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According to Claiborne Smith's book, the two daughters of William
Claiborne and Elizabeth Butler were Jane (Brereton) and Elizabeth who is
mentioned in a powerof attorney given by William in 1648 on a land
patent. Smith mentions Mary Caliborene Rice Harris but says no proof has
been found that she is a daughter of William and Elizabeth.
Hello Clare, Dr Claiborne Smith in his book Claibornes of Virginia
mentions Mary Claiborne Rice who later married Robert Harris. G.M.
Claiborne in "Claiborne Pedigree, Lynchburg 1900, lists Mary as a
daughter of William and Elizabeth Butler, but Smith says no evidence has
been found to support this. Good luck. Dick
For future reference, any administrator of any Rootsweb mailing list may be
reached by using the following URL, and substituting the listname for
Claiborne....
CLAIBORNE-admin(a)rootsweb.com
LaRae
listmgr.
Thanks for all the replies, all of which I expected! However, I find I have
to ask every year or so!! [you know duty or something. I descend from Jane
and Thomas Brereton [Father's side] and if there were a Mary who married
Robert that line on my mother's side. Clare
I am re-posting this information I got from Paul Tobler. It appears
there
were two daughters born to Wm. Claiborne and Elizabeth Butler.. One was
of course named
Jane. Is it a stretch to think the other daughter was named 'Mary',
perhaps she married
a Harris ??????
Gary
>Paul & Dorothy Tobler wrote:
> >
> > There is proof that William Claiborne, Col. Secty and Elizabeth Jane Butler
> > had 2 daughters
> > with the known one being Jane Butler Claiborne who married Thomas Brereton,
> > however the
> > other daughter is not known. Below is all that is known about this.
> > ------------
> > NORTHUMBERLAND COUNTY RECORDS
> > STATE OF VIRGINIA
> > Deeds & Orders 1650 - 1652, pg. 36-William Claiborne 1648
> >
> > Whereas there are certain debts and other things due to me at
> > Chichecon (i.e. Chicacone) and other places up the Bay. These presents are
> > to appoint and
> > authorize my kinsman Mr. Samuel Smith to ask and receive as also to implead
> > and
> > acquit and compound for any the said debts with any persons inhabitants or
> > beings in the said places and in particular as being guardian unto my two
> > daughters
> > I do hereby authorize the said Samuel Smythe to take all those cattle at
> > Chiceon
> > into his custody for their use and to receive a heifer due from the
> estate of
> > James Cloughton for a bull he killed of theirs witness
> > hereunto my hand and seal this second day of April 1648
> >
> > _______________________________W. Claiborne
> > Witness: Christopher Williams _______________________________
> > ================================
> > What ever happened to the 2nd daug
In a message dated 9/24/01 8:46:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time, Tiafind(a)aol.com
writes:
> Does anyone have proof that Mary Claiborne [Rice] who married ca 1650
> [supposedly] to Robert Harris in VA was in fact Mary Claiborne and proof
> that
> she was dau. of William Claiborne? Thanks for opinions, facts,
> speculation,
> etal. Clare
Clare ---
There has been considerable discussion within both this mail list (for the
Claiborne archives, go to < <A HREF="http://searches2.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl">
http://searches2.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl</A> >and the Claiborne
GenForum < <A HREF="http://genforum.genealogy.com/claiborne/">http://genforum.genealogy.com/claiborne/</A> > regarding the
Claiborne-Rice debate. I refer you to each of these sites for a more
complete discussion than I will present here.
There appeared in THE VIRGINIA MAGAZINE OF HISTORY AND GENEALOGY, LVI, a
two-part article by Clayton Torrence entitled "The English Ancestry of
William Claiborne of Virginia" [later republished in GENEALOGIES OF VIRGINIA
FAMILIES, FROM THE VIRGINIA MAGAZINE OF HISTORY AND BIOGRAPHY, Volume II
Claiborne - Fitzhugh, Indexed by Robert Barnes, Genealogical Publishing Co.,
Inc., Baltimore, 1981, pp. 23-70] which disproved all previously written
genealogies about William Claiborne (bpt. Aug 10, 1600; d. c1677).
Torrence's research is so completely documented, including transcriptions and
citings from source materials, to be, in my opinion, irrefutable.
Regarding the children of William and Elizabeth (Butler/Boteler) Claiborne,
Torrence writes:
"William Claiborne and Elizabeth Butler, his wife, had issue:
(1) William Claiborne, of New Kent County; . . .
(2) Thomas Claiborne (born August 17, 1647; died October 7, 1683); . . .
(3) Leonard Claiborne (date of birth unknown); . . .
(4) John Claiborne (dates of birth and death unknown); . . .
(5) Jane Claiborne; the dates of her birth and death are unknown; . . .
"That the aforesaid William, Thomas, Leonard, John and Jane Claiborne (Mrs.
Thomas Brereton) were children of the Honorable William Claiborne (1600-circa
1677/8) is established fact, the evidence of each child being stated above.
That the mother of these five children was Elizabeth Butler is established by
the fact that we have in note 45 established the fact that the Honorable
William Claiborne (1600-circa 1677/8) had only one wife, whom we have proved
to have been Elizabeth Butler.
