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Was just wondering if there are any entries in the IGI regarding the Eloyes
name?
Tom
At 08:58 PM 02/26/2000 -0800, you wrote:
>Stephanie,
>
>Thanks for your wonderful response. I appreciate the trouble and time I'm
>sure it took.
>
>My descent from John DWIGHT goes through son Timothy to grandson Nathaniel
>to ggranddaughter Anna who married Abel CADWELL in Westfield, MA. I do have
>some information on the Dwights, but nothing on the family's origins in
>England.
>
>Regarding the possible CLOYES connection, it would have to be in England, as
>Hannah came with John and they had several children. I was hoping someone
>had done some CLOYES research in England that might suggest a relationship
>with the DWIGHTs.
>
>I do agree with your assessment of Torrey; it is regrettable that further
>documentation is not available. I wonder why he thought Hannah's name might
>be ELOYES? The lack of any ELOYES citations in New England does not mean
>there are no ELOYES families in England. My presumption was that if Torrey
>encountered the name, it likely was from a New England source.
>
>Thanks for your encouragement, and please do keep an eye out for an earlier
>Hannah. If there is one in the 1650s, perhaps the name was not unfamiliar
>to the family? I will monitor this list for awhile with the hope something
>relevant may surface. Perhaps it will be evidence to disprove my
>hypothesis.
>
>Gordon
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <CLOYES-D-request(a)rootsweb.com>
>To: <CLOYES-D(a)rootsweb.com>
>Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2000 2:20 PM
>Subject: CLOYES-D Digest V00 #3
>
Stephanie,
Thanks for your wonderful response. I appreciate the trouble and time I'm
sure it took.
My descent from John DWIGHT goes through son Timothy to grandson Nathaniel
to ggranddaughter Anna who married Abel CADWELL in Westfield, MA. I do have
some information on the Dwights, but nothing on the family's origins in
England.
Regarding the possible CLOYES connection, it would have to be in England, as
Hannah came with John and they had several children. I was hoping someone
had done some CLOYES research in England that might suggest a relationship
with the DWIGHTs.
I do agree with your assessment of Torrey; it is regrettable that further
documentation is not available. I wonder why he thought Hannah's name might
be ELOYES? The lack of any ELOYES citations in New England does not mean
there are no ELOYES families in England. My presumption was that if Torrey
encountered the name, it likely was from a New England source.
Thanks for your encouragement, and please do keep an eye out for an earlier
Hannah. If there is one in the 1650s, perhaps the name was not unfamiliar
to the family? I will monitor this list for awhile with the hope something
relevant may surface. Perhaps it will be evidence to disprove my
hypothesis.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From: <CLOYES-D-request(a)rootsweb.com>
To: <CLOYES-D(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2000 2:20 PM
Subject: CLOYES-D Digest V00 #3
>I am descended from John Dwight who first arived in Watertown, MA before
>1635. Shortly after, he moved to Dedham, MA. He brought with him a wife
>named Hannah, whose last name is unknown. Torrey's book on marriage
>suggests her last name may have been ELOYES, but there is no supporting
>evidence.
Recently, a fellow researcher suggested that Hannah's name was CLOSE
Welcome!
I think your theory is very plausible. Any clue as to why Torrey suspected
the name Eloyes? Although the Cloyes name has been spelled many different
ways, I have not been able to connect any Close names to our lines - has
anyone else? I also, have never seen it spelled Eloyes - nor have I seen
that name before in any of my 20+ years of research. Searching some of the
records I have on hand, I find no Eloyes recorded, nor Close - except one
below. (the records I searched were all prior to 1690)
I also found no Dwight's in my Maine records where you might expect to find
Cloyes relations after the migration from Watertown.
In my own database, I find there may have possibly been other Cloyes
siblings unrecorded in some of the earliest Cloyes generations including
that of the John Cloyes found at Watertown, but I have no record of any
except the earliest Hannah born in 1650.
