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Three new photos posted to the CFA site
A photo sent to me by Christie Allen-Johnson that she believes to
be Laura Merchant Cloud, wife of Thomas Newton Cloud.
http://genweb.net/~cloud/TX/photos/Clouds/LauraMerchant_72.jpg
Two photos sent to me by Ron Head of Sarah Ann BOYD, the sister of
our Elizabeth Jane Boyd Cloud, wife of William Jasper Cloud.
The URL for these two photos is two big to come out right, so
just go to the main page and scroll down until you see them, labeled
"Sarah Ann Boyd (Elizabeth Jane Boyd's sister) & children"
http://genweb.net/~cloud/TX/photos/Clouds/
At 06:16 AM 4/2/99 -0600, Christie Allen-Johnson wrote:
>This is the only Cloud picture that I currently have. The back says
>"Grandmother Cloud original picture made in 1929. Negative reprinted in
>1947." Until I found your Cloud website I didn't have any idea what her
>given name was. I believe this to be Mary Laverta Cloud's mother, Laura E.
>Merchant Cloud (wife of Thomas Newton Cloud). Does this match any pictures
>you have?
>
>
>Thanks ... Christie Allen-Johnson
..... and
>From: "Ron Head" <ronhead(a)knology.net>
>To: <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
>Subject: BOYD photos
>Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 06:51:51 -0600
>
>Hi Tom--
>Thought you might enjoy these photos of Elizabeth Jane's sister, Sarah
>Ann (BOYD) MERRITT HOUGHTELIN LAMAR. She was born in 1830, not 1829,
>and the question marks beside the ID's can be removed--since scanning
>these, I've become more confident of the subjects' identities!
>
>Best regards,
>
>Ron Head (Montgomery, AL)
>ronhead(a)knology.net
==========================================
Tom Cloud <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
Sorry, Gang, I recently updated the site and didn't copy the new URL for
the site(They have changed it a smigen on me!) :-> Here is the corrected
URL:
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/l/a/w/Betty-faye-Lawton-NH/index.html
If this doesn't work either, then I don't know what the problem is...
BFaye
"Jeremiah CLOUD, where are you!?"
>Betty,
>
>I clicked on your link and this is what I got...
>
>The page you have requested has been moved or deleted. Please click "back"
>on your browser to return to the previous page.
>
>Am anxious to read it...
>
>And I do hope I find that I am cousins to a lot of you...cause I find that
>you are all wonderful!
>
>Lura
I would very much like to have a copy of this article.......
Gail
-----Original Message-----
From: RBruhn2726(a)aol.com <RBruhn2726(a)aol.com>
To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com <CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 11:02 AM
Subject: Re: [CLOUD-L] Cherokee Marriages
>Dear Tom:
> Please could we have some of your wisdom on the Indian money received
>by the Indian people.How and when can they receive it. I have an article
>on Indians in
>South Texas I will send you very soon. They were in the Trail of Tears
>from Alabama. Thanks. Reva B. (Rbuhn2726(a)aol.com)
>
>
>==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
VERY WELL SAID, Stef
Gail
-----Original Message-----
From: Stefanie Gilbert <siimom(a)webtv.net>
To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com <CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: [CLOUD-L] Cherokee Marriages
To all, I have been following the "Indian" discussions of late. Persons
were disallowed for many reasons. If they or their parents were not
living on "indian land" during certain years, they were disallowed. If
they could nt prove that they were of indian blood, they were
disallowed. There were many ther reasons. No one was allowed because
of marriage. Their children were eligible, but not the spouse of an
Indian. There is some fantastic info on the Cherokees in Oklahoma
(Indian Territory) andon theCherokees of GA, AL, etc. at the Indian
Territorysite at Roootsweb. Also at the Tsa La Gi page (pronounced "saw
law gee". Please do not include or disclude anyone due to what the
government decided. Remember..We are having trouble PROVING our
heritage and we can read, write, travel, and use the internt! Stef in
OK
==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
..............................................................
Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
Diana,
The two William J. (Jasper) CLOUDs, are troubling to my branch.
