Beginning March 2nd, 2020 the Mailing Lists functionality on RootsWeb will be discontinued. Users will no longer be able to send outgoing emails or accept incoming emails. Additionally, administration tools will no longer be available to list administrators and mailing lists will be put into an archival state.
Administrators may save the emails in their list prior to March 2nd. After that, mailing list archives will remain available and searchable on RootsWeb
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: LBridson
Surnames: CHRISTIAN
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/1888.1.1.1.2.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Thanks for the information on the death certificate. It certainly is a mystery.
Thought you may be interested in where I fit. My partner is descended from the son of Martin CHRISTIAN b 1850, Martin CHRISTIAN b 1883. He had a daughter, Isabel C M CHRISTIAN, b 1912 who married William BOYD. We live in Wellington NZ. I would be interested to know where the lady you are doing this work from is linked.
These are the thoughts I am having at the moment. Martin Snr was a Carpenter, so that probably rules out north of Golofnin Bay, Nome, because that is where the tree line ends.
Employers at that time included
. Mining
. Telegraph
. Russian American Company
. Shipping
. Churchs
I think it is unlikely Martin/John CHRISTIAN Snr was an officer on a ship. If so, he would probably have been mentioned somewhere. I am wondering if any of the companies that employed people in Alaska kept records. I know there are also some church records, but these are not brilliant, and haven't been able to find where they may be found yet.
There are variations of Christian that may be worth exploring, CHRISJOHN is one seen around Iowa. There is CHRISTIAKOV. As an aside, my father was from Isle of Man, and CHRISTIAN features in my tree, as it is quite a common name there. It is also common in Scandinavia, but you probably know that.
Martin b1850 was a Wharf Labourer. There is no record of him arriving in New Zealand, and this will probably be difficult to find as he wasn't an assisted immigrant. I am thinking he probably worked on a ship that came out here. He died a Druid, but to my knowledge there were no Druids in Alaska around the time he would have been here. It also looks like he signed his marriage certificate, so may have been at least semi-literate.
At the moment I am skiming through "Travel and adventure in the territory of Alaska, formerly Russian America" (1867) By Frederick Whymper, which talks about the people he met on his travels. Unfortunately he doesn't name them all, but does talk about some by name.
Nice to share info on this, as this certainly is a puzzle, that it is nice to get a few more pieces on.
Regards
L
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: comicgregjohnson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/22.24/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Send me a note at comicgregjohnson(a)yahoo.com and I'll send you what I have.
The earliest appearance of the name COSTIN in New Hanover County records is on the roster of Captain John Ashe's Company roster in 1748. Among those listed are John, Peter and Stephen COSTEN.
Here's my line so far:
John Costen (1585 - 1640)
is your 9th great grandfather
Stephen Costen I (1622 - 1686)
Son of John
Francis Coston (1665 - 1721)
Son of Stephen
Francis Coston (1725 - 1797)
Son of Francis
John Coston (1721 - 1771)
Son of Francis
Thomas Coston (1756 - 1815)
Son of John
Brice Coston (1813 - 1863)
Son of Thomas
John Jefferson Coston (1849 - 1956)
Son of Brice
Fred Carrol Coston (1890 - 1953)
Son of John Jefferson
Carrol Lee Coston (1913 - 1963)
Son of Fred Carrol
Nancy Carol Coston (1940 - )
Daughter of Carrol Lee
Gregory Lyle Johnson
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: hannahix
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/1888.1.1.1.2/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Hi Lisa,
Yes, I realized that Alaska was still Russian at that time, and that there is a Petersburg in the Wrangell area, and thinking that they may have settled further down the coast I searched B.C. and found a few Christians there. To be honest I've searched one end of the country to the other and got totally confused. I do know that the Russians had a settlement for some years down the south coast of America called St. Petersburg. All I had to go on was the mrg cert and a few hints at where they might have been. One being St. John where a descendant from N.Z. visited some years back, the other N.Y. which they also visited.
I've searched England, I.O.M. Liverpool, passenger lists from everywhere to USA and Canada and although I've found some Christians, none seems to fit.I even checked Slave registers. I have yet to find what ship Martin arrived on in N.Z.
Interesting that you should think they could be of Mexican origin, as one of the Christian men that I knew thought they were from South America. I found Christians at Monte Grande, Argentina and other places. Just too confusing. But both the Christian men that I knew had very olive complexions and high cheekbones.
