
on the prehistory and ongoing history of the fall of Yugoslavia and the
Bosnian conflict. Scholarly and popular accounts employing an historical,
social science, and journalistic approach are discussed.
Volume 55, Number 2 (Summer 1996)
Tom Priestly, "Denial of Ethnic Identity: The Political Manipulation of
Beliefs about Language in Slovene Minority Areas of Austria and Hungary,"
While placing the problem in the context of literature about linguistics
and ethnicity (the Windisch and the Vend theories), the study cites
contemporary and historical accounts on the interwar and World War II era
politics of Austria and Hungary.
Research for an October talk found a book review for:
Austrian Farmers and the Revolution of 1848 by Brigitte Biwald. The book
is in German: Die Revolution von 1848 in der Habsburgemonarchie: Der Bauer
als Ziel politischer politischer Agitation. European University Sudies,
Series III, History and Allied Studies, vol 685, Frankfurt am Main: Peter
First written as "Diplomarbeit" at Uni. Vienna under supervision of Prof.
The review is in English and appeared in HABSBURG list reviews, 1996, nr. 35.
Notes from the review:
The 'Bauernbefreiung" is seen as the most significant consequence of the
revolution of 1848. On Sept 7, 1848 Austrian farmers were freed from
obligations for compulsory labor (Robot) and tithes (Zehent). The rebellion
also brought an end to the judicial and administrative authority of the
landed aristocracy and replaced it with imperial bureaucracy.
Under the new system the economic "winners" were those who invested in modern
farming methods and related industries. Elimination of feudal inefficiencies
gave them the opportunity to modernize and expand operations. Peasant farmes
with larger land holdings were able to profit from these opportunites. But
landlords who "lacked vision or were crippled by debt found it difficult to
adjust to the new system, as did many small farmers and landless cottagers."
"...chapters focus on the situation of Austrian farmers before 1848, the
outbreak of the 1848 Revolution, the events of May 1848 and their impact on
farmers, the situation in Bohemia and Galicia, propaganda for and against the
farmers, imperial decrees, deliberations in provincial assemblies, the role
of the Catholic Church, the farm problem in the "Reichstag", the events of
autumn 1848, the press and the liberation of the farmers, and the legends
surrounding the activities of Hans Kudlich, the "hero" of the
The author notes difficulties in such research...common to European societies
before the 20th century. There is a lack of written records for the common
people and in Austria much of that sort of documentation was destroyed in a
1927 fire at the Vienna Palace of Justice. (!!! - May include land records
!!!) Newspapers, pamphlets, handbills and other such accounts are the
pricipal sources for this book. Police reports and petitions to the
Reichstag from Bohemian farmers still held in archives were also used.
The author ... illustrates the extraordinary diversity and complexity of the
farm problem ... in Galicia and Bohemia before 1848. The "bitter legacy" of
the Polish farmers uprising against the nobility in 1846 created continuing
social tensions that were further exacerbated by growing nationalism among
the Ruthenians living in Galicia. In Bohemia the differences between Czechs
and Germans made issues more complex. But overall, the main obstacle to
reform was Vienna's unwillingness to allow any autonomous action in the
The author concludes that 1848 was the Austrian farmers' first success at
bringing their problems before the public. It was not simply forced babor
and payments to noble and clerical landowners at issue but "emancipation of
an entire social class." (p.121). [Before 1848 any complaint a farmer had
was adjudicated by representatives of his noble landlord -- thus complaints
against the lord were often dismissed without resolution.]
The widespread publicity given farm issues still did not produce a unified
movment among farmers or create any sort of solidarity with workers or
students. But it did make the Reichstag understand that farmers had to be
freed from obligations that were "hated, onerous, and outdated." The author
finds it ironic that most farmers credited the emperor with their liberation,
not their representatives in the Reichstag.
Hans Kudlich, a representative from Silesia, called for the liberation of
farmers on July 26, 1848. A legend surrounds Kudlich which includes
celebration of his heroic deeds among German-American groups in the U.S. (???
Does anyone know what this is about???) His story was even used by Nazi
propagandists! The author says that overall his contribution was really
quite modest and the legend surrounding him was largely created by extremist
groups later on.
The book is poorly organized and repetitious and contains many quotations
(perhaps too many) which make the overall thread difficult to follow. It is
also badly printed and some words run together but it is still rewarding
reading for those who persevere per the reviewer.
Mixa, Vojtech ,Jan and Josefa (Budkov and Strunkovice nad Blanici)
Kabelik, Barbora m. Vojtech Mixa. Lived in Doubrava and Budkov
Predota, Vojtech and Josefa. Lived in Lhote Chocholate and Strunkovice nad
Micka, Marie m. Vojtech Predota. Born in Budkov, later moved to Lhote
I'm sorry to post this to the whole group, but need a piece of information.
I will be out of town for a few days, and would like either to postpone my
mail or unsubsubscribe. When I look for the information sheet I received on
subscribing, I can't find it.
Can anyone send me the instructions to postpone or unsubscribe, please?
I'm looking for information on the Families of Philip Haider, parents
were John Haider and Anna Dums possibly from Hammern, Bohemia. Philip
and his wife Tekla (Buchinger) emmigrated in 1881 to Northern Wisc. I
am looking for possible siblings and any other information.