It appears that this is the scenario:
... Jeremiah CLOUD (1784 GA - 1861 TX)
..... William Jasper CLOUD (ca 1800-)
m. Margaret FRIZZLE 1825 AL (poss dau of Thos. & Temperance FRIZZLE)
......... William J. CLOUD (1826 AL-1871 TX)
m. Elizabeth J. BOYD 1848 AL
Now, we think William Sr. had children
.... William Jr. (1826-1871) (detailed above)
.... Elzena (ca 1825-) who m. John Sessions
.... Thomas N. (ca 1843) (Newton ?) ... don't have any other info on him
** (dob for Elzena & Thos. N. inferred from 1850/1860 censii)
>From Jeremiah's probate papers, we conclude the names of the above
children and that they stayed in AL -- except for William Jr.,
who followed his grandfather Jeremiah to TX circa 1850 or so.
William Jasper Cloud (Jr. ?) had a child named Thomas Newton.
Several of our researchers are descended from this line --
including the president of the CFA, Leonard Cloud. Leonard
explains the Thomas N. on the AL censii by saying "In 1878 or
1879, he and his mother left Texas with Elcena to go to
Montgomery, Alabama to work for a railroad for a couple of
years. He returned to Texas and married Martha Pratt.
After she died, he married Laura Merchant."
If Leonard is correct, it would appear that our stew is very
mixed indeed! We have a plethora of Jeremiahs, Williams and
Thomases. At this juncture, and not knowing the proof Leonard
has for his ancestor's sojourn from TX to AL to work for the
railroad, I am inclined to think that the Thomas N. seen on
the censii is the son of William Sr. and Margaret Frizzle,
and that his middle initial is indeed "N" for Newton. Then,
William Jr. named his son Thomas Newton after his brother.
The information I have on my web site is dated and does *NOT*
reflect William J. Sr. and Margaret Frizzle.
http://genweb.net/~cloud/TX/d20.htm#P1
It does, however, give an accurate picture of William Jr.'s children
and ancestors -- including his wife Martha Pratt:
http://genweb.net/~cloud/TX/d22.htm#P1449
The web site has no information on her, but I now have:
Martha Jane PRATT b. 5-20-1864 Milam cty, TX; d. 8-15-1891 Rogers,
Milam cty, TX; m. Thos. Newton Cloud 11-27-1879 Milano, Milam
cty, TX.
This Thomas N. and Martha cannot be the people you are referring
to as the dates are wrong ..... "your" Thomas W. and Martha
have birth dates, inferred from the 1900 census, of 1842 & 1843,
respectively. My "first" Thomas N., however, appears to have been
b. 1842. *** BUT, your desire to find a Thomas N. and Martha
CLOUD husband/wife in 1850 census could not work for either of
these people -- not unless they were 6 and 7 years old when they
married!
Elcena (b. ca 1825) and William J. Jr. (b. ca 1826) appear to
be William Sr's oldest children. It's unlikely that any other
of his children could be married and with children by 1850.
Gary Cloud wrote:
1830 Pike cty census Wm and Margaret have 2 children, one male
under 5, which could be Wm Jr and one female under 5, maybe
Elcena.
1840 Pike cty census Wm and Margaret have four children, one
male under five, one male 10-15 (Wm J? ), one female under five,
and one female 10-15 (Elcena? ). Nearby a Thomas Frizzel 60-70,
and an Ephraim Frizzel 20-30 next door
In the 1850 Pike census Wm has died or has run away from home.
Margaret 41 with Elzena 25, Thomas 7, and Margaret 2. Missing
is male 10-15 and female 10-15. Maybe Margaret is Elcina's
child (she married John Sessions in 1846).
***** (this implies a dob for Thos. of 1843 !!)
In the 1860 Pike census Margaret 51 is with Thomas N., Isabel Cloud
and a Wm Adams (overseer). Margaret has done quite well for
herself with a personal property value of $13,000 and real estate
$3,500. Maybe inheritance from Thomas.
At 12:49 PM 11/30/99 -0500, Diana Davis wrote:
>Lura,
>
>Ok, let me see if I can explain this.
>
>Back in 1997 I contacted Jan Cloud, member of the Cloud Family Association.
>She gave me some info, but I was never able to follow up. But one of the
>things she told me was that if I looked in Montgomery Co Al marriage I would
>find his and that of his parents. But, that was a Thomas Newton Cloud. The
>1880 census says that his middle initial is W. (but I am thinking that the
>transcriber may have messed up a N for a W)
>Also, I was told that Thomas Newton Cloud was married to a Martha Cloud and
>that it was listed on his Conf. War Pension that his wife collected after
>his death.
