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This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Classification: Query
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/45.47.154.1.2.1
Message Board Post:
Hello Jim
Thank you for clearing that up. I will recheck me sources and erase the fathers until I am more certain.
Enjoy your trip.
Kimberly
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Surnames: Clutter/Clattre/Klotter/Kloder/Clutters
Classification: Query
Message Board URL:
http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/239.2.1.1
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Hi Bill,
I have no proof of this date, but I show John Paul, son of Casper being born 12 Dec 1721, in Reading twp, NJ. Is this a possible accurate dob?
Kimberly Rutledge
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Interesting possibility. I'll certainly agree that William (1752) was father of John T., as the pension application of William clearly indicates. But where is the evidence of this John (1715)? I have never seen a record of such a person. The John, son of Casper, was clearly a minor when Casper made his will (dated 25 July 1748), so he was not born as early as 1715.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/239.2
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father of john t is william 1752 nj. his father is john 1715 nj. his father is casper
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/45.47.154.1.2
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Hi Kimberly,
I think that you have made the same mistake that many have done which is to confuse the two Samuels that lived about the same time in slightly different regions. The one that you are referring to was married to Rachel Denman not Hester Workman. While my Samuel was born in New Jersey in 1772 he died in Hocking County, Ohio, Perry Twp. on Nov. 1 or 2. I think they are both buried in the Brown Cemetary. Scanning through the rest of your information except for Samuel you seem to have things correct. I can find no record of a Templeton Clutter in any of my Aunts papers that I have. She no longer has her files but donated them to the Mercer County Library in Celina, Oh. I am planning on going there in the near future to go over them and see what else is in there that I do not have.
Jim
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/45.47.154.1.1
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No, sorry.
The Samuel CLUTTER who died in Knox Co OH married Rachel DENMAN in 1796 in Morris Co NJ (per record at the NJ Archives). She was his wife throughout the remainder of his life and is buried beside him at the Owl Creek Cemetery in Morgan Township. In my youth I attended the church across the road and have seen their graves many times. Rachel survived him by three years and was named as his wife in his will at Mount Vernon OH. I have reviewed the original paperwork for his estate, deeds, and the many, many letters written to and by family members in the 1920's.
Please alter your records to reflect the correct Samuel. The Samuel who married Hester WORKMAN is the one referred to by Jim FRENCH in his recent postings. This Samuel has been researched by Janet FRENCH, Mrs S. Paul Essex, and Miss Gladys INGRAM, all descendants of that line.
Bill Hampshire
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Surnames: Clutter/Clattre/Klotter/Kloder/Clutters, Rutledge, Birch, Smith
Classification: Query
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/45.47.154.1
Message Board Post:
I have some information on the Clutter/Workman family.
Samuel b. 1772, Morristown, Morris Co., NJ; d. 5 Dec 1852 Morgan Twp, Knox Co. OH; Burial Owl Creek Cem, Knox Co. OH
Hester Workman b. Allegany Co., Maryland; d. Nov 1854, Good Hope Twp., Hocking Co., OH bur. Brwon Cem (?) Good Hope Twp; Parents Stephen Workman Sr. and Hester Critchfield
Children
John b. 29 Jan 1794 WV; d. 29 Jan 1873 Good Hope Twp., Hocking Co., OH
Margareta b. 23 jan 1797 WV; d. 17 Sep 1867 md. Jonathan Crane Sr. 2 Jul 1793; this union had 10 children
Stephen; b. 1799 WV, d. 25 Feb 1878 Hopewell Twp., Mercer Co., OH; md. Sarah Tester 1800
Benjamin; b 1801 WV; md Mary Ann Didener 1802
Hester; b. Dec 1805 WV; d. 18 Sep 1764 Perry Twp. Hocking Co. OH md. Henry Goss 8 Apr 1797
Amos; b. 1808 WV; md. Charlotte Huggins 1810 2nd mar. to Sarah Tompkins
Priscella; b. Jun 1813 WV; d. 15 Apr. 1882 VanWert Co., OH; md. George Goss 15 Feb 1806
Sameul; b. 1816 WV; md. Mary Ann Gonder 9 Mar 1843; they had 3 children
Nancy; b. 17 Jun 1817 Hampshire Co. WV; d. 31 Jan 1898 Hocking Co. OH
Mary; b. 15 Apr 1823 Fairfield Co., OH; d. 4 Apr 1894 Hocking Co. OH; md. Nathan Brown 1820
Hope this helps. I would be most interested if your aunt or yourself has information on Templeton Clutter my ggg grandfather
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/UOJ.2ACIB/45.124.1.2
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Hello James..and welcome back to the wacky world of genealogy.As we all know, it would take Bible records,wills,birth and death records for each and every generation,without exception,in order to prove ones lineage.But thats in a perfect world.Since we dont live in a perfect world..we must rely on our wit,logic and the process of elimination to draw us closer to those that COULD BE our ancestors.For example, I have 5 sons for Paulus,son of Casper...they are Caspar,Paul jr,Peter,William and Abraham.Since Samuel I was born in 1772...we can eliminate Abraham as his father..as Abraham was born in 1770 according to the census.William was born 28 Nov.1752, and though its possible that he could be Samuels father...at that young age...most likely not.Then there are "locations".(Paul Jr.went to Ky.and had family there,that later removed to Warrick Co.In.)So on and so on..until we are left with a few possible candidates,rather than many.I would love to know your Aunts thoughts and the!
