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This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Surnames: Crites,Chronister
Classification: Query
Message Board URL:
http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FhI.2ACEB/1.4.96
Message Board Post:
explain this to me.I found an Eva Crites married to Matthais Chronister in 1816 in Mo.This was on the Mormon church site.Do you know any thing about children Matthais may have had?I have only recently placed The sir name Chronister in my family search.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Surnames: Chronister,Patterson
Classification: Query
Message Board URL:
http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FhI.2ACEB/139
Message Board Post:
I am looking for information on Matthais Chronister,Tinsey Adeline Chronister and David Patterson.
Both of Lorena Shell Eakers books have a few mentions of Chronister's. She
calls James scottish because of his pension which says McCronister. She
has a new book on her Wise family which might have something. For those of
you in northern Ark. or with Crites connections I am going to paste in an
announcement that was on the Stoddard Co list.
GENEALOGICAL WORKSHOPS SCHEDULED FOR SE MO
The Stoddard County Genealogical Society, in cooperation with the Keller
Library, 402 W. Grant, Dexter, MO 63841 (PH 573-624-3764) will be holding a
genealogical workshop on Friday, April 30th from 10:00 AM to 3:00 PM with
Lorena Shell Eaker of Church Hill, TN as presenter. Participants in this
workshop are asked to bring their ancestor charts and/or family group sheets
and (copies only) of Bible records and other legal documents for a period of
show and tell after the program presentation. Access to the copy machine is
provided for those wanting to share.
Mrs Eaker is a native of Bollinger County and a direct descendant of many of
the early settlers of SE MO. She is a veteran of 57 years in genealogical
research. The hobby she shared with her late husband until his death in
1990. She is the renowned author of The Shoe Cobbler's Kin, A Genealogy of
The Peter Eaker, Sr. Family, Vol. I 1976, Vol. II 1985; and her most recent
book "One Wise Man, A Genealogy of Frederick Wise of Lincoln County, NC and
His Descendants, 2002"; all of which pertain to thousands of area families
with many ancestral sketches of families with whom they intermarried..
Her book, "German Speaking People West of the Catawba River In NC 1750-1800
(With Some Émigrés Participation In The Early Settlement of Southeast
Missouri), 1994" is an emigrational History of more than 600 immigrant
families to the Catawba River Area and has reached wide acclaim as a
resource for tracing their children or grandchildren's migrations out of
that area. Many of these proceeded to settle Southeast MO and then Northern
AR. These four books provide a wealth of genealogical history for SE
Missourians within their nearly 4000 pages and 176,000 names. These can be
found in most area libraries
She also has workshops scheduled for April 28th and May 5th at The Bollinger
County Library in Marble Hill; in afternoon of April 27th at the Regional
Library in Jackson. Another is scheduled at the Jackson Library on Monday,
May 3rd for anyone researching the CRITES family. This particular family is
in desperate need of researchers to put their heads together and iron out
the many problems. Her many friends and fellow researchers are invited to
join her for these sessions. She is currently "putting her house in order"
by preparing her vast 57 year collection of files and finding a means to
share and preserve them.
Betty M. I found your Edgar on the 1930 census.
1930 Pennsylvania Blair County, City of Altoona district 36 Page 179 Aprl 14, 1930
Chronister, Edgar head 48 wd Pennsylvania
, Hazel dau 22 s Pennsylvania
, Marie dau 18 s Pennsylvania
, Clark son 16 s Pennsylvania
, Earl son 12 s Pennsylvania
, Pearl dau 8 s Pennsylvania
Do you need the 1920? I have a friend in Austin looking at the 1900. Will get it to you as soon as I get it.
Cathy Duvall
Friends,
I am always interested in accuracy, and in discovering new research techniques, and in finding places to look for documents that I hadn't known about before. I assumed that a research forum such as this would be a good place to find others who share that interest. As it turns out, there are different ideas about what the lists are for, and my idea of "sharing" differs significantly from how others want to "share".
I failed to realize that others have a different motivation for being on the rootsweb lists. To them, I come on as being arrogant, judgmental, intimidating, and aggressive. None of that was intentional, and I apologize if I was any of those things to any of you. If that is how my participation is viewed by the majority of list participants, then I need to stop offending people.