>
>What I really need is to be able to look in the Pike Co. Al census 1850 for
>Thomas Newton Cloud married to Martha with children.
>
>See, my hubby will not allow me to join the associations. He says that if I
>want to do this research that is fine, but I can't spend his hard earned
>money on it. I am sure that if I could join the association, which I would
>love to do, I would have found all this out almost three years ago. So, that
>is why every once in awhile I ask the question and see if there is anyone
>out there with the right connections. I am not able to get to info from Ga.
>or Al. and depend solely on my computer to dig up relations.
>
>I have done pretty good but would really love to finally connect. Anything
>that you can put together would be great.
>
>Anyway, the other day Tom Cloud put on the list the Alabama marriages for
>Cloud. Right there sat William Cloud to Margarett Frizzle, 1826 MONTGOMERY
>CO! thenI also noticed that B. A. Pugh and T. A. Frizzle married in 1868 in
>Bullock Co.. My grandmother had a Aunt Mary Pugh, Bullock Co. is where
>Thomas Cloud wasw born in 1843, so I really had a few clues that Margarett's
>last name was Frizzle. Also, Harley Cloud had info that Thomas mother name
>was Margarett and wife name was Martha. So, I am thinking that I found the
>parents of my Thomas. Also, Margarett was born in Ga. in 1809, from what
>Harley told me.
>
>Anyway, that is about all of my story. Hope you can help.
>
>Diana Davis
>Chesapeake, VA.
..... sssnnnipppoooo
Tom Cloud <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
She could have been rejected because she didn't provide the proof......Lots
were rejected for not providing proof.......Each individual were responsible
for his or own proof.
Gail
-----Original Message-----
From: cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com <CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:18 AM
Subject: Re: [CLOUD-L] Cherokee Marriages
>
>At 10:58 PM 11/29/99 -0600, you wrote:
>>If you will check your "word of mouth" history, I think you will find that
>>a great many who claimed "German" ancestry were actually "Black
>>Dutch"....Indian! Check with the Oklahoma Native American archives and
they
>>will most certainly tell you that when you can't find that relative that
>>ended up in Ok.....who claimed German ancestry, well.... That also applies
>>to Georgia, Ala. Ark. and Tenn. Some of the Clouds were dark and claimed
>>German heritage. The Indian Terr. records contain many Clouds. Also,
Kansas
>>et.al. A picture is worth a thousand words! Unfortunately, a few
>>generations ago, it was not "politically correct" to be of Indian
heritage.
>>Talk about families that became "spin doctors"! Well, can you blame them?
>>But then too, it is still in this day and age hard for many to accept
their
>>real heritage. Just because you now have light hair and blue/green eyes
>>does not mean that there could not have been some Indian heritage!
>
>let me throw in my three cents worth ..... my grandparents
>(Clouds) lived in I.T. / OK. My dad was born there. My
>grandmother Cloud said we were "black dutch". She received
>money from the BIA. My aunts said she was 3/4 Cherokee and,
>indeed, she looked very Indian!
> http://genweb.net/~cloud/TX/d81.htm#P1407
>
>Her eldest sister, Idumea SEYBOLD MOORE, filed for Cherokee
>citizenship in 1896 in I.T., stating that her father was full-
>blooded Cherokee and her mother 1/4. She lied! .... and
>her application was rejected.
>
>Now that I have found her ancestry, I can say with certainty
>that there is no Native American blood in her line -- not unless
>they met and married in Scotland or England prior to 1700 !
>
>The reason my grandmother recieved money from the BIA is that
>her sister, Idumea, married a Choctaw, MOORE and, when they
>both died, there was a distribution of their estate to the
>nearest kin by the BIA. Her claim to be "black dutch" ???
>But, her g-g-grandfather SEYBOLD's family did come through
>Amsterdam to the United States (and he subsequently fought
>in the Revolutionary War). He was German (perhaps Scottish
>clan Sibbol, moving to Germany ?), but perhaps the story
>of their voyage from Holland gave rise to the black dutch
>story???