In one of my own databases I find;
John Dwight d. 1661, dau. Hannah b. 1625; d. 1714 (m. Nathaniel Whiting and
had at least Hannah, Timothy and Samuel - I have a little more on these
descendants); Timothy b.1630, d. January 31, 1717/18 (m. Bethia Morse
February 01, 1691/92 at Boston); and John.
and in another database; John Dwight m. Elizabeth Coffin January 28,
1657/58. Elizabeth was of Bridgeham, Norfolk, England, d. July 17, 1660 at
Hingham, Plymouth Co., Massachusetts The record also shows marriages for
her to William Ripley and Thomas Thaxter (there are descendants shown for
this marriage). The source for this was Brøderbund WFT Vol. 2, Ed. 1, Tree
#1352, Date of Import: Apr 6, 1997
Dwight is found in these resources however;
Genealogical Register of the First Settlers of New England, by John Farmer,
published by Carter, Andrews & Co., Lancaster, MA 1829 "John Dwight, Dedham
1635, was admitted
freeman in 1638, d. in 1653. The Boston records give the death of John
Dwight of Dedham, 24 March 1638, who was perhaps a son."
A Genealogical Dictionary if the First Settlers of New England by James
Savage, published at Boston by Little, Brown and Company in 1860, Vol. II.
Shows no Eloyes, 1 Close (Thomas of Greenwich), and on pg.85;
"Dwight, John, Watertown, rem. with first sett. to Dedham a. 1635, freem.
13 Mar. 1639, had brot. w. Hannah (wh. d 5 Sept. 1656), and some children
from Eng. as his eldest s. perhaps nam. John, wh. was lost in the woods, 24
Mar. 1639, aged 7 yrs.: Hannah, and Timothy. He had Mary, b. 25 July 1635,
call. the first fem. ch. of D.: and Sarah, 17 June 1638: and d. 24 Jan.
1661. In his will of 16 June 1658, pro. 5 Mar. 1661, he names w. Eliz. (m.
20 Jan. 1658, wh. was wid. of William Ripley, and had been wid. of Thomas
Thaxter, and d. 17 July 1660, shortly bef the testat.): only s. Timothy:
ds. Hannah, w. of Nathaniel Whiting, m. 4 Nov 1643: Mary, third w. of Henry
Phillips: and Sarah, w. of Nathaniel Reynolds, m. 7 Jan. 1658. He had made
a contr. 24 June 1653 with Phillips, after the m. as to the jointure for
Mary: and his will takes notice of their s. Eleazer."
The Dedham Historical Register Volume II, published by the Dedham
Historical Society in 1890. Pg 20 "One melancholy story tells how, on the
29th of March, 1639, John Dwight the seven year old son of John Dwight
strayed away, and as he was never seen afterward, he is supposed to have
been devoured by the wolves. One can easily imagine the excitement aroused
in the village, by the disappearance of this child, whose father was one of
the prominent men in the town. It is also said that a Mrs. Hannah (Dwight)
Whiting, a sister of the unfortunated John Dwight, made it safe for her
children to play out of doors, by firing off a gun at regular intervals."
John Dwight and family are mentioned sporadically in this record.
I find no Close or Cloyes in Dedham records I hold.
In Suffolk Co. Wills, published by the Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
Baltimore 1984, I find an abstract of John Dwight's will, transcribed as it
appears except pounds is written out as I have no appropriate symbol;
John Dwight, of Dedham, yeoman, being in prfect health, this 16th June
1658, doe make this my last will. To my wife, Elizabeth, that now is, 50
pounds sterling, to be payd her by my Executors, in Currant Country pay, at
my now dwelling house, at Dedham, within 3 monethes after my decease, as by
Covenant, before our marriage, appeareth; also all her weareing Apparell,
both linen and woollen, alsoe that my said wife shall have dyet allowed
her, at my said dwelling house, in Dedham, dureing ye space of 3 monethes
after my decease, if shee shall desire it, that soe shee may ye more
Comfortably provide for ye removeall of hir habitation to some other place.