ories in regards to why she felt Peter was Samuels father.If you speak with her in this regard..could you share that with us? It would be most interesting..and probably enlightening.Isnt it great to live in a country that even though we have no proof...we're still entitled to hold our own thoughts,opinions and theories?Deb
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Thanks Bill for your prompt response. You have given me one piece of information about Berkenau, Germany as the origin point of the Clutters. I do not find any reference to this in Janet's writings but will question her about it the next time I talk to her. Maybe she has somethings hidden away that she did not give me. I knonw that she decided to limit herself to Samuel "I" as begining? ending? point. She did give Gladys Ingram credit for what had been done but I did not know her last name and so did not use her name in the original. Thanks for this information also.
Jim
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Jim,
I worked with your Aunt Janet and Faye Essex, but mostly with their cousin Gladys Ingram of Stillwater OK. Gladys and I, in fact, sponsored the work by Hank Jones that identified Birkenau GERMANY as the origin point for the CLUTTERs. In fact, I can first-hand vouch for the fact that Janet, Faye, and Gladys turned over every rock that they could searching for evidence of your Samuel "I'"s parentage. It's just not that simple. They were all indefatiguable letter writers (before the Internet), but even then they could not crack it.
The CLUTTERs were into western PA/VA very early, kinda before the records caught up to them. It is extremely difficult to find evidence and it is hardly ever the evidence we would like to see. I certainly wish they had had better luck for all of us, but it ain't so.
I'd be very interested in any info you care to share from your Aunt's work, even though I am descended from the "other" Samuel (married Rachel DENMAN).
Bill Hampshire
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/45.47.154
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Shirley - Sorry to be so slow in responding, but it has only been 4 years. Yes I am interested in what you have prior to who we call Samuel I, married to Hester Workman. Janet Clutter French, my Aunt, did the work on this line and got that far. She gave me a copy of what she had done and I decided to see what I could find on the web as she had no access to a computer. You may contact me at jrfrench(a)toast.net.
Thanks - Jim
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Deb et. al., My Aunt, Janet Clutter French and our cousin Faye Essex, have done extensive research on the Clutter line and have definely gone back to who we call Samuel I, married to Hester. They also felt, although having no proof, that Peter, the son of Paulus, was the father of Samuel.
Janet did not have access to a computer and has given me a copy of all of her work and I did write to this web site back in 2000; however, My wife died shortly there after and I got interested in other things and did not follow through. I hope to do better in the future.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Classification: Query
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/104.113.2
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there no clutter buired in lanagan she my ggaunt 14178456474 phone no.
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/127.136.156.2
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my ggggf. was john t pa 1794 pa. his father was william and his father was john and his father was casper my john t. wife was catherine ever john had a william ever william had a john
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/240
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i live 4miles for lanagan i have founf no clutter there died or alive there are two in anderson my grandfather and dad paul a clutterand paul clutter jr.both decest andrew j is my gggr and i cant find none of his kid buired here my ggrandfather paul andrew clutter was kill in col. not lanagan nor is his bro. or sister buired in lanagan
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mary a keigley father samuell l. keigley mother mary .templeton and martin and anddrew married sister
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Surnames: Samuel Clutter
Classification: Query
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/UOJ.2ACIB/45.124
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There is SO much confusion between the Samuel Clutter that married Hester Workman,and the Samuel Clutter that married Rachel Denman.Apparently from the scuttlebutt on this site..the Sam that married Rachel had a father named William,son of Casper.The "other" Samuel,originally from Monongalia Co.Va., that married Hester is often over looked as far as his paternity goes.Or worse...mixed up with Williams son.I have a sneakin' suspicion(thats all) that he is the son of Peter Clutter,son of Paulus.At one time or another...Paul Sr had his sons Abraham,Peter and Paul Jr in Monongalia County Virginia...according to tax lists and land records there.Much later...Abraham and Peter(died abt 1813) moved back to Pa. and Paul jr went to Ky and died there about 1812.So its VERY possible the Sam that married Hester was descended from one of these fellas and not William.Much research needs to be done on these lines as information is quite scarce,and I believe that the "big picture" would be m!
uch clearer if we had more info on these neglected lines. Does anyone have any information that they would share in regards to this theory? Deb
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Surnames: Clutter/Clattre/Klotter/Kloder/Clutters
Classification: Query
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http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/UOJ.2ACIB/189.1
Message Board Post:
Hopefully Jen will not mind me passing on this website.
"Jen's Corner" has many Clutter names and links to Casper Clutter and Jan Van Etten. You may find what your looking for there.
http://www.baileypages.net/JensCorner/Surnames/clutter.htm
Kimberly
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Sure, that would be great. You can email me at lunasees(a)earthlink.net.
Thanks Tara
Kimberly