>
>I find a peculiar artifact in my kin from I.T. / OK. All of
>them seem to believe they have Indian blood ..... whereas the
>other cousins -- from the same lines -- who did not migrate to
>and live in I.T. have no such family tradition.
>
>So, for my own family, the "Indian heritage" claims clearly
>come from the proximity to and influence of their Native American
>neighbors and probably from their parents wanting to benefit from
>some of the government subsidies given to those people (of course,
>I doubt they wanted to share in the negative aspects of being
>Native American!).
>
>
>Tom Cloud <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
>
>
>==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
>
In a message dated 11/30/1999 12:30:11 PM Central Standard Time,
siimom(a)webtv.net writes:
<< Remember..We are having trouble PROVING our
heritage and we can read, write, travel, and use the internt! Stef in
OK >>
Excellent insight!
Jean
Hattiesburg, MS
At 01:59 PM 11/30/99 EST, you wrote:
>Dear Tom:
> Please could we have some of your wisdom on the Indian money received
>by the Indian people.How and when can they receive it. I have an article
>on Indians in
>South Texas I will send you very soon. They were in the Trail of Tears
>from Alabama. Thanks. Reva B. (Rbuhn2726(a)aol.com)
Reva,
I am both honored and disturbed that you think I have wisdom !
;-)
I know little about the Indians -- have researched a great deal
to find out about my particular situation. I know that the BIA
records are on file at a research center in Ft. Worth TX
http://www.nara.gov/regional/ftworth.html
The BIA records, so far as I know, are not available via internet.
But, they have a wealth of other information -- including some
native American data.
To search their database, go to:
http://www.nara.gov/nara/nail.html
Descriptions of Cherokee, Creek, and Seminole applications for
enrollment to the Five Civilized Tribes (Dawes Commission) between
1898 and 1914 and descriptions of 50,000 Fort Smith Arkansas
criminal case files
Searching in NAIL:
To search for Dawes Commission records, enter the word "Dawes"
in the first "Enter Terms" box, and the name of the individual you
seek in the second "Enter Terms" box.
To search for Fort Smith case files, enter the word "Criminal"
in the first "Enter Terms" box and the name of the individual you
seek in the second "Enter Terms" box.
''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
I also searched Dawes records at www.ancestry.com when I was
a paying subscriber to their services (also went to Tahlequah,
OK, Cherokee Nation headquarters and looked through the rolls
there).
There is a mail list dedicated to Indian heritage in "Indian
Territory" / Oklahoma ...... sorry, don't remember the name
of that list either. I subscribe to the Texahoma list, from
which this other list was born.
I know that, circa 1909, there was a recording of all Indians.
If you "qualified", you were given a headright number and an
allotment -- something like 50 acres and a couple of mules ??
I know that a lot of Indians refused to be numbered and their
ancestors have been excluded from this federal aid which includes
legal help, medical and schooling ..... down to 1/10 th. native
blood. A lot of people tried to get "on the rolls" to get money
from the government .... and a lot of them weren't Indian -- my
grand-aunt for example (funny, she had 8 siblings and none of them
applied for Cherokee citizenship).
If you really want to know about genealogical things native American,
I suggest you join the mail list I mentioned above (name ??).
Tom Cloud <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
Gail, you must not've read the next paragraph -- I know who her
parents were -- and her ancestors for 6 to 8 generations -- nary
a drap of native American blood ! .... she lied ! I have her
application -- it's a pretty good prevarication .... she even
got some Indians to swear that they had known her dad for many
years. Her dad, my g-grandfather, was deceased and had only lived
in I.T. for less than a year before he died !!!! They were all
from Illinois and Kentucky and, prior to that, from Europe.
At 01:11 PM 11/30/99 -0800, Gail Manac wrote:
>She could have been rejected because she didn't provide the proof......Lots
>were rejected for not providing proof.......Each individual were responsible
>for his or own proof.
>Gail
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
>To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com <CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com>
>Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:18 AM
>Subject: Re: [CLOUD-L] Cherokee Marriages
>
..... snip
>>Her eldest sister, Idumea SEYBOLD MOORE, filed for Cherokee
>>citizenship in 1896 in I.T., stating that her father was full-
>>blooded Cherokee and her mother 1/4. She lied! .... and
>>her application was rejected.