Please be clear that I am not apologizing for demanding sources for information, only for the manner in which I demanded them. Citing source documents is a standard practice in genealogy, and any research work is useless without it.
So as not to further offend, I will not continue in this forum. I am unsubscribing after this message. I am always available, of course, at my private e-mail address. I am still always delighted to offer my assistance or comments, and I enjoy exchanging notes with my cousins and friends.
Peggy Reeves
Well since it was my hand that was slapped and I have thought it over I'm
ready to make my reply.
Becky, take your hands out of your pockets. Darlene, thank-you for your
input.
After all these years of research I have learned many lesson's. One is
not to judge other people.
I am not better than any body else and there is not a stupid question.
This is how all of us learn.
DOCUMENTS- After all these years the main thing that I have learned is
that documents are
only as good as the person that was the informant or the person writing
the info down. LOTS of
errors are found in documents. We have found them in obits, on birth
records, on death
certificates, in history books, on census and war records, at the LDS
library.
We all have a different way of doing things, that is what makes this
country so wonderful. NO
one is better than the other and it is sad that some of us think that we
are. This has been a sad
preview to new ones that are just starting out. Make them think they are
so stupid that they do
not want to participate. NO ONE should be told they need to keep there
hands in there pockets.
Before we went online one of my cousins said she could take my Henley info
and get on her
computer and probably get me alot further than where I was. Well, she
took the credit for 13
years of my work and warned others to beware of me. The computer has
been horrible for me
and has been wonderful for me. Without it after going online I couldn't
have found family that no
one knew where they were. I have met and cherish all the wonderful new
family that we are in
contact with.
One of my Millsap's went down at the Alamo. Now history is being
re-written and the whole story
is different. Shame on us in the good old U.S. of A. Documentation,
always changes.
THE BIBLE, documentation that is inturpreted different- that is why we
have so many religions.
I have never in my life stepped on any ones toes for being a different
religion that I am. That is
the way that I was taught.
In Randy's file he has over 50,000 names. YES, I am sure we have some
mistakes. Alot of the
info can not be proven by documents. We were lucky enough to have family
help us put the lines
into place. I have always let the people know that the info that I
share probably has mistakes in
it. But, By Sharing, it has been wonderful to have other people help us
correct the mistakes.
Sometimes documents can not help us in our research. The 20 year span
between the 1880 and
1900 census has created lots of problems for people doing research.
Without family helping us
we could not get it all straight. There are no documents for this valuable
info.
In our state we still pay tribute to our dead, we have decorations.
Randy and I start tomorrow and
go all the way threw May (every week-end) by going to help clean a
cemetery that we have family
buried in. We clean and then put out flowers. We have learned so much
about family history by
doing this. Sometimes documents just do not tell the personal story of
family. Over the years we have put up stones for members of the family
that did not have one. Trying to pay tribute and
not lose those people that have been part of our lives.
We have been doing this for several years, spent lots of bucks and shared
with lots of people. Some have shared back and others have not. But thats
O.K. we have done our part. Not once
in all these years have we charged any person for anything. Related or
not related. If we could
help someone that was not related then that was O.K. We love doing
research and love sharing with others. We have met lots of wonderful
people this way. Have met some that weren't so wonderful but that is O.K.
also. We can lay our heads down at night and know that
we have done the right thing.
My main hope is that we can get back to having fun doing this and stop all
this judgemental way
of how we should do it. Each person should feel comfortable speaking the
way they want without
anyone else putting them down for it. If someone doesn't like it then
just let it go and do your own
thing. Delete the ones you don't want to take part in. But never
tell someone to keep there hands in their pockets. That is tacky and should
never be said.
Juanita, where have you been. We miss you and miss your input. Debra,
thank-you for all your
help. Thank-you to everyone that has helped us over the years. Will
answer any questions or
help with any Chronister help needed in Arkansas but may take a few days
right now.
By the way, the Arkansas info is only added according to who is interested
in taking the time to
add it. Some of us spend our time on more personal family matters.
That doesn't mean that we
are so stupid that we didn't do it or its not there.
Cathy Millsap Duvall
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peggy K. Reeves" <peg(a)reevesweb.com>
To: <CHRONISTER-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, April 16, 2004 6:29 AM
Subject: Re: [CHRONISTER] Chronisters in the 1600s
> I didn't think we could all agree on this issue.
