Beginning March 2nd, 2020 the Mailing Lists functionality on RootsWeb will be discontinued. Users will no longer be able to send outgoing emails or accept incoming emails. Additionally, administration tools will no longer be available to list administrators and mailing lists will be put into an archival state.
Administrators may save the emails in their list prior to March 2nd. After that, mailing list archives will remain available and searchable on RootsWeb
I guess there is no way of knowing why Margaret reverted to the use of the
Clemmer name unless there might have been a divorce. Divorces were more
common back then than I realized! My gg grandmother (not the Clemmer line)
married a second time & the man she married left her and was never heard
from again, according to county land records. I have found no divorce
records but she did revert to using the surname of her first husband.
Jean, Lenny says to thank you for the lead into Rowan Co, and he likes the
data you got on John Clemmer in TN 1830 census. Both of us wish you would
stay on the list and help. Charles
Lenny found something very interesting--Rowan Co, NC, Court, 1792, Ludwig
Clemmer orphan of Valentine Clemmer, age 14 yrs 8 mths, is bound until age 21
years to Isaac Jones, to learn art of spinning, and making spinning wheels.
cwh, so this Rowan Co Ludwig Clemmer was born 1775-1776, and must be Lewis
the oldest son of Valentine and Margaret Clemmer. Ludwig was bound until
1798 so he may have gotten early release to be in Lincoln Co NC in 1798.
---To Agness Yount, George Clemmer was apparently missed on the 1820 census.
Lenny has a Widow Clemmans(Margaret Clemmer) on the Lincoln Co NC 1810 census
as no males, one girl 0-10 years, 1 girl 10-16years, 1 female 26-45years, and
the widow over 45 years. Then earlier on the 1800 Lincoln Co census--1800,
Lincoln Co p.841, Margaret Climore(Clemmer), 00200-20101
Males #2 between 16-26years old---Females #2 between 0-16years; #1 between
16-26years, and #1 over 45 years, the widow Margaret Clemmer. Susanna
Clemmer would be16 years old. However the two youngest girs were born after
1785 and since Valentine "Felty" Clemmer died in 1785, these girls could not
be his children. Also the oldest boy Lewis is missing because the two males
were probably George and John Clemmer. Does anyone
have the correct female census #'s for John Clemmer for 1820 in Lincioln Co
NC---I have the following but it has too many female digits to be correct.
John 110001-- 032111--4 slaves-------The idea by Jean that the widow Margaret
Clemmer Handcock was in John Clemmer's house in 1830, may also apply to the
1820 Lincoln Co NC census. But why would she be using her Clemmer name if
she was married to Mr Hancock in Rowan NC ca 1792? ---Charles
Published in the Tyler, TX - Morning Telegraph April 21, 1999
J.M. Climer's Services Wednesday In Kilgore
Kilgore - Services for J.M. Climer, 87, Kilgore, are scheduled for 10
a.m. Wednesday at Rader Funeral Home chapel, Kilgore, with the Rev. Dave
Lawson officiating.
Burial will be in Kilgore Cemetery.
Mr. Climer died April 19 in a Longview hospital.
He was born Feb 18, 1912, in Groesbeck where he graduated from high
school. He moved to Kilgore in 1938 and was with Kilgore Police Dept.
for many years, retiring as chief of police. He was past president of
the East Texas Police Chief's Association, a 50-year member of Eastview
Baptist Church and Danville Masonic Lodge 101.
Survivors include his wife of 64 years, Mary Climer, Kilgore; son,
Jimmie Climer, Kilgore; daughters, Marlene Carpenber, Kilgore, and Susan
Green, Arlington; 7 grandchildren; 6 great-grandchildren; and nieces and
nephews.
thank you for all the information, but I found another source which has
the Clymer name for which I am looking.
Please unsubscribe me from this list.
Thank you,
Tim Burnosky
This information came from a lookup request to a Monroe County, TN
volunteer. This is John Clemmer, son of Felty Clemmer and Margaret
Dettero, husband of Hannah Hoffman.
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: 1830 Monroe County Census Lookup
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:20:55 -0400
From: "Etta Hodges" <evjh(a)tellico.net>
To: "Volchek" <dragonlair(a)spacey.net>
Hi Jean -
Here's your information -
John Clamour Household 1830
males in residence:
one - age 0-5
two - age 5-10
one - age 10-15
one - age 20-30
one - age 50-60
females:
one - age 0-5
one - age 15-20
one - age 20-30
one - age 40-50
one - age 70-80
names were not recorded for household residents in this census.