>>
>>Now that I have found her ancestry, I can say with certainty
>>that there is no Native American blood in her line -- not unless
>>they met and married in Scotland or England prior to 1700 !
.... snip s'more
..........................
Tom Cloud <cloud(a)peaches.ph.utexas.edu>
--WebTV-Mail-19731-10773
Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit
List, Here is one of the sites that tries to explain what was necessary
to prove "indian blood". If you could cot show your ancestry to the
Dawes Rolls or an earlier roll, you were denied. Stef in OK
--WebTV-Mail-19731-10773
X-URL-Title: Native American Research
Content-Disposition: Inline
Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit
http://www.rootsweb.com/~cherokee/n_a_resea.html
--WebTV-Mail-19731-10773--
To all, I have been following the "Indian" discussions of late. Persons
were disallowed for many reasons. If they or their parents were not
living on "indian land" during certain years, they were disallowed. If
they could nt prove that they were of indian blood, they were
disallowed. There were many ther reasons. No one was allowed because
of marriage. Their children were eligible, but not the spouse of an
Indian. There is some fantastic info on the Cherokees in Oklahoma
(Indian Territory) andon theCherokees of GA, AL, etc. at the Indian
Territorysite at Roootsweb. Also at the Tsa La Gi page (pronounced "saw
law gee". Please do not include or disclude anyone due to what the
government decided. Remember..We are having trouble PROVING our
heritage and we can read, write, travel, and use the internt! Stef in
OK
Also, just noticed that a Elzina Cloud married John A. Sessions 24 May 1846,
twenty years after William and Margaret married in 1826 both Montgomery Co.
this is on the Cloud Marriage list that Tom Cloud put out to the list last
Monday.
Maybe I do have the right parents for my Thomas
BUT the middle initial is still a problem. The census say W. but Harley said
Newton
Diana
> Diana...
>
> This is very interesting information...
>
> There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
> Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in possibly
> Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
> William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
> have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
>
> I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information. But
> Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name of
> Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the life
> of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth - at
> least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
>
> You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this mystery.
> How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
> Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His Family.
> It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour County.
> It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
> purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe this
> to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
> Township 13 N, range 27 E.
>
> Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom your
> William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send it
> along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
> information from Jeremiah's Will.
>
> Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
>
> your very probable cousin..
>
> Lura
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
> To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
>
>
> Cloud researchers...
>
> I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
>
> I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
> 1826
>
> They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama He
> married Martha A.
>
> On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
>
> Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
> Martha wife age 57
> dau. Mary age 26
> William T. son age 24
> Lidelia dau. age 19
> James W. son age 18
> Laura gr. dau. age 3.
>
> James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
>
> I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me "black
> dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from the
> forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
>
> Please contact if you have any info about my line.
>
> Diana Davis
> Chesapeake, Va.
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
>
Just realized something else, if you look at the 1880 census you see that
Thomas and Martha named the oldest boy William and one of the daughters
Margaret. this would be Thomas parents names.
Diana
> Diana...
>
> This is very interesting information...
>
> There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
> Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in possibly
> Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
> William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
> have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
>
> I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information. But
> Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name of
> Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the life
> of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth - at
> least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
>
> You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this mystery.
> How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
> Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His Family.
> It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour County.
> It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
> purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe this
> to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
> Township 13 N, range 27 E.
>
> Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom your
> William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send it
> along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
> information from Jeremiah's Will.
>
> Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
>
> your very probable cousin..
>
> Lura
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
> To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
>
>
> Cloud researchers...
>
> I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
>
> I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
> 1826
>
> They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama He
> married Martha A.
>
> On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
>
> Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
> Martha wife age 57
> dau. Mary age 26
> William T. son age 24
> Lidelia dau. age 19
> James W. son age 18
> Laura gr. dau. age 3.
>
> James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
>
> I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me "black
> dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from the
> forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
>
> Please contact if you have any info about my line.
>
> Diana Davis
> Chesapeake, Va.
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
>
Here is alittle more info that might help.
Jim Cloud found this for me several years ago.