>
> How many people have given out links beyond Johannes? This is a
rhetorical
> question--maybe we all have at some point. As new people start
searching
> for their ancestors, the number will continue to grow. Once this kind
of
> thing gets started, it spreads like a brush fire. I'm trying to put out
the
> blaze.
>
> Put Johannes Chronister in at rootsweb and elsewhere and see how many
> pedigrees you come up with that have this information. A person looking
for
> the truth is going to have to languish through 50 or 100 or more of
these
> online pedigrees before coming up empty. Worse, people who are new to
> genealogy who don't know any better will see all of these pedigrees and
say:
> "Oh, well, if 100 people have it, then it must be true". This is a
mistake
> I made when I was new. I passed on undocumented stuff at first, too.
But
> now I'm sorry I did, because I misled people. I don't any more.
>
> Everyone on this list has been friendly to me, and I appreciate you all.
> I'm sorry if this whole issue has made me sound abrasive, that is not my
> intent. I am merely seeking the truth about my ancestors, and have been
> frustrated trying to wade through the endless undocumented stuff to get
to
> it.
>
> I make this promise--anything I pass on will have a good source attached
to
> it. Likewise, I will ask for a source for anything passed to me. I
enjoy
> sharing what I find with others, but only things that can be checked
with
> real records.
>
> Peggy Reeves
>
>
>
> ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> All messages posted to the Chronister Ancestry Message Board are
gatewayed to the Chronister mailing list at Rootweb.
>
> ==============================
> Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
>
>
I didn't think we could all agree on this issue.
How many people have given out links beyond Johannes? This is a rhetorical
question--maybe we all have at some point. As new people start searching
for their ancestors, the number will continue to grow. Once this kind of
thing gets started, it spreads like a brush fire. I'm trying to put out the
blaze.
Put Johannes Chronister in at rootsweb and elsewhere and see how many
pedigrees you come up with that have this information. A person looking for
the truth is going to have to languish through 50 or 100 or more of these
online pedigrees before coming up empty. Worse, people who are new to
genealogy who don't know any better will see all of these pedigrees and say:
"Oh, well, if 100 people have it, then it must be true". This is a mistake
I made when I was new. I passed on undocumented stuff at first, too. But
now I'm sorry I did, because I misled people. I don't any more.
Everyone on this list has been friendly to me, and I appreciate you all.
I'm sorry if this whole issue has made me sound abrasive, that is not my
intent. I am merely seeking the truth about my ancestors, and have been
frustrated trying to wade through the endless undocumented stuff to get to
it.
I make this promise--anything I pass on will have a good source attached to
it. Likewise, I will ask for a source for anything passed to me. I enjoy
sharing what I find with others, but only things that can be checked with
real records.
Peggy Reeves
To all Chronister Listers:
In this time of "instant" publication to a potentially unlimited audience,
we have to be much more careful of putting out questionable and undocumented
information. If we intend to solve our Chronister puzzle, everyone of us, on
the list and offlist researchers as well, must check everything that we put
out for errors, suppositions and assumptions. The first person to receive
the "suppositions" mentioned by Becky will be very aware of the undocumented
information but when the questionable material is incorporated into the
succeeding recipients' files and databases, posted on the Web, published in
books and commercial data bases, it becomes self-proliferating. As we can
see from the "Abraham" information, no one knows or is willing to share the
source, yet that information is considered "truth" by many. I feel sure,
based on my own experience, that we have all shared unverified and
undocumented information in the past. But the time has come to be more
careful. I appreciate all the generousity extended to me by fellow
researchers; Working together to solve these family puzzles is so rewarding.
Of course we use theories and speculation as thinking tools, but we need to
be careful that this undocumented information is not incorporated in
databases and files that we share. (i.e. Betty mentioned "German Speaking
People...." This is a prime example. A very fine researcher drew a faulty
comclusion based on half-remembered information about James Cronister of the
Southern Chronister line. That assumption, though patently inaccurate, has
now become "truth.")