I'm sorry I can't for the life of me find the dth cert for Martin...I know it's buried somewhere on my pc. I'll keep searching. In the meantime:
Name: Martin Christian
Date of Death: 5 Nov. 1897
Male: aged 47
Cause of death: Influenza/Pneumonia/2days
Father: Martin Christian
Mother: Catherine Christian
Formerly: Unknown
Fathers Occ: Carpenter
Where Born: St. Petersburg, Russia.
How Long in Country; 17 years
Where Married: Timaru, N.Z.
Age at Marriage: 30 years.
Brides Name: Matilda McCutcheon
Living Issue at time of death:
3 sons - 14, 8, and 6 years
4 daughters - 15, 11, 4, and 2 years
Informant: W.L.(or J.) Laslin (??) Undertaker.
Hope this helps, and please keep me updated if you do find anything. I would appreciate it. It's a mystery that's had me puzzled for a few years. If you want any other info on the family, I'll try to help out.
Good hunting,
Cheers, Hannah.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: LBridson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/1888.1.1.1.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Also, just wondering, would you be able to share a copy of his death certificate? I have a copy of his birth certificate I am happy to share. lisa(a)actrix.co.nz.
Thanks
Lisa
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: LBridson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/1888.1.1.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
My partner is descended from Martin CHRISTIAN. I was going by his marriage certificate, which had his mother as Anne (then something indescipherable possibly starting with M). If he was born 1850, then Alaska was part of Russia at that time, so it is possible his father or he was from there.
The family story I had was that Martin Jnr was from Mexico, and that his mother was a native. At that time there were alot of half breeds in Alaska from Russian fathers, eskimo mothers, so I am following that route. I have been having a good look at anything from Alaska from that time, and am coming to think Martin Snr, if that was actually his name, was working on a ship and then left the ship to marry a squaw. So he could have visited all of those places. But who really knows. If I turn up anything, I will post it on my tree.
Lisa
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: hannahix
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/1888.1.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Hi L,
I'm afraid I'm none the wiser as to who Martin Christian was, or who he married. His son Martin's mrg cert says his father was Martin; Mother (and it was hard to read) Ana.
And that he was born Nome. His death cert. 1897 aged 47, states his father as Martin; Mother Catherine. And that he was born St. Petersburg, Russia. I know informants on death certs are not that reliable, but it does pose a problem. Which is right? The lady I was helping with this fam. history thought his fathers name was actually John Christian, and that there was a tie in with St. Johns, New Brunswick or Nova Scotia. There is a Martin Christian buried there, but he was married to a Bridget White if I remember correctly. Unless he'd been married previously of course. I also found a John Christian from the I.O.M.arriving in New Brunswick in 1833. It's been awhile since I've done any further research on the family...there were that many Christians. What's your interest in the family?
Cheers, Hannah
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: MrsCatherinedeeAuvil
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2....
Message Board Post:
Yes, having the Isle of Man Christian's DNA results is crucial. And as for male or female results, this is what it says at the Ancestry.com DNA page:
"Our new AncestryDNA test uses some of the latest DNA autosomal testing technology as a more comprehensive way to find family across all lines in your family tree. So one test covers both sides-maternal and paternal-and is equally effective for both men and women."
I haven't had my dna tested yet. been really busy. hope to do that soon.
Catherine dee Auvil
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: Kennith_Simpson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2....
Message Board Post:
ASMCJ, I have seen some of Red Wolf's messages, when questioned Red Wolf did not present his supporting documentation so I have not relied much on his work. Christian DNA is very important regardless as to where it comes from since it can link other families. It also provides matches that may fit in other peoples research.
As for whoes DNA you should submitt, that would be up to your family. You only need to submitt other family members Y-DNA in case there is a question of paternity. In my case my family has used the surname of Simpson for over 150 years, I took the Y-DNA test and found out that I was a Christian not a Simpson. It therefor became important to make sure that I wasn't an isolated case within the family. As distasteful as that may sound it was a possibility that I could not overlook and be a reliable genealogy researcher. To make sure that it wasn't just me I had my brother tested. His DNA came out the same as mine which indicated that my family was connected by Y-DNA to the Christian family and not the Simpson family. If there are no questions or doubts for your paternity then any male member of the family will be acceptable.
The difference between checking the DNA of the male line vs the female line is actually quite radical. If all you are seeking is the Ethnicity of your family then the BETA test would be preferred. If you want to make a confirmed connection of who your blood line is then the Y-DNA test is the most important. If your brother is tested for the Y-Chromosome it would validate your Christian ancestry, and do it quickly. The BETA test can do it but it wioll take a lot of hard work and time researching all the matches to find your links.