I give unto my sonne, Nathaniell Whiteing, 20s; unto my sonne, Henrie
Philips, 20s; unto my sonne, Nathaniell Reinolds,
20s. My will is, that my dwelling house, land, and moveables in ye Towne of
Dedham, or elsewhere, which shall be founde to my estate, at my decease, be
equally devided into five pts, two pts whereof I give unto my sonne,
Timothy Dwight, and one part unto ye Children of my son, Nathaniell
Whiteing, and of Hannah, his wife, or soe many of them as shall be
surviveing at my decease, to be payd by my Executor, as in his discretion
will best conduce for their benefitt. I give unto my Grand Child Eliazar
Philips, sonne of my sonne Henry Philips, and of Mary his wife, my dau.,
one part of ye five; and if ye said Eliazar shall not be surviveing at my
decease, then my will is, that my Executor, at his discretion, shall
dispose of that one part of ye five unto ye rest of ye children of my son,
Henry Philips, and of my dau. Mary, his wife. The fifth part remayneing of
ye five,
I give unto my dau. Sarah Reynolds, or to her child or Children, as my
Executor shall see cause to dispose of it. Alsoe, my will is, that my son,
Timothy Dwight, shall enjoy all that house and land which I gave him at his
first marriage with Sarah Sibly. Alsoe, that my sonne, Nathaniell Whiteing,
shall enjoy all that 6 Acres of land, be it more or lesse, which lyeth in
ye low playne; and ye 2 Acres of meadow lyeing in foule meadow, which I
brought of Lieut. Joshua Fisher. My will is, that it shall be at my
Executors liberty to pay said Legatyes, either in land or Currant Country
pay, and to pay them at ye same prise as they were vallued at by ye prises
at my decease. Alsoe, my will is, that my Executor shall not be ingaged to
pay ye said legatyes to any of ye said Children, under age, untill they
canne legaly give a discharge for ye receipt of ye same. I Appoynt my son,
Timothy Dwight, to be Executor of this my last will. In presence of Peter
Woodard William Avery
Peter Woodard deposed 5 March 1660."
I think you should not rely too much on Torrey (although he could be
right), and start from only the name 'Hannah'.
What I would do if you haven't done it - find Dwight immigration records if
available - look at families on the ship - where the families originated,
and point of departure. Families and friends tended to travel in groups,
but not always. Look at Watertown records (a good source is Bond's History
of Watertown for one) Then look at the Dedham records (the Dedham covenant
signed by John Dwight is relatively easy to find & would suffice for
providing early names). Some of the earliest families I know of at Dedham
included; Metcalf, Fairbanks, Morse, Gay, Fisher, Bullen, Woodward, Avery,
Bullard, Fuller, Guild, Allen, Sheperd, Adams, Ellis, Wight, Lusher, Fisher
- most of these families were related to one another and intermarried
frequently. Consider Peter Woodard and William Avery - witnesses to the
will - were they only neighbors, friends, or possibly connected by family
somehow? Compare all of that, and when you find consistent names in the
same places with Dwight, look for a Hannah of appropriate age. If found,
examine deeds and wills of that Hannah's father (did Hannah have a will? -
probably not) and see if John Dwight pops up. (You could also look for
Dwight deeds and see what names keep appearing) Some female spouses are
never found - but I did find one using this method after a lot of time and
effort
Good luck! I will keep you in mind in case I come across anything that
could help!
Stephanie
Shenandoah Valley, VA
walkers(a)vaix2.net
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/w/a/l/Stephanie-J-Walker/index.html
Currently collecting/sharing these surnames
BARTHOLOMEW (<1800, NY), CLAYES/CLOYES, CUPPERNALL, CURTIS (CT), FAIRBANKS,
GENT/JENT,
PARKHILL, PEPPER, PHIPPS, THOMPSON (VT, CT), WALKER (MA,NY), WATSON (MA)
****************************************************************
"Listen to the footsteps that echo behind when you walk alone."
*****************************************************************
Tom and Others,
I recently subscribed to this list and have been attempting to monitor
discussions. Unfortunately, there have been none. I'd like to pose a
question to see what I can turn up.
I am descended from John Dwight who first arived in Watertown, MA before
1635. Shortly after, he moved to Dedham, MA. He brought with him a wife
named Hannah, whose last name is unknown. Torrey's book on marriage
suggests her last name may have been ELOYES, but there is no supporting
evidence.