I don't intend this message to be a "hand slap" to anyone but a caveat to
all of us, myself most of all. Others who are less serious about research
take what is so freely and graciously given and include it in their
collection, unquestioning and with no evaluation of evidence. I feel sure we
have all been there in our early stages of researching. The big problem
occurs when this questionable information is then passed on to others. Our
work is unnecessarily complicated. i.e. Separating the "wheat from the
chaff" has become an almost impossible task.
We tend to use "what do you think about this possibility" to work out
problems. Nothing wrong with that at all, but we need to be clear that these
are theories and not conclusions. It should be simple to create separate
messages when we want to use brainstorming or speculation to work on a
problem and not send assumptions mixed with documented data to the list or
online pedigrees to tangle the very good body of information that is
available to us. We must cooperate, communicate and cite our sources if we
are going to solve our Chronister puzzle.
Debra Blackard
List Manager
Hello, Betty. I think I am going to order German Speaking People West of
the Catawba just for all those intricate relationships. We know that the
Chronister information is scanty and misleading but all those others may
help to sort out the females and intermarriages.
Debra
> I just got back from Missouri, but not for research. I read your question
> about Mary Chronister in the 1840 census. Yes I have always thought that
> the Mary really should have been Nancy. The ages of the children are
> correct and there is no Mary anytime later. Your speculation that David
> Clubb(?) the administrator may have been related to the Abrahams's first
> wife is an interesting thought. Wish I had a copy German's West of the
> Catawba that I could look up that family. I'll try to check them out in
> the censuses in NC.
>
> Betty
>
>
>
> ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> All messages posted to the Chronister Ancestry Message Board are gatewayed
to the Chronister mailing list at Rootweb.
>
> ==============================
> Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
>
>
I just got back from Missouri, but not for research. I read your question
about Mary Chronister in the 1840 census. Yes I have always thought that
the Mary really should have been Nancy. The ages of the children are
correct and there is no Mary anytime later. Your speculation that David
Clubb(?) the administrator may have been related to the Abrahams's first
wife is an interesting thought. Wish I had a copy German's West of the
Catawba that I could look up that family. I'll try to check them out in
the censuses in NC.
Betty
Who is being written to? EVERYONE who has links beyond Johannes Chronister,
the immigrant, who has those links posted in an online pedigree, or at LDS,
or anywhere else; and everyone who continues to pass these links on to new
people.
I want to get to the bottom of it and find out where the information came
from. This is a public query, not a private one, thus I didn't address any
name in particular. Many people look at the message boards who are not
necessarily on the Chronister mailing list. I want to reach them all.
Like many others, I believed the pedigrees online and in books at first,
assuming that the author wouldn't have printed it if they hadn't done the
research. Now I know better. Posting undocumented information so that
others will see it and take it as truth is not a stepping stone, it is a
stumbling block.
Becky, you are right that it's much better to keep hands in pockets when you
don't have any proofs. I belong to lists for family names that I haven't
worked on yet, so I am silent on those lists. If someone posts something
"good", I don't want to miss it, but I won't spread it around until I test
it myself in public records. We are all responsible for what we say and
write.
Yes, online pedigrees can be useful because sometimes they are correct!.
But I keep the information to myself until I can prove it. To include it in
my database and pass it on to someone else would imply that I accept it as
truth without proof, thus deceiving the person I pass it on to.
I wish we could all agree not to pass things on when we don't know where it
came from. That's not research, it's just chasing your tail.
So who has the proofs beyond Johannes? No one does. Those links should be
purged.
Peggy Reeves
Burtonsville, MD
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rebecca Glenn-Dickson" <rkgd1951(a)airmail.net>
To: <CHRONISTER-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: [CHRONISTER] Chronisters in the 1600s
hahahaha! good answer, Darlene.
Actually, I think most people didn't answer because they have no idea who is
being
written to?
There are many of us who inherited "stuff" and it isn't documented. It was
very
generous of others to share what they had with us at the time. Much of the
info I
have was
done 20-30 years ago and I feel it was done to the best of their ability at
the time,
and not to mislead me. I'm very grateful for their contributions. When, or
if I
choose to
share it, I let it be known it isn't my own work. I give no sources so they
KNOW
there aren't any, and I usually ask them to document the info themselves.