1880 Census (all Montgomery Co. I believe)
Thomas W. Cloud age 36
wife Martha age 36
Laura dau. age 10
Mary dau. age 7 This is my grandmothers Mary Pugh I believe)
William son age 6 (he later married a lady named Gussie and I remember an
aunt Gussie that my grandmother talked about)
Lydia dau. age 1
Margaret dau age 4
1900 census
Thomas W. Cloud age 58
wife Martha age 57
Mary dau. age 26
William son age 24
Lydia dau 19
James W. son age 18 (This is my James Wesley Cloud, born 1881)
Laura age 3 granddaughter
1910 census
Thomas W. Cloud age 67
wife Martha age 66
Mary age 36
Laura Cochran 13 granddaughter
1910 census
William Cloud hh age 35
wife Gussie age 21
1920 census
William Cloud 47
wife Gussie age 30
Athias dau. age 6
Albert son 3 and 8 months
Martha dau 1 year and 3 mos.
maybe this info will give you a clue to something.
Diana
> Diana...
>
> This is very interesting information...
>
> There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
> Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in possibly
> Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
> William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
> have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
>
> I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information. But
> Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name of
> Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the life
> of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth - at
> least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
>
> You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this mystery.
> How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
> Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His Family.
> It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour County.
> It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
> purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe this
> to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
> Township 13 N, range 27 E.
>
> Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom your
> William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send it
> along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
> information from Jeremiah's Will.
>
> Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
>
> your very probable cousin..
>
> Lura
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
> To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
>
>
> Cloud researchers...
>
> I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
>
> I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
> 1826
>
> They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama He
> married Martha A.
>
> On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
>
> Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
> Martha wife age 57
> dau. Mary age 26
> William T. son age 24
> Lidelia dau. age 19
> James W. son age 18
> Laura gr. dau. age 3.
>
> James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
>
> I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me "black
> dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from the
> forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
>
> Please contact if you have any info about my line.
>
> Diana Davis
> Chesapeake, Va.
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
>
Lura,
Ok, let me see if I can explain this.
Back in 1997 I contacted Jan Cloud, member of the Cloud Family Association.
She gave me some info, but I was never able to follow up. But one of the
things she told me was that if I looked in Montgomery Co Al marriage I would
find his and that of his parents. But, that was a Thomas Newton Cloud. The
1880 census says that his middle initial is W. (but I am thinking that the
transcriber may have messed up a N for a W)
Also, I was told that Thomas Newton Cloud was married to a Martha Cloud and
that it was listed on his Conf. War Pension that his wife collected after
his death.
What I really need is to be able to look in the Pike Co. Al census 1850 for
Thomas Newton Cloud married to Martha with children.
See, my hubby will not allow me to join the associations. He says that if I
want to do this research that is fine, but I can't spend his hard earned
money on it. I am sure that if I could join the association, which I would
love to do, I would have found all this out almost three years ago. So, that
is why every once in awhile I ask the question and see if there is anyone
out there with the right connections. I am not able to get to info from Ga.
or Al. and depend solely on my computer to dig up relations.
I have done pretty good but would really love to finally connect. Anything
that you can put together would be great.
Anyway, the other day Tom Cloud put on the list the Alabama marriages for
Cloud. Right there sat William Cloud to Margarett Frizzle, 1826 MONTGOMERY
CO! thenI also noticed that B. A. Pugh and T. A. Frizzle married in 1868 in
Bullock Co.. My grandmother had a Aunt Mary Pugh, Bullock Co. is where
Thomas Cloud wasw born in 1843, so I really had a few clues that Margarett's
last name was Frizzle. Also, Harley Cloud had info that Thomas mother name
was Margarett and wife name was Martha. So, I am thinking that I found the
parents of my Thomas. Also, Margarett was born in Ga. in 1809, from what
Harley told me.
Anyway, that is about all of my story. Hope you can help.
Diana Davis
Chesapeake, VA.
> Diana...
>
> This is very interesting information...
>
> There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
> Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in possibly
> Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
> William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
> have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
>
> I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information. But
> Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name of
> Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the life
> of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth - at
> least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
>
> You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this mystery.
> How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
> Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His Family.
> It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour County.
> It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
> purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe this
> to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
> Township 13 N, range 27 E.
>
> Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom your
> William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send it
> along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
> information from Jeremiah's Will.
>
> Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
>
> your very probable cousin..
>
> Lura
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
> To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
>
>
> Cloud researchers...
>
> I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
>
> I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
> 1826
>
> They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama He
> married Martha A.
>
> On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
>
> Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
> Martha wife age 57
> dau. Mary age 26
> William T. son age 24
> Lidelia dau. age 19
> James W. son age 18
> Laura gr. dau. age 3.