The BETA test does appear to place a lot of emphasis on the maternal side. Out of the dozens of actual matches that I have been able to confirm over 90% have been on the maternal line. They have been accurate but always end up pertaining to the maternal lines. Only a few have pertained to the the Christian line and those I am finding come back to female members of the Christian family.
On the other hand the Y-Chromosome, DNA test, which can only be taken by male members of the family have produced matches that are 90 % or more related to the Male line. It depends on what you are looking for in your research. If you are satisfied with the research you now have then the BETA test would suffice in helping you understand your ethnicity.
In my specific case, I had to do both because of my family's birth history.
Ken
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: sdsfgf
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.3/...
Message Board Post:
Hello Amy,
As the original author of this post, please allow me to give my input to your questions as well.
The whole "Cornstalk" story suddenly appeared online in about 2008. To date many people have accepted it with very little, if any, basis in known fact. This includes the "Indian names" of Thomas' children.
1.Yes, the TBC mentioned here was born about 1770.
2. No, there is no known genetic relationship to the Mastin family.
3. See introductory comments.
4. Many people list his parents as Nathaniel Christian and wife Jane, though others feel there are problems with this idea. It is not proven beyond several people's DNA results ultimately linking the family to the Isle of Man.
5. The question is because there is simply no known evidence I have seen saying he was other than white.
6. Yes, Ellinipsico was a real person. When anyone out there finds evidence a person named Standing Deer Bailey also existed, I hope they will let me know.
As for sharing your DNA results, that's entirely up to you.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: asmcj
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2....
Message Board Post:
http://genforum.genealogy.com/christian/messages/3047.html
Catherine and Kennith, above is a link I came across where the original poster has some back-and-forth with "Red Wolf" about TBC - I don't think there is anything new there.
But scroll down - her post does include the Christian DNA of someone in her family; is that of interest in this mystery?
Further, I have not yet sent in my ancestry.com DNA test. Would it be preferable to have my brother do it instead of me? What is the difference between checking the DNA of the male vs. female line?
Regards, Amy
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: asmcj
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2/...
Message Board Post:
Catherine and Ken, thanks for the responses.
This is fascinating and a little overwhelming.
I will post my DNA results when received.
Best regards,
Amy
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: Kennith_Simpson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.1....
Message Board Post:
Thank you. The following is my DNA results from Ancestry.Com.
DYS19a-14
DYS19b-
DYS385a-11
DYS385b-15
DYS388-12
DYS389I-13
DYS389II-29
DYS390-24
DYS391-11
DYS392-13
DYS393-13
DYS426-12
DYS437-14
DYS438-12
DYS439-12
DYS441-14
DYS442-17
DYS444-12
DYS445-12
DYS446-13
DYS447-24
DYS448-19
DYS449-29
DYS452-30
DYS454-11
DYS455-11
DYS456-14
DYS458-18
DYS459a-9
DYS459B-9
DYS460-11
DYS461-12
DYS462-11
DYS463-23
DYS464a-14
DYS464b-15
DYS464c-17
DYS464d-17
DYS464e-
DYS464f-
DYS635-23
Y-GATA-H4-12
GGAAT1B07-10
YCAlla-19
YCAllb-19
Y-GATA-A10-15
I am listed as being in Haplogroup: Rib
I recieved no figures for the BETA test, only Ethnicity breakdown:
Scandinavian: 50 %
British Isles: 26 %
Southern European: 12 %
Eastern European: 12 %
Scandinavian consists of: Norway, Sweeden, and Denmark
British Isles consists of: England, Ireland, Scotland, and Wales
Southern European consists of: Italy, Spain, and Portugal
Eastern european consists of: Poland, Greece, Macedonia, slovakia, Hungary, Croatia, romania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Serbia, Ukraine, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Belarus, Moldova, Montenegro, Bulgaria, Belgarus, and Kosovo.
I can identify with the Scandinavian, because my Christian links take me to Virginia and back to the Isle of Man and on back to Denmark.
I can identify with the British Isles, becasue my Simpson line (maternal) is supposed to have come from Ireland. My maternal grandmother was a Ford from England, my maternal grandmother(mother's father) was a Rotenberry which goes back to England. Somewhere along the line I understand there is some Scottish in us as well.
I simply can not account for the Southern European, I have never heard of any family member from any side being from Italy, Spain or Portugal. although, that is where the R1b Hapologroup is supposed to come from.