Some of us have had our hands slapped more than once by those who want
documentation
and there is none. I, like many, use the "stuff" for stepping stones, even
if it's
from rootsweb, ancestry, etc., because THAT doesn't necessarily make it
true. I'm
far from a genealogist or a bona fide researcher, but I enjoy finding
history on my
family. I believe a true researcher will try to prove or disprove the info
given
them no matter how good the sources are, but I haven't been able to do that
on the
Chronister line as of yet. Some day ... maybe!
Until then, I choose to keep my hands in my pockets on some of my lists and
read what
comes through. I do think we have some very good researchers on this list,
and I
thank them for their kindness and generosity.
Becky
Darlene Casteel wrote:
>
> Peg --
> Probably noone answers because they are just like me -- they haven't a
clue
> as to the source of the stuff that's published, and are just as dismayed
by
> the proliferation of undocumented "facts".
> Darlene Casteel
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <peg(a)reevesweb.com>
> To: <CHRONISTER-L(a)rootsweb.com>
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 6:57 AM
> Subject: [CHRONISTER] Chronisters in the 1600s
>
> > This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
> >
> > Classification: Query
> >
> > Message Board URL:
> >
> > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FhI.2ACEB/138
> >
> > Message Board Post:
> >
> > There are a large number of online pedigrees at various sites, including
> the LDS site, that have some Chronister generations in Europe. None of
them
> reference any source documents for those earlier generations, even though
> they list dates and places. Where did this come from? The earliest
> Chronister I can document is Johannes Chronister (Kranester) who arrived
on
> the ship: "Winter Galley" in 1738. Does anybody have actual documentation
> to prove those earlier generations that are being passed around endlessly
on
> the internet? Please give us a legitimate source or stop misleading the
> masses. A legitimate source is a dated civil record or church record,
> naming the institution that created the record; or some other original
> document (not a quote from someone's book). Why doesn't anyone answer?
> >
> >
> > ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> > All messages posted to the Chronister Ancestry Message Board are
gatewayed
> to the Chronister mailing list at Rootweb.
> >
> > ==============================
> > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
> >
> >
>
> ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> Check the archived posts to the Chronister List
at:http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index
>
> Enter <chronister> in the search box.
>
> ==============================
> Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
--
ÐÏࡱá
==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
Check the archived posts to the Chronister List
at:http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index
Enter <chronister> in the search box.
==============================
Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
Well said, Becky
Darlene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rebecca Glenn-Dickson" <rkgd1951(a)airmail.net>
To: <CHRONISTER-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 10:39 AM
Subject: Re: [CHRONISTER] Chronisters in the 1600s
>
> hahahaha! good answer, Darlene.
>
> Actually, I think most people didn't answer because they have no idea who
is being
> written to?
>
> There are many of us who inherited "stuff" and it isn't documented. It
was very
> generous of others to share what they had with us at the time. Much of
the info I
> have was
> done 20-30 years ago and I feel it was done to the best of their ability
at the time,
> and not to mislead me. I'm very grateful for their contributions. When,
or if I
> choose to
> share it, I let it be known it isn't my own work. I give no sources so
they KNOW
> there aren't any, and I usually ask them to document the info themselves.
>
> Some of us have had our hands slapped more than once by those who want
documentation
> and there is none. I, like many, use the "stuff" for stepping stones,
even if it's
> from rootsweb, ancestry, etc., because THAT doesn't necessarily make it
true. I'm
> far from a genealogist or a bona fide researcher, but I enjoy finding
history on my
> family. I believe a true researcher will try to prove or disprove the
info given
> them no matter how good the sources are, but I haven't been able to do
that on the
> Chronister line as of yet. Some day ... maybe!
>
> Until then, I choose to keep my hands in my pockets on some of my lists
and read what
> comes through. I do think we have some very good researchers on this
list, and I
> thank them for their kindness and generosity.
> Becky
>
>
>
> Darlene Casteel wrote:
> >
> > Peg --
> > Probably noone answers because they are just like me -- they haven't a
clue
> > as to the source of the stuff that's published, and are just as dismayed
by
> > the proliferation of undocumented "facts".