Recently, a fellow researcher suggested that Hannah's name was CLOSE,
further suggesting that bad penmanship, or a lousy copy, could have been
translated incorrectly as ELOYES. Frankly, I don't see that as likely, but
it made me think of other possible transcription errors. In looking about
for similar names, I quickly found CLOYES. It's clearly similar to ELOYES,
and the "E" and "C" are close enough to give the idea consideration.
I looked around further and could find no ELOYES citations, and only one for
a Thomas CLOSE who would have been much too young to be relevant. But I did
find John CLOYES; and lo and behold--he was also originally in Watertown,
MA. This seems to be an interesting coincidence. This John appears to be
of an age where he might be a brother or cousin if Hannah was indeed a
CLOYES.
So, I was wondering if anyone has researched the CLOYES family in England,
and has anyone found an unattached Hannah who was likely born in the early
1600s? It would be wonderful if someone found some early connection or
reference to the DWIGHT family in their search for CLOYES.
I know nothing yet about the Massachusetts CLOYES family, and I'd love to
hear from anyone who could either add to or dispel my theory.
Gordon Kirkemo
kirkemo(a)olywa.net
PS: I don't know if there are other lurking like me, but perhaps a roll
call might stir some activity?
The mail has been overwhelming in support of keeping the maillist going, so
it'll be renewed when it comes due this year.
In the interest of generating more traffic on here, as long as the subject
matter doesn't get too far over the left field fence I'll allow it. So
genealogy only strictures are off, and let's make this a great maillist to
not only compare notes, but keep in touch and have fun.
Tom
Interestingly, I find a George Cleves having frequent dealings in Maine
with the Cloyes immigrant family. Coincidence?
Stephanie
Shenandoah Valley, VA
walkers(a)vaix2.net
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/w/a/l/Stephanie-J-Walker/index.html
Currently collecting/sharing these surnames
BARTHOLOMEW (<1800, NY), CLAYES/CLOYES, CUPPERNALL, CURTIS (CT), FAIRBANKS,
GENT/JENT,
PARKHILL, PEPPER, PHIPPS, THOMPSON (VT, CT), WALKER (MA,NY), WATSON (MA)
****************************************************************
"Listen to the footsteps that echo behind when you walk alone."
*****************************************************************
I agree with Esther's post related to the Cloyes list, and thanks Bill for
remembering me. I'm still out here, although relatively quiet as of late,
especially on the Cloyes end. Seems like you get to work on one line and
quickly get side tracked on to another. Recently had a message from a new
Cloyes descendant and will be turning him on the the list if he is
interested - he is a descendant of the Cloyes branch from
Morrisville/Earlville, NY that connected with a Beecher line.
And to you David - welcome! Tell me what you know on John Cloyes - which
John? I have lots of info on the Elijah and Abigail line.
Also, thanks for the post on Anne of Cleves - I was thinking the same
thing, but thought maybe there were alternate spellings as there is for
Cloyes and many other names.
Let me know what you have on John Cloyes, and I will see what I can do to
help!
Stephanie
Stephanie
Shenandoah Valley, VA
walkers(a)vaix2.net
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/w/a/l/Stephanie-J-Walker/index.html
Currently collecting/sharing these surnames
BARTHOLOMEW (<1800, NY), CLAYES/CLOYES, CUPPERNALL, CURTIS (CT), FAIRBANKS,
GENT/JENT,
PARKHILL, PEPPER, PHIPPS, THOMPSON (VT, CT), WALKER (MA,NY), WATSON (MA)
****************************************************************
"Listen to the footsteps that echo behind when you walk alone."
*****************************************************************
David,
You need to make contact with Stephanie Walker about the Cloyes/Pepper line.
Someone have her current e-mail address? My Netscape address file is corrupted and can't give you Stephanie's addr at this time.
Bill Harvey
wlh(a)foothill.net
David Roberts wrote:
> My mother is a Cloyes and needs some help making the connections between
> John Cloyes and Elijah Cloyes & Abigail Pepper. If anyone knows something
> that would help, please email me.
>
> P.S. Good try on the connection of Cloyes(Cleyes), with Henry the VIII, but
> her name was spelled Anne of Cleves. Not related.