My grandmother on my father's side was Armilda Bishop who descended from the Bishoff family of Northern Germany and they may have actually been Scandinavian, it is thought they came down from the north.
The problem with the BETA test is that it appears to rely highly on the maternal lines for most of its' DNA results.
My family has been in America on both sides since the middle to late 1600's, so tracing our ethnicity back is very difficult. The lattest arrival was apparently my great, great, great, grandfather John Walden Simpson, the father to Elizabeth Simpson who claimed that his father John, was from Ireland and his mother from North Carolina and so John would have come over in the late 1700's.
My family had many stories handed down about our ethnicity. Most revolved around our being part Dutch and part American Indian. Several of our family members on the Simpson side did have strong Indian features. Some believed that we were part African American and Indian and Scottish.
DNA testing rulled out any Native American or African American blood lines. Although some of the features could be associated with the Southern Europeans. Another reason for the African American rumors is that in every coal camp we lived in and every hollow, there were black families named Simpson. There are no known mixed marriages in our line prior to the 1970's. There were other lines of the Simpson family (no known association with our line) that did own plantations and had slaves. The only known slave owners in our line were the Allen's and the Christian's.
That is the basic breakdown of my DNA, I hope that helps.
God Bless
Ken
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: MrsCatherinedeeAuvil
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.1/...
Message Board Post:
Thank you Kennith_Simpson for telling your story. That's really interesting. My family in that area before, during and after the Civil War was also a shambles. I'm only beginning to understand how the Civil War changed my family history. I look forward to seeing more DNA results for these Virginia families - that will answer a lot of questions.
ASMCJ - I will try to answer your questions. I'm going to make a longer post at WeRelate where I keep all my notes. I'm going to call Thomas Bailey Christian TBC.
1. The father of TBC's children had to have been born around 1770. e have no documentation of TBC's birthdate. And we don't know when he is buried.
2. The best documentation we have is of Hezekiah Whitt's(1) (1761-1849) pension application where TBC writes that he knew of Hezekiah Whitt because HW was a friend of Thomas Mastin who adopted TBC. Thomas Mastin had known descendents. Maybe we could see their DNA.
3. We all have stories in our families but the first talk about it on the Internet, that I know of, was by someone named J Red Wolf. I will look up the dates and links on that and post them at WeRelate. J Red Wolf stated that he was a descendant of TBC's son James.
4. Some people believe he is the son of Nathaniel Christian. This doesn't make sense in a lot of ways. I will list them at WeRelate. If his known descendents show links to that family it is my guess that he is just from another Christian in that family. There were many!
5. I would say that it was more due to dna linking to Nathaniel's family. Although I have just read about one result so far so I would like to read more. It does not rule out that Elinipsico was adopted or kidnapped. It was very common at that time. So he may have been raised in the Cornstalk family but have European dna.
6. I don't know anything about her. If she did exist it is my hunch that Thomas Mastin's wife is her sister, that would explain why they took TBC in. (future readers of this thread please do not crop out where I wrote "hunch" !!)
Please let us know what your dna results are! The more facts we have and the more heads we have working on this mystery the better!
http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Thomas_Christian_(13)
Catherine dee Auvil
descendant of TBC through his daughter Nancy Jane.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: asmcj
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2.1/mb...
Message Board Post:
First of all, as a new amateur geneologist, I want to thank all of you who have spent incredible time and effort in your research, and who are willing to share your information. Your generosity is very much appreciated.
I am confused about the controversy surrounding Thomas Bailey Christian. There was definitely an oral history of Native American ancestry in my family also, but it was always vague with no specifics except for Cherokee descent. To me, (supposed) descent from Standing Deer Bailey was exciting because we have a very strong tradition of the name Bailey in our family, but zero oral history of the origin of the name in our family. So while a fondness for the name is certainly NO PROOF, I was hoping that it was possibly circumstantial evidence of descent from her. The frequent use of Indian names in succeeding generations is very interesting if there is NOT Native American descent.
Can anyone clarify the following please:
1. Is the confusion over Thomas Bailey Christian born 1770?
Because a second Thomas Bailey (No wa tah Wo) Christian b. 1838, definitely appears to be my gr-grandfather.
2. Is it agreed that the first Thomas Bailey was an adopted child of Thomas Mastin i.e. there is no biological descent from the Mastins?