Hope that this helps -
Etta
Who is the female 70-80? Is it Margaret Dettero Clemmer Hancock? Did
she actually make it to TN? Does Hoffman have it backwards again in
"Our Kin"? Hoffman said that Felty went to East TN. We know he
didn't. Maybe Margaret went to East TN, instead of Felty, just as she
married a Hancock, instead of Felty. This female is not Hannah's
mother, Elizabeth Shetley who
married Jacob Hoffman, Jr. and is known to have died in Lincoln Co.,
NC. Who was this woman, born between 1750 and 1760?
Jean K.
Dear Jean,
Yes, this 70-80 year-old woman does seem a good possibility to
be Margaret.
If so, we should be able to find her in the 1810 and 1820 Censuses of
Lincoln Co.,
NC. George Clemmer's household in 1810 has 4 males under 10, 1 male
26-45,
2 females 16-26, and a female over 45. I've assumed this older woman
could be
Margaret. The other females may be George's wife and sister Elizabeth,
who was married to Jacob Cloninger, 24 June 1810. The Census' official
date was June 1 in
1850, and may have been that same date in previous Censuses.
My notes for the 1820 Census only show the households of John
Clemmer and
Lewis Clemmer. Either I overlooked George, or he is missing from the
Census. At the time I made those notes I may have overlooked a badly
misspelled name.
Another thought is that the Mollie, mentioned in Our Kin as
having died at John Clemmer's in East TN, may have been Margaret.
Mollie was often a nickname for Magdalena or Margaretha.
Am wondering what happened to the land Margaret bought in 1787?
Wondering if she and Mr. Hancock had a prenuptial agreement so that the
land would
remain Margaret's and would pass to her sons? One of my ancestors,
before a second marriage, had a prenuptial agreement in Mecklenburg Co.,
NC in 1761, agreeing that his wife-to-be, a widow, would keep the
one-third share from her previous husband's estate.
Lots of questions yet.
Agnes
___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
Oh, goodness! I'm afraid I failed to use charm, too! It was never my
intention to hurt or prevent ANYONE from posting to the list. We all
value Mr. Hite's expertise in genealogy and it would be a great loss to all
of us if he stops responding! I am sorry I failed to make that plain in my
previous message.
I hope Mr. Hite will accept my apology for hurting him & that he will
reconsider his decision to stop posting!
Thank you, Mr. Hite for your charming comments about me!
Gearldean McCrary
Geraldine sent me an email suggesting that I am a tad too abrasive, and may
intimidate others from posting. Since Geraldine doesn't speak unless she
has something to say, I tend to believe she is correct. Point taken, I will
try to be more charming. In my defense, I will say that no one has ever
written me for info that I did not try to help them. I try not to attack
anyone personally, e.g. < Did you drop out of school in the first grade? or
Only a moron could reach that conclusion > However I am guilty of zealously
attacking data that I believe to be incorrect and will lead others astray.
As penance, and to give others a chance, I won't respond to any Clemmer-list
posts for a couple of weeks. I will continue to answer direct emails.
Charles
Mr. Hite,
Perhaps you should read those messages again and pay closer attention to
what is actually said. Jean found records on the Internet and asked for
help from someone who could check the primary source. I do think what she
did was helpful to all of us. I am deeply distressed that you chose to
attack her once again. This is not a good atmosphere for co-operation and
sharing of information. I like to hear from all researchers and I believe
most others do also. We can talk about the areas of disagreement without
making others feel their opinions are not important.
I am one of those volunteers who do lookups for people who don't have the
opportunity to travel extensively to do research. We might make a mistake
but I can assure you that we do our very best to be accurate. I do lookups
at courthouses in my area and send that information to the person asking
for help. That person may then write or call the courthouse and get a copy
of the original document. I don't believe anyone would just take
information gleaned from the Internet as the gospel truth but it can
provide some valuable leads.
The soapbox is yours, now!
Gearldean McCrary
Jean wrote<< I subscribed to this list to get help with the parents of
Elizabeth Clemmer, and in response to genuine queries I have gotten entirely
too many snotty replies from one particular individual. >> Jean, if
suggesting you find primary sources instead of accepting everything on the
internet as fact, is your idea of snotty, so be it. -Danny said you had
already dropped off the list before April 9th, apparently for that reason.
However, when I sent you the data you asked for in my last two posts, I
noticed you rejoined to get the new data. If you joined the list to get
something, expecting to leave immediately, the polite thing to do is say
thank you when you get what you want. :) Especially from the people who
supported the Clemmer-List before you joined, and will still be here after
you leave. Not just, I got what I wanted, and gave no help to anyone else.
I now see the significance of < dragon > you use in your email address. When
you advertise yourself as a dragon, you shouldn't be so sensitive to a little
fire. Charles --PS I do like your work, and wish you would stay on the
list.