>
> James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
>
> I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me "black
> dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from the
> forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
>
> Please contact if you have any info about my line.
>
> Diana Davis
> Chesapeake, Va.
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
>
Try:
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/l/a/w/Betty-faye-Lawton-NH/index.html
----- Original Message -----
From: Black, Lura <lblack(a)scndetsd.massopac.navy.mil>
To: <CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 9:12 AM
Subject: RE: [CLOUD-L] adjacentto William: Jeremiah again
> Betty,
>
> I clicked on your link and this is what I got...
>
> The page you have requested has been moved or deleted. Please click "back"
> on your browser to return to the previous page.
>
> Am anxious to read it...
>
> And I do hope I find that I am cousins to a lot of you...cause I find that
> you are all wonderful!
>
> Lura
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Betty Faye Lawton [mailto:bfaye@worldpath.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 9:06 AM
> To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: RE: [CLOUD-L] adjacentto William: Jeremiah again
>
>
> Lura, we may all be cousins or"removed" at some place in the CLOUD lines,
> but let me add my two cents worth...
>
> Please read my web page at:
>
> http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/l/a/w/Bettyfaye-Lawton-NH/
>
> (I apologize,RootsWeb, as I didn't know about you when I put the website
at
> FTM..now I can't figure out how to move it to your Freepages!)
>
> This tells my one end of the GA CLOUD line and goes back to a Jeremiah in
> NC in the Rowan co area who MAY have been born in either VA/DE ca
1720..but
> no clues or proof yet!
>
> BFaye
>
>
>
> >Diana...
> >
> >This is very interesting information...
> >
> >There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
> >Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in
possibly
> >Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
> >William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
> >have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
> >
> >I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information.
> But
> >Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name
> of
> >Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the
life
> >of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth -
> at
> >least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
> >
> >You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this
> mystery.
> >How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
> >Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His
Family.
> >It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour
County.
> >It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
> >purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe
> this
> >to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
> >Township 13 N, range 27 E.
> >
> >Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom
your
> >William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send
> it
> >along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
> >information from Jeremiah's Will.
> >
> >Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
> >
> >your very probable cousin..
> >
> >Lura
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
> >Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
> >To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
> >Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
> >
> >
> >Cloud researchers...
> >
> >I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
> >
> >I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
> >1826
> >
> >They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama
> He
> >married Martha A.
> >
> >On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
> >
> >Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
> >Martha wife age 57
> >dau. Mary age 26
> >William T. son age 24
> >Lidelia dau. age 19
> >James W. son age 18
> >Laura gr. dau. age 3.
> >
> >James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
> >
> >I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me
"black
> >dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from
> the
> >forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
> >
> >Please contact if you have any info about my line.
> >
> >Diana Davis
> >Chesapeake, Va.
> >
> >
> >==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> > ..............................................................
> > Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
> >
> >
> >==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> > ..................................................................
> > Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> > If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
>
>
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
> ==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
Betty,
I clicked on your link and this is what I got...
The page you have requested has been moved or deleted. Please click "back"
on your browser to return to the previous page.
Am anxious to read it...
And I do hope I find that I am cousins to a lot of you...cause I find that
you are all wonderful!
Lura
-----Original Message-----
From: Betty Faye Lawton [mailto:bfaye@worldpath.net]
Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 9:06 AM
To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: RE: [CLOUD-L] adjacentto William: Jeremiah again
Lura, we may all be cousins or"removed" at some place in the CLOUD lines,
but let me add my two cents worth...
Please read my web page at:
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/l/a/w/Bettyfaye-Lawton-NH/
(I apologize,RootsWeb, as I didn't know about you when I put the website at
FTM..now I can't figure out how to move it to your Freepages!)
This tells my one end of the GA CLOUD line and goes back to a Jeremiah in
NC in the Rowan co area who MAY have been born in either VA/DE ca 1720..but
no clues or proof yet!
BFaye
>Diana...
>
>This is very interesting information...
>
>There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
>Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in possibly
>Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
>William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
>have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
>
>I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information.
But
>Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name
of
>Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the life
>of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth -
at
>least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
>
>You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this
mystery.
>How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
>Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His Family.
>It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour County.
>It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
>purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe
this
>to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
>Township 13 N, range 27 E.