3. Does anyone know where the idea first originated that he was the child of Ellinipsico?
4. If he was not the child of Ellinipsico and Standing Deer, what are the alternate theories of his parentage?
5. The reason his descent from Ellinipsico and Standing Deer is in question - is this due to DNA testing not revealing Native American ancestry in his descendants?
6. I recognize that Ellinipsico was a historical figure, so we know he existed. What is the reliability of the information that his wife was named Standing Deer Bailey
who died in childbirth in 1770 when Thomas Bailey was born?
I have the ancestry.com DNA test sitting on my desk. I will send it in next week; do you want to know what it reveals? Would my DNA information be helpful to other Christian researchers or is it redundant now that others have had their tests already?
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: Kennith_Simpson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2125.1.1.1.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
I thought as much myself at first. After taking the test I realized it leaned mostly toward the maternal side. I can only explain it to myself by saying that the BETA tests so many markers it overwhelms the Y-DNA markers. I have had a number of male matches but they have all ended up belonging to my maternal side. Most likely another reason is that the Y-DNA matches is so specific that combined with the 700,000 other markers it is based on the number of matches and where it can match the Y-DNA based on 46 markers when it compares the 700,000 the majority markers will be picked up and result in many matches being overlooked since the matches shown are generally 95 or 96 percent matched. The Y-DNA may account for so few markers that they don't get the same results. I haven't started rresearching the matches that are shown as 5th or 6th generations. I am willing to betg that I will find some of my paternal side in that batch. Remember we share a single set of genes on !
the paternal side but every generation has a different maternal side so it thins out the Y-DNA genes.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
I so enjoyed your genealogy. I need information on where to get the DNA's
and all the info I can get on them. I have one brother still alive and is 87
years old. I might convince him to have a test done.
My grandmother and grandfather were first cousins. Intermarriage was the
thing back then.
Annie
----- Original Message -----
From: <gc-gateway(a)rootsweb.com>
To: <CHRISTIAN-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 11:03 PM
Subject: Re: [CHRISTIAN] Christian Family Chronicles (continued)
> This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
>
> Author: Kennith_Simpson
> Surnames:
> Classification: queries
>
> Message Board URL:
>
> http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2/mb.ashx
>
> Message Board Post:
>
> Continued.
>
> Now the question comes into play on how do we connect the family of Thomas
> Bailey Christian with the other Christian families. That is very
> difficult becasue it is not so cut and dry as my other matches were. So I
> will have to start from the present and work my way back. I can do that
> in two ways. One is to use known information. My great, great,
> grandfather John Walden Simpson, Jr. had a daughter he named Piety
> Simpson, 1883-1948, born in Wyoming County and died in Welch West
> Virginia. Piety married Daniel E. Christian, in 1900. Daniel was born in
> Pineville and also died in Welch. Daniel Christian was the son of John
> Christian, 1835-1890, and Clementine Harman. John Christian was the son
> of Moses Bailey Christian, 1795-1855 and Polly Beavers, 1800-1860. Moses
> Christian was the son of Thomas Bailey Christian, 1770-1854, and Louisa
> Harmon. Thomas Bailey Christian was the son Thomas Mastin and Agnes Mastin
> with a mention of also beng the son of Ellinipsico Cornstalk a!
> ! nd Standing Deer Bailey. This is important because it establishes a
> connection between the Simpson family and the Christian Family. Second,
> any DNA research involving the male descendents of Daniel Charistian and
> Piety Simpson should confirm the DNA of Thomas Bailey Christian. And if I
> am correct match the Y-DNA of myself.
>
> Next I have to make the connection between my direct line and that of
> Thomas Bailey Christian. The only known link between our direct lines is
> a single scrap of paper. My great grandfathers (John Walden Simpson,
> Jr.)death certificate. The paper instrument that justified the DNA
> testing on my family. I had researched JW for years but could not come up
> with a death certificate so no known father. In 2011 a fellow researcher
> came to my rescue and informed me of where I could locate the death
> certificate. My family had lived since 1850 in McDowell and Wyoming
> Counties. For some reason the death certificate was located in Summers
> County West Virginia. With the death certificate in hand I was able to
> discover who my great, great, grandfather was. The information on the
> death certificate did not match up with what I had so I had to go about
> researching every bit of information on the certificate to prove that this
> was in fact my great, grandfather's death certificate. I wa!