Sorry Gang, but I must have missed the post on "Ludwig CLEMMER, orphan of Valentine CLEMMER in
Rowan Co."
Could someone refresh me? Very interesting!
Hal McCawley
White81429(a)aol.com wrote:
> Reply Jean, thanks for the census data, well done. Also, thanks for
> pointing out that Forsyth Co was split from Stokes Co in 1848. -Since Davie
> Co is the present location of the Bear Ck land purchased by Margaret Clemmer,
> and Davie Co adjoins Forsyth, this potentially puts your William Hancock 1790
> Stokes Co. much closer to Bear Ck. Also you pointed out said Hancock was
> single on the 1790 census, so possibly married Marg. Clemmer 1792. Nice
> point. --As to sneering at online records. The records that can be
> documented are great. It is the no source cited, non-records that cause most
> of the problem. You must try to find the primary document, and even then you
> may find problems. For example the book "Our Kin" says female Hancock
> married widower Felty
> Clemmer and moved to TN. ----As to nobody else but you finding the record of
> Hancock-Clemmer 1792 in Rowan; this information was posted to the Clemmer
> list over one year ago. However nobody followed up on it. Do you think we
> should give Lenny Clemmer some credit as he dug up the deed, linked Balthasar
> Dettero to Rowan & PA, and drove to Rowan Co courthouse last week for
> "Ludwig Clemmer orphan of Valentine Clemmer"? We seem to get more
> accomplished when everbody helps. Here is last years 1998 post proving my
> point:<< Subj: Re: [CLEMMER-L] George Valentine Clemmer Date: 98-01-21
> From: gearldean(a)hotmail.com (Gearldean McCrary) Reply-to:
> CLEMMER-L(a)rootsweb.com Wish I was there! Some of you might want to
> check out this address: http://searches.rootsweb.com/usgwarch.html I
> found it this afternoon and came up with lots of interesting things! Rowan
> Co. marriages listed William Hancock and Margaret Clemmer married l Mar.
> l792. Possibility this is where the confusion about the name "Hancock"
> comes in? After I went to the site, I typed in the name Clemmer.
> There are cemetery records for Salem United Methodist Church Cemetery in
> Rutherford Co., NC
> and Concord Baptist Church Cemetery. Same county. There may be others
> but I haven't found them yet. There were some census and tax records.
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com>>
>
> ==== CLEMMER Mailing List ====
> Has your ancestor been submitted by another member? Check to make sure at http://clemmer.org
If you will read my posting more carefully, you will see that I did not
claim to be the first and only person to find the reference to the
Hancock-Clemmer marriage. What I said was that I doubted that it would
have been discovered without the online records.
Yes, more is accomplished when everybody helps. I subscribed to this
list to get help with the parents of Elizabeth Clemmer, and in response
to genuine queries I have gotten entirely too many snotty replies from
one particular individual.
Jean K.
I think all the GREAT RESEARCHERS who participated in this eureka gold
find deserve accolades and heart-felt thanks. And it was a team effort
and beautiful to watch from the sidelines as a Felty Clemmer descendant.
Thank you to each one who persisted and spent time and money to dig out
the truth.
We researchers celebrate finding a lost ancestor, or new link, probably
more than we do finding a gold nugget. I know it is more exciting to me!
Jo Ann Vincent Pedersen
__________________________________________
Searching for APPLE BORNHOLT BROWN BUTLER CLEMMER GAY GOODMAN
HAMILTON HOFMANN HOUSTON HUGHES KELSO LICHTE MAYO MOBLEY PARKS
RANSBARGER VINCENT
Published in the Battle Creek, MI - Enquirer 1999-3-20
Frances L Bedford
Frances L. edford, 87, of Augusta died Friday, March19, 1999, in Battle
Creek Health System.
She was born May 11, 1911, in Lansing to Sanford M. and Holo E.
(Heinbaugh) Clymer.
She graduated from Three Rivers High School in 1929.
She was employed as a secretary by Bill Bedford's Auto Body for 20 years,
retiring in 1995.
Surviving are a son, William S. Bedford of Augusta; five grandchildren;
and seven great-grandchildren.
She was preceded in death by a daughter, Jan. K. Bedford in 1955; and a
son Jack V. Bedford in 1999.
Community involvement/hobbies: Member of the Church of the Resurrection.
Enjoyed knitting, golf and bowling.
Visitation: After 10 a.m. Sunday at Richard A. Henry Funeral Home.
Services: 11 a.m. Monday at the funeral home.
Burial: Memorial Park Cemetery.
Memorials: American Cancer Society.