> > Darlene Casteel
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <peg(a)reevesweb.com>
> > To: <CHRONISTER-L(a)rootsweb.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 6:57 AM
> > Subject: [CHRONISTER] Chronisters in the 1600s
> >
> > > This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
> > >
> > > Classification: Query
> > >
> > > Message Board URL:
> > >
> > > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FhI.2ACEB/138
> > >
> > > Message Board Post:
> > >
> > > There are a large number of online pedigrees at various sites,
including
> > the LDS site, that have some Chronister generations in Europe. None of
them
> > reference any source documents for those earlier generations, even
though
> > they list dates and places. Where did this come from? The earliest
> > Chronister I can document is Johannes Chronister (Kranester) who arrived
on
> > the ship: "Winter Galley" in 1738. Does anybody have actual
documentation
> > to prove those earlier generations that are being passed around
endlessly on
> > the internet? Please give us a legitimate source or stop misleading the
> > masses. A legitimate source is a dated civil record or church record,
> > naming the institution that created the record; or some other original
> > document (not a quote from someone's book). Why doesn't anyone answer?
> > >
> > >
> > > ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> > > All messages posted to the Chronister Ancestry Message Board are
gatewayed
> > to the Chronister mailing list at Rootweb.
> > >
> > > ==============================
> > > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> > > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
> > >
> > >
> >
> > ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> > Check the archived posts to the Chronister List
at:http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index
> >
> > Enter <chronister> in the search box.
> >
> > ==============================
> > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
>
> --
> ÐÏࡱá
>
>
> ==== CHRONISTER Mailing List ====
> Check the archived posts to the Chronister List
at:http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index
>
> Enter <chronister> in the search box.
>
> ==============================
> Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration
> Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more.
> http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237
>
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Peg --
Probably noone answers because they are just like me -- they haven't a clue
as to the source of the stuff that's published, and are just as dismayed by
the proliferation of undocumented "facts".
Darlene Casteel
----- Original Message -----
From: <peg(a)reevesweb.com>
To: <CHRONISTER-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 6:57 AM
Subject: [CHRONISTER] Chronisters in the 1600s
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> There are a large number of online pedigrees at various sites, including
the LDS site, that have some Chronister generations in Europe. None of them
reference any source documents for those earlier generations, even though
they list dates and places. Where did this come from? The earliest
Chronister I can document is Johannes Chronister (Kranester) who arrived on
the ship: "Winter Galley" in 1738. Does anybody have actual documentation
to prove those earlier generations that are being passed around endlessly on
the internet? Please give us a legitimate source or stop misleading the
masses. A legitimate source is a dated civil record or church record,
naming the institution that created the record; or some other original
document (not a quote from someone's book). Why doesn't anyone answer?
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This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Classification: Query
Message Board URL:
http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FhI.2ACEB/138
Message Board Post:
There are a large number of online pedigrees at various sites, including the LDS site, that have some Chronister generations in Europe. None of them reference any source documents for those earlier generations, even though they list dates and places. Where did this come from? The earliest Chronister I can document is Johannes Chronister (Kranester) who arrived on the ship: "Winter Galley" in 1738. Does anybody have actual documentation to prove those earlier generations that are being passed around endlessly on the internet? Please give us a legitimate source or stop misleading the masses. A legitimate source is a dated civil record or church record, naming the institution that created the record; or some other original document (not a quote from someone's book). Why doesn't anyone answer?
We talked about this guy before, too. Here's a recap and some follow-up information:
John Cronester was a Revolutionary War soldier from NC. There was no soldier from NC named William Chronister that I am aware of.
We know that John died before 2 Aug 1784, when bounty land warrant #1139 for 640 acres was issued for John's service. The warrant was issued to William Cronister who represented the heirs of John. William then sold the warrant, on behalf of the heirs, to Jason Thompson. Jason Thompson then patented land in TN with the warrant.
The warrant was issued by the State of NC, not the federal government. Did John apply for the bounty land before he died, or did William apply for it? If William applied as the representative of the heirs of John, would the NC Archives have a bounty land application file with paperwork naming all of John's heirs?
I phoned the NC Archives with these questions. The nice lady I spoke with said that they have the TN land grants, and they are $20.00 each. The land grants may or may not have any supporting documentation about the person who sold the warrant to the patentee. As far as application papers go, she checked with someone else who said they hadn't kept those. She did say that there might be more information or an affidavit in the secretary of state files at the NC Archives, but they absolutely do not search those for people--those would have to be searched in person by the individual researcher.