> ! s able to do that. The name John W. Simpson was correct. The mother
> was listed as Betsie Simpson, my great, great, grandmother was Elizabeth
> Simpson but she had been called Betsie and the 1850 Tazewell Census also
> lists her as Betsie so that checked ok. The informant on the certificate
> was Richard Simpson. John Walden Simpson and his first wife Jane Mullins,
> did in fact have a son named Richard Simpson, who married Martha Gross and
> lived in Summers County WV. The death certificate gave a place of burial
> as Hedriche Cemetery, MT. View, summers County. I located the funeral
> home and verified that John W. Simpson and Martha Simpson were in fact
> buried there. Martha was Martha Lester, JW's second wife. The date of
> birth was 1850, all other records indicated that the date of birth was
> 1854. I accepted this as the actual date of birth because the information
> came from his son who would have known. (although this would pose a
> problem latter on). By being born in 1850 it !
> p! laced his mother as being 13 or 14 when he was born. Everything check
> ed out and accepted as fact. This was my great, great grandfathers deatch
> certificate. But there was just one problem. The father of John W.
> Simpson was listed as Attie Christon. This threw me, if this were true
> then Simpson was not our real last name. Elizabeth Simpson JW's mother
> had given JW her last name and not that of his father. So now I had to
> find out who Attie Christon (actually Christian) was. and to do that I
> had to make sure that the Christian name wasn't just some put on the death
> certificat to give my great, grandfather a father rather than Unknown.
> This would require the taking of a DNA test. Another reason for taking
> the test was to establish that JW and his sister Mary Lucinda were not the
> result of incest or other family involvement. There had been a rumor
> circulating that one of our family married a cousin. It was only natural
> and understandable that we would have to look at all angles no matter how
> sensitive it may be. In genealogy research o!
> ! ne must be prepared to disvoer all kinds of information that may not be
> to ones likeing. The Y-DNA test was taken and came back with the results
> of every close match was connected to the Christian family. So I began my
> search for Attie Christian.
>
> I discovere two Attie Christians that fit the profile for time, location
> and possible inter family relationships. One was Attie Franklin
> Christian, he died as a child so that ruled him out and the other was
> Addison "Attie" Bailey Christian. Addison Christian fit the profile
> perfectly. His family lived in Tazewell Virginia as did Elizabeth and her
> family. Elizabeth's brother went to live and work on the farm of Margaret
> Christian in McDowell County in 1850. Margaret Christian was the 2nd wife
> of Addison's father. Elizabeth left Tazewell and stayed with her brother
> on Margaret Christians farm where she had JW in 1850. Question, was she
> pregnant and went to McDowell to be with here brother or did she become
> pregnant in McDowell County? Addison Christian was married to Rebecca
> Christian in 1849 and they had there first child in Tazewell. they then
> also moved to McDowell County in 1850. Addison was 8 or 9 years older
> than Elizabeth. Elizabeth was 13 or 14. Elizabeth h!
> ! as a 2nd child in 1856, Mary Lucinda Simpson. Again using her last name
> and not that of the father. Records indicate that she had Mary in 1855,
> McDowell County, but latter research shows that according to Tazewell
> County records she was born in July 1856 in Tazewell County not McDowell
> County. Because Mary was female, we can only assume that Addison was her
> father as well. Addison "Attie" Bailey Christian, died in 1863 at Bunker
> Hill. Elizabeth never married, nor did she have any more children, she
> left McDowell County around 1860 and moved to Wyoming county working in
> the Short household as a domestic servant. Was Elizabeth in love with
> Addison Christian, did she pine after him having yet another child by him
> while he continued to be married to Rebecca and have many other children
> by her or was JW the result of forced affection. We will never know but
> it was not uncommon for women to have children by other men and still find
> a husband, yet Elizabeth chose to never m!
> a! rry or have other children. Even after Addison's death in 1863 Elizab
> eth did not marry. Elizabeth died in 1907 she was a midwife at the time
> of her death. Ironically Mary Lucinda went on to have two children out of
> wedlock before marrying Solomon Mullins.
>
> I believe that the DNA results and the document showing Attie Christian as
> the father of JW Jr. is convincing enough evidence to consider Addisonj
> "Attie" Bailey Christian the father of JW. Interestingly enough my father
> was named Addison D. Simpson, my grandfather was Jerry Mastin Simpson. I
> never knew where the name Addison or Mastin came from.
>
> For now, the only way to conclude that Addison Christian and all the other
> Christians are of the same stock will be for a direct male descendent of
> Daniel Christian or Addison Christian to take the Y-Chromosome DNA test.
> If there DNA matches my DNA then we have our answers.