Danny L. Clemmer
Clemmer LIst Owner
http://www.clemmer.org
I am amazed that anyone remembered my post of last year! Thank you to Jean
and Lenny for their efforts in getting this information to us! Had Jean
not been a well-respected researcher, no one would have bothered to look it
up. I would like to point out that Jean didn't say she was the only one to
have found this information. She said it probably wouldn't have been found
had it not been for information posted by volunteers.
Gearldean McCrary
1790 ROWAN COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA FEDERAL CENSUS
The numbers listed are the order of entry for the households on the
census.
Wilcoxon, William 440
Wilcoxon, John, Sr. 441
Wilcoxon, John, Jr. 442
Nalson, Elizabeth 443
Miller, Rachel 444
McDaniel, James 445
Hall, William 446
Kellar, Jacob 447
Wattar, William 448
Dutero, Bolser 449
Hinkle, Henry 450
Nail, Caleb 451
Sain, Casper 452
Sprigg, Reason 453
Nelson, William 454
Donner, George 455
Stokes, Elizabeth 456
Neat, Rudolph, Sr. 457
Neat, Rudolph, Jr. 458
Tatom, Jean 459
ANDREW, James 2320
ANDREW, James 168
Jean K.
Considering the distance between PA and NC, the distance between Stokes
and Rowan is negligible. In fact, Stokes was formed from Rowan County,
by way of Surry County. See the information from the Stokes County
Genweb page below:
Stokes County Information
Stokes County was formed in 1789 from Surry County, which itself was
formed from Rowan in 1771. It was named for Captain John
Stokes (1756-1790), a Revolutionary War officer and member of the House
of Commons. The county seat is Danbury. If you're researching early
settlers in Stokes, you may also want to look at resources for Rowan
(1753-1771) and Surry (1771-1789) counties. The southern part of Stokes
County became Forsyth County in 1849, and received by far the greater
percentage of the total population. Present-day Stokes is mostly rural,
with no large cities, whereas Forsyth is dominated by Winston-Salem.
Stokes County was settled mostly from the north. Early settlers came
here primarily from Virginia, Maryland and Pennsylvania, often down the
"Great Wagon Road" through the Shenandoah Valley.
Stokes County Historical Society
P.O. Box 250
Germanton NC 27019
William Hancock of Stokes Co., NC, was a single male in 1790, two years
before the marriage of William Hancock and Margaret Clemmer. I have not
found a William Hancock on the 1790 Rowan County census. I think this
is the correct William Hancock. Feel free to disagree.
Others may sneer at the records online, but as for me, I can't say thank
you enough to all the wonderful volunteers who have spent countless
hours making these records available. Without these references, I doubt
that anyone would have discovered that Margaret Clemmer was in Rowan
County in 1787 and remarried. It is just tragic that computers weren't
available in the 1920s and a copy of the 1890 Federal census was copied
before it was destroyed.
Jean K.
Reply Jean, thanks for the census data, well done. Also, thanks for
pointing out that Forsyth Co was split from Stokes Co in 1848. -Since Davie
Co is the present location of the Bear Ck land purchased by Margaret Clemmer,
and Davie Co adjoins Forsyth, this potentially puts your William Hancock 1790
Stokes Co. much closer to Bear Ck. Also you pointed out said Hancock was
single on the 1790 census, so possibly married Marg. Clemmer 1792. Nice
point. --As to sneering at online records. The records that can be
documented are great. It is the no source cited, non-records that cause most
of the problem. You must try to find the primary document, and even then you
may find problems. For example the book "Our Kin" says female Hancock
married widower Felty
Clemmer and moved to TN. ----As to nobody else but you finding the record of
Hancock-Clemmer 1792 in Rowan; this information was posted to the Clemmer
list over one year ago. However nobody followed up on it. Do you think we
should give Lenny Clemmer some credit as he dug up the deed, linked Balthasar
Dettero to Rowan & PA, and drove to Rowan Co courthouse last week for
"Ludwig Clemmer orphan of Valentine Clemmer"? We seem to get more
accomplished when everbody helps. Here is last years 1998 post proving my
point:<< Subj: Re: [CLEMMER-L] George Valentine Clemmer Date: 98-01-21
From: gearldean(a)hotmail.com (Gearldean McCrary) Reply-to:
CLEMMER-L(a)rootsweb.com Wish I was there! Some of you might want to
check out this address: http://searches.rootsweb.com/usgwarch.html I
found it this afternoon and came up with lots of interesting things! Rowan
Co. marriages listed William Hancock and Margaret Clemmer married l Mar.
l792. Possibility this is where the confusion about the name "Hancock"
comes in? After I went to the site, I typed in the name Clemmer.
There are cemetery records for Salem United Methodist Church Cemetery in
Rutherford Co., NC
and Concord Baptist Church Cemetery. Same county. There may be others
but I haven't found them yet. There were some census and tax records.
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com>>