>
> Any help I could pass on to my mother would be appreciated. She had been in
> contact with Harriette, but has not heard from here in awhile so if she has
> an email address or if the information she sent out might help, then please
> tell me how we can get in touch.
>
> David Roberts
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Tom Cloyes [mailto:foolery@bright.net]
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 5:30 PM
> > To: CLOYES-L(a)rootsweb.com
> > Subject: Maillist....Keep It Or Not????
> >
> >
> > Was wondering if anyone was still working and wanted to use this maillist.
> > If noone is interested in keeping this list going then I'll not renew when
> > it comes due.
> >
> > Let me know,
> > Tom
> >
> > ______________________________
Hello Tom,
Although the Cloyes list has been fairly quiet, it's nice to know it's there
in case any choice tidbits of Cloyes history is discovered. It's a great way
to keep in touch with Cloyes cousins. I appreciate your involvement.
Esther Snively in San Jose, California
9th Great Granddaughter of Peter Cloyes 1590
My mother is a Cloyes and needs some help making the connections between
John Cloyes and Elijah Cloyes & Abigail Pepper. If anyone knows something
that would help, please email me.
P.S. Good try on the connection of Cloyes(Cleyes), with Henry the VIII, but
her name was spelled Anne of Cleves. Not related.
Any help I could pass on to my mother would be appreciated. She had been in
contact with Harriette, but has not heard from here in awhile so if she has
an email address or if the information she sent out might help, then please
tell me how we can get in touch.
David Roberts
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom Cloyes [mailto:foolery@bright.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 5:30 PM
> To: CLOYES-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: Maillist....Keep It Or Not????
>
>
> Was wondering if anyone was still working and wanted to use this maillist.
> If noone is interested in keeping this list going then I'll not renew when
> it comes due.
>
> Let me know,
> Tom
>
> ______________________________
Grant,
Thanks for forwarding this to me, but I don't have anything on this branch,
but someone on the Cloyes maillist may. I would be very interested in
obtaining a copy of the will you copied. Do you have it in digital form? If
so would you email a copy to me? Thanks. In the IGI there are many other
Cloyes' than those in and around Colchester, so it may be a good lead.
Would be interesting if it were listed in Holland as well!
I'll forward this to the list for anyone who may have comments.
Tom
At 12:13 PM 02/23/2000 -0600, Grant Cloys wrote:
>This lady wrote to me and I thought you may know some more.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Grant Cloys
>
>P.S.
>I rcvd all the documentation from Harriette in California that traces
>the line back to Peter. I went to Colchester, England over Christmas
>and made a copy of Peter Cloyes's Will and Deed. This is the First
>Peter from England in mid 1500's. I didn't really have much time to
>research but did find that there were more siblings than just John and
>Peter, (Harold and Anne.) That is as far back as I found the name.
>Interesting Note: The name was Spelled "Cleyes" the same as Anne of
>Cleyes, Protestant married to Henry the VIII. 1538 he gave the order
>that it was cool to be protestant, that coincides with first mention of
>Cloyes. The Cloyes name may have followed the protestant reformation
>from Holland through England to the New World.
>
>
>
>
>
>Margaret Martin Cloy wrote:
>>
>> The two I know of are Adam Cloy and George Cloy they came from SC to
>> Mississippi in the early 1820's George m. Elizabeth Fike and Adam m.
Cynthia
>> Gray
>> Adam was born in 1800 SC and George was born ca1784 SC
>> There was a Jacob Cloyr, Cloyd, Cloy that was married to a Elizabeth he
died
>> in 1826-29 in Newberry County, 96 Dist. South Carolina There are some more
>> Cloy named Henry, Robert b. ca1800 too There was a will in Newberry County,
>> SC for Jacob and it has Henry, George and Adam listed as his children
but it
>> has a note stating that George and Adam may possibly be Jacob's brothers
>>
>> If there names sound familiar please let me know.
>>
>> Thank you
>> Margaret M. Cloy
>
Was wondering if anyone was still working and wanted to use this maillist.
If noone is interested in keeping this list going then I'll not renew when
it comes due.
Let me know,
Tom