>
> For now all I can go on is my own DNA matches which would conclude that I
> am a Christian by blood line and stock, I am related to the Christian
> Family of the Isle of Man and I do go back to Scandanavian descent. If
> Addison "Attie" Bailey Christian is my great, great, grandfather then he
> is not of Native American Stock and also goes back to the Isle of Man
> although possibly via England. On my maternal side I am of British Isle
> descendency and German. I know for a fact that my immediate family is
> West Virginian by birth except for one sister born in Ohio. My family
> lived in what is now West Virginia from 1850 until 1958. Prior to that we
> lived in Tazewell Virgnia,Tennessee and North Carolina. On every side of
> my blood lines we can be traced back to the late 1600's in America, except
> for my great, great, great, grandfather the father of Elizabeth Simpson
> who reportedly came from Ireland. But since he was my great, great, great
> grandmother's father it would be considered !
> ! my maternal side.
>
> I hope this helps answer some of your questions.
>
> Important Note:
> The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you
> would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link
> above and respond on the board.
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
> CHRISTIAN-request(a)rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
> quotes in the subject and the body of the message
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: 1_Stevehoward
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2125.1.1.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Ken - I have not taken the Y-DNA test. The DNA test I took was the new version which test over 700,000 markers. I think there is a lot more information that Ancestry could provide with the results. For example they should be able to link my version with your version to determine matches. As well as tell me what line the ethnicity stems from.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: Kennith_Simpson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.2/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Continued.
Now the question comes into play on how do we connect the family of Thomas Bailey Christian with the other Christian families. That is very difficult becasue it is not so cut and dry as my other matches were. So I will have to start from the present and work my way back. I can do that in two ways. One is to use known information. My great, great, grandfather John Walden Simpson, Jr. had a daughter he named Piety Simpson, 1883-1948, born in Wyoming County and died in Welch West Virginia. Piety married Daniel E. Christian, in 1900. Daniel was born in Pineville and also died in Welch. Daniel Christian was the son of John Christian, 1835-1890, and Clementine Harman. John Christian was the son of Moses Bailey Christian, 1795-1855 and Polly Beavers, 1800-1860. Moses Christian was the son of Thomas Bailey Christian, 1770-1854, and Louisa Harmon. Thomas Bailey Christian was the son Thomas Mastin and Agnes Mastin with a mention of also beng the son of Ellinipsico Cornstalk a!
nd Standing Deer Bailey. This is important because it establishes a connection between the Simpson family and the Christian Family. Second, any DNA research involving the male descendents of Daniel Charistian and Piety Simpson should confirm the DNA of Thomas Bailey Christian. And if I am correct match the Y-DNA of myself.
Next I have to make the connection between my direct line and that of Thomas Bailey Christian. The only known link between our direct lines is a single scrap of paper. My great grandfathers (John Walden Simpson, Jr.)death certificate. The paper instrument that justified the DNA testing on my family. I had researched JW for years but could not come up with a death certificate so no known father. In 2011 a fellow researcher came to my rescue and informed me of where I could locate the death certificate. My family had lived since 1850 in McDowell and Wyoming Counties. For some reason the death certificate was located in Summers County West Virginia. With the death certificate in hand I was able to discover who my great, great, grandfather was. The information on the death certificate did not match up with what I had so I had to go about researching every bit of information on the certificate to prove that this was in fact my great, grandfather's death certificate. I wa!
s able to do that. The name John W. Simpson was correct. The mother was listed as Betsie Simpson, my great, great, grandmother was Elizabeth Simpson but she had been called Betsie and the 1850 Tazewell Census also lists her as Betsie so that checked ok. The informant on the certificate was Richard Simpson. John Walden Simpson and his first wife Jane Mullins, did in fact have a son named Richard Simpson, who married Martha Gross and lived in Summers County WV. The death certificate gave a place of burial as Hedriche Cemetery, MT. View, summers County. I located the funeral home and verified that John W. Simpson and Martha Simpson were in fact buried there. Martha was Martha Lester, JW's second wife. The date of birth was 1850, all other records indicated that the date of birth was 1854. I accepted this as the actual date of birth because the information came from his son who would have known. (although this would pose a problem latter on). By being born in 1850 it p!
laced his mother as being 13 or 14 when he was born. Everything check
ed out and accepted as fact. This was my great, great grandfathers deatch certificate. But there was just one problem. The father of John W. Simpson was listed as Attie Christon. This threw me, if this were true then Simpson was not our real last name. Elizabeth Simpson JW's mother had given JW her last name and not that of his father. So now I had to find out who Attie Christon (actually Christian) was. and to do that I had to make sure that the Christian name wasn't just some put on the death certificat to give my great, grandfather a father rather than Unknown. This would require the taking of a DNA test. Another reason for taking the test was to establish that JW and his sister Mary Lucinda were not the result of incest or other family involvement. There had been a rumor circulating that one of our family married a cousin. It was only natural and understandable that we would have to look at all angles no matter how sensitive it may be. In genealogy research o!
ne must be prepared to disvoer all kinds of information that may not be to ones likeing. The Y-DNA test was taken and came back with the results of every close match was connected to the Christian family. So I began my search for Attie Christian.