>
>Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom your
>William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send
it
>along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
>information from Jeremiah's Will.
>
>Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
>
>your very probable cousin..
>
>Lura
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
>Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
>To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
>Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
>
>
>Cloud researchers...
>
>I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
>
>I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
>1826
>
>They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama
He
>married Martha A.
>
>On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
>
>Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
>Martha wife age 57
>dau. Mary age 26
>William T. son age 24
>Lidelia dau. age 19
>James W. son age 18
>Laura gr. dau. age 3.
>
>James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
>
>I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me "black
>dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from
the
>forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
>
>Please contact if you have any info about my line.
>
>Diana Davis
>Chesapeake, Va.
>
>
>==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
>==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.
==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
..............................................................
Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
Lura, we may all be cousins or"removed" at some place in the CLOUD lines,
but let me add my two cents worth...
Please read my web page at:
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/l/a/w/Bettyfaye-Lawton-NH/
(I apologize,RootsWeb, as I didn't know about you when I put the website at
FTM..now I can't figure out how to move it to your Freepages!)
This tells my one end of the GA CLOUD line and goes back to a Jeremiah in
NC in the Rowan co area who MAY have been born in either VA/DE ca 1720..but
no clues or proof yet!
BFaye
>Diana...
>
>This is very interesting information...
>
>There are some of us who feel that this William who married Margaret
>Frizzle, is, in fact the son of Jeremiah Cloud born about 1786 in possibly
>Twiggs County GA (at least his obituary said so). If your Thomas was
>William's son, and we are right about Williams parents, then Thomas would
>have a brother by the name of William J (which could stand for Jasper).
>
>I'm sorry, but am at work and do not have access to all my information. But
>Jeremiah's Will would imply that his son William had children by the name of
>Thomas and Elzina. Believe it mentions another daughter, but for the life
>of me, I cannot pull the name out of the air (might have been Elizabeth - at
>least I probably have a 50 - 50 chance of being right ...lol)
>
>You may hold one of the missing links to being able to resolve this mystery.
>How long have you been subscribed to the CLOUD list? A few weeks ago, 12
>Nov, I sent email to the list entitled The Elusive Jeremiah and His Family.
>It discussed a William who on 5 Apr 1837 purchased land in Barbour County.
>It was Section 14, Township 13 N, range 26. This piece of property was
>purchased by William Cloud. On that same date, Jeremiah (and I believe this
>to be our Jeremiah) bought land in Barbour County. It was Section 2,
>Township 13 N, range 27 E.
>
>Hope you will join the "hunt" in helping us to determine just to whom your
>William belonged. If you don't have that email, let me know, I will send it
>along to you. Plus, tonight I will try and remember to look up the
>information from Jeremiah's Will.
>
>Am anxious to hear what you may know about YOUR THOMAS.
>
>your very probable cousin..
>
>Lura
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Diana Davis [mailto:ddavis@gr8brdg.net]
>Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 6:35 AM
>To: CLOUD-L(a)rootsweb.com
>Subject: [CLOUD-L] William Cloud marr. Margarett Frizzle
>
>
>Cloud researchers...
>
>I am looking for anyone who has these two people in their line.
>
>I think that this is my line but I cannot prove. They were married 23 Dec
>1826
>
>They had at least one son Thomas W. Cloud b. 1843 Bullock County, Alabama He
>married Martha A.
>
>On the 1900 census for Montgomery Co. they are listed:
>
>Cloud, Thomas W. head of hh age 58
>Martha wife age 57
>dau. Mary age 26
>William T. son age 24
>Lidelia dau. age 19
>James W. son age 18
>Laura gr. dau. age 3.
>
>James W. is my line. He married Minnie Bell Andrews.
>
>I once asked my grandmother what nationality we were and she told me "black
>dutch" and indian. I was lead to believe that the "black dutch" was from the
>forest region in Germany, NOT indian...she stated that separately
>
>Please contact if you have any info about my line.
>
>Diana Davis
>Chesapeake, Va.
>
>
>==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..............................................................
> Join the Cloud Family Association: http://genweb.net/~cloud/
>
>
>==== CLOUD Mailing List ====
> ..................................................................
> Have you submitted your Cloud lineage to the List?
> If you're new, please submit a brief description of your ancestry.