So there it is. Who is John, and who are his heirs?! Who would like to take a little trip to the North Carolina Archives?
Peggy Reeves
Burtonsville, MD
Here are the Chronisters and possible Chronisters that I found in: "Pennsylvania German Pioneers" by Strassburger & Hinke:
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1. CRANESTER (KRANISTER), Johannes (Johanis) Volume 1, p. 199, 202, 204 (this is our Johannes Chronister immigrant who arrived on the Winter Galley, 1738).
2. KLONINGER, Johann Philippus, Volume 1, p. 367, 368. Ship: "Two Brothers" from Rotterdam, arrived 13 Oct 1747.
3. KLONINGER, Johan Vallentin (Phalten), Volume 1, p. 324, 325, 326. Ship: "Loyal Judith" from Rotterdam, arrived 3 Sep 1742.
4. KRONINGER (CRENIGOR), Johan Daniel (Daniel) Volume 1, p. 293, 294, 295. Ship: "Marlborough", from Rotterdam, arrived 23 Sep 1741.
There were no "CRONISTER", "CLONINGER", "CRONINGER", "CONASTER", or "CONATSER".
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It's funny how people with these same names turn up living near the Chronisters who moved to NC. It makes a strong case for them possibly being related in the old country and being given different spellings of their names when they arrived here, especially since they didn't travel together. The fact that none of them arrived in the same year makes it all the more interesting that they would live next to each other after they got here.
Interesting, yes?
Peggy Reeves
Burtonsville, MD
Regarding Chronister immigrants, different sources have different variations of the same names. I invite any comments or suggestions:
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>From the reference: "Passenger and Immigration Series", we find the following immigrants:
1. Kranister, Johanis age 30 Port of entry: PA year: 1738. The reference for this listing comes from: "Names of foreigners who took the oath of allegiance to the province and state of PA, 1727-1775 with the foreign arrivals, 1786-1808" which is a ship's passenger list that appears in the Pennsylvania Archives book series, Series 2, Volume 17, pg 151.
2. Kraninger, Daniel Port of entry: PA year: 1754. The reference for this listing somes from: "Naturalizations of foreign protestants in the American and West Indian colonies" (pursuant to statute 13, George II c. 7). Publications of the Huguenot Society of London.
3. Chronister, Eyb Port of entry: PA year: 1738. The reference to this is page 19 of: "Pal-Index: A Surname Index of 18th Century Immigrants", Salt Lake City, Global Research Systems, copyright 1979.
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Contestant #1 is our known Chronister who arrived on the ship: "The Winter Galley".
Contestant #2 doesn't appear to be a Chronister, but might have been on the other side of the ocean. We just don't know.
Contestant #3 was taken care of by Karen Tesch, who was kind enough to look for the book at the FHC and send the appropriate copies to me (thanks, Karen)! The only thing the "Pal-Index" has to say about Eyb is that he arrived in 1738 from Bavaria and settled in York, PA. The source given for that piece of information is "The Pennsylvania Dutchman", volume 15, edited by Dr. Don Yoder. I know I have seen "Eyb" referred to as the name of a village, not a person, and I believe it was something that Dr. Yoder had written.
All information that I have seen about our early Chronisters seems to trace back to one source: Dr. Don Yoder. He has done a lot of translating of German and has written or collaborated on quite a few books about Pennsylvania German immigrants, especially for the Genealogical Publishing Company, and the German Society of Pennsylvania. I would really like to find some other sources of information, especially original documents. It would be good to get an independent translation of the original records of the Lower Bermudian Church.
There was apparently a translation of those church records done by Edna Albert (who is now dead). Has anyone seen this book? It's called: "Translation of Church Book, Lutheran & Reformed Union Congregation, Lower Bermudian, Adams County, PA". I tried to locate it, and the only catalog I found it in here in D.C. is the Library of Congress. When I tried to order it, they told me it was a "rare book" and I needed to fill out a request form and I would be notified in the mail in a week or two IF they were able to locate the book at one of their warehouses. They haven't notified me yet. Are there any other translations of those church record books?
Sorry this is so long-winded. I looked at another reference book which I will put in a separate posting.
Peggy Reeves
Burtonsville, MD