"There is no evidence that the Honorable William Claiborne (1600-circa
1677/8) and his wife Elizabeth Butler had other children (at least who
survived infancy or childhood) than William, Thomas, Leonard, John and Jane,
named above."
Clearly, Torrence is quite adament about the existence of children other than
William, Thomas, Leonard, John and Jane. There is NO mention of a daughter
Mary. Since the "reported" Claiborne-Harris connection both pre-dated
Torrence's research and was included in many early Claiborne genealogies,
Torrence would most certainly have been aware of these reports and would have
included a daughter Mary if any evidence whatsoever had existed which proved
her existence.
Equally clear is that there are a large number of Claiborne and Harris
researchers who, using "pre-Torrence" genealogies, consider the marriage of a
Robert Harris to a Mary Claiborne Rice, daughter of William Claiborne, to be
an established fact and will fight the notion their information is based upon
out-dated, incorrect and disproven data. Why? Got me. Ignorance? Laziness?
You will, undoubtedly, either read or hear from other "researchers" who
support the Harris-Claiborne marriage and will, invariably, reference books
and/or articles which supposedly make this claim. Ask for specifics --
title(s), author(s), page references, publication date(s), etc. -- regarding
this source documentation. Ask what proof and/or evidence the author of
those books and/or articles uses to support their claim. (Simply including
something within a book or article does not constitute proof.) Over the
years, I've made numerous requests of those referencing such claims to
provide this information. None has been provided. Personally, should
someone be able to either provide me with or point me towards such evidence
and/or proof, I will immediately update my files to reflect the same.
Hope this helps.
--- Scott Foster
Does anyone have proof that Mary Claiborne [Rice] who married ca 1650
[supposedly] to Robert Harris in VA was in fact Mary Claiborne and proof that
she was dau. of William Claiborne? Thanks for opinions, facts, speculation,
etal. Clare
In a message dated 9/22/01 6:05:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
patzlu(a)tcworks.net writes:
> Am interested in anything that I can get re: the Claiborne's..
======================================
FOLLOWING FROM:
COLONIAL FAMILIES OF THE UNITED STATES, VOL 7:
CAPTAIN THOMAS CLAIBORNE OF SWEETHALL, KING WILLIAM CO. VA. B. 16 DEC 1680
D. 16 AUG 1732, SAID TO HAVE BEEN MARRIED THREE TIMES AND To HAVE HAD 27
CHILDREN. HIS LAST WIFE WAS ANN FOX. B. 20 MAY 1684 D. 4 MAY 1733,
DAU OF HENRY FOX AND ANNE WEST. ANNE WEST WAS DAU OF COL. JOHN WEST.
LT COL. THOMAS CLAIBORNE B. 17 AUG 1647 KING WILLIAM CO. VA.
KILLED BY INDIANS 7 OCT 1683. BURIED AT TOMB NEAR SMOKERS, KING WILLIAM CO.
AGE 36 YEARS. HE MARRIED, SARAH DANDRIDGE, WHO MARRIED [SECONDLY] THOMAS
BRAY OF KENT COUNTY.
HE WAS FATHER OF CAPT. THOMAS CLAIBORNE.
NOTE; DANDRIGE NAME CONTINUED IN CLAIBORNE LINE.
MARTHA DANDRIGE MARRIED [FIRST] CUSTIS] THEN GEORGE WASHINGTON
SARAH DANDRIGE WAS COUSIN OF MARTHA DANDRIGE [CUSTIS] WASHINGTON.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------
CHILDREN OF CHRISTOPHER HOLMES FREEMAN
AND ANNE ELIZABETH CLAIBORNE
WERE
THOMAS CLAIBORNE FREEMAN B. 2 MAY 1749 VA. D . 1792
SARAH HOLMES FREEMAN B.1751 VA.
ELIZABETH DANDRIGE FREEMAN B. 1754 VA.
MARY CALTHROPE FREEMAN B. 1756 VA.
FRANCES ANNE FREEMAN B. 1758 VA
BARBARA C. FREEMAN B. 1760 D. 1760 VA
GEORGE DANDRIGE FREEMAN B 18 FEB 1763 CULPEPER VA. D 27 SEPT 1831 KY.
THIS INFORMATION FROM WILLIAM AND MARY QUARTELY
VOL. 22, NO. 4 PAGE 300
========================================
Reply is from WILLIAM HILL BOWEN of
Monticello Florida.
I am a Freeman - Claiborn decendent
Pat
I'm searching Claiborne in the Macon/Smith/Trousdale County areas of
Tennessee.
Are any of your Claiborne's from this area?
Please let me know, will gladly share what little information i have.
Thanks
Brenda Knight
Nashville, Tn.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Surnames: Claiborne, Williams, James
Classification: Query
Message Board URL:
http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/2EJ.2ACIB/139
Message Board Post:
My gggrandmother was Luticia Claiborne m. Jessie Williams, son William Claiborne Williams, m. Harriet Rosetta England, son Joseph Carroll Willaims, m. Pearl Thomas, daughter, my mother, Billie Ruth Williams..I have a complete line of descendents of Joseph and Pearl.. Am interested in anything that I can get re: the Claiborne's..I have found the parents of Luticia via this site..I will be happy to share any info that I have
Pat