I discovere two Attie Christians that fit the profile for time, location and possible inter family relationships. One was Attie Franklin Christian, he died as a child so that ruled him out and the other was Addison "Attie" Bailey Christian. Addison Christian fit the profile perfectly. His family lived in Tazewell Virginia as did Elizabeth and her family. Elizabeth's brother went to live and work on the farm of Margaret Christian in McDowell County in 1850. Margaret Christian was the 2nd wife of Addison's father. Elizabeth left Tazewell and stayed with her brother on Margaret Christians farm where she had JW in 1850. Question, was she pregnant and went to McDowell to be with here brother or did she become pregnant in McDowell County? Addison Christian was married to Rebecca Christian in 1849 and they had there first child in Tazewell. they then also moved to McDowell County in 1850. Addison was 8 or 9 years older than Elizabeth. Elizabeth was 13 or 14. Elizabeth h!
as a 2nd child in 1856, Mary Lucinda Simpson. Again using her last name and not that of the father. Records indicate that she had Mary in 1855, McDowell County, but latter research shows that according to Tazewell County records she was born in July 1856 in Tazewell County not McDowell County. Because Mary was female, we can only assume that Addison was her father as well. Addison "Attie" Bailey Christian, died in 1863 at Bunker Hill. Elizabeth never married, nor did she have any more children, she left McDowell County around 1860 and moved to Wyoming county working in the Short household as a domestic servant. Was Elizabeth in love with Addison Christian, did she pine after him having yet another child by him while he continued to be married to Rebecca and have many other children by her or was JW the result of forced affection. We will never know but it was not uncommon for women to have children by other men and still find a husband, yet Elizabeth chose to never ma!
rry or have other children. Even after Addison's death in 1863 Elizab
eth did not marry. Elizabeth died in 1907 she was a midwife at the time of her death. Ironically Mary Lucinda went on to have two children out of wedlock before marrying Solomon Mullins.
I believe that the DNA results and the document showing Attie Christian as the father of JW Jr. is convincing enough evidence to consider Addisonj "Attie" Bailey Christian the father of JW. Interestingly enough my father was named Addison D. Simpson, my grandfather was Jerry Mastin Simpson. I never knew where the name Addison or Mastin came from.
For now, the only way to conclude that Addison Christian and all the other Christians are of the same stock will be for a direct male descendent of Daniel Christian or Addison Christian to take the Y-Chromosome DNA test. If there DNA matches my DNA then we have our answers.
For now all I can go on is my own DNA matches which would conclude that I am a Christian by blood line and stock, I am related to the Christian Family of the Isle of Man and I do go back to Scandanavian descent. If Addison "Attie" Bailey Christian is my great, great, grandfather then he is not of Native American Stock and also goes back to the Isle of Man although possibly via England. On my maternal side I am of British Isle descendency and German. I know for a fact that my immediate family is West Virginian by birth except for one sister born in Ohio. My family lived in what is now West Virginia from 1850 until 1958. Prior to that we lived in Tazewell Virgnia,Tennessee and North Carolina. On every side of my blood lines we can be traced back to the late 1600's in America, except for my great, great, great, grandfather the father of Elizabeth Simpson who reportedly came from Ireland. But since he was my great, great, great grandmother's father it would be considered !
my maternal side.
I hope this helps answer some of your questions.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: LBridson
Surnames: CHRISTIAN
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/1888.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Hi Hannah
I am also trying to track down Martin CHRISTIAN and Anne Mc? from Nome Alaska. Have you found any more since you made this posting? I am wondering from the family stories whether Anne was a native.
Regards
L
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.
This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list.
Author: Kennith_Simpson
Surnames:
Classification: queries
Message Board URL:
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.christian/2104.1.1.2.1.2.1.2.1.1/mb.ashx
Message Board Post:
Yes I agree 100 % with your thought. My family had many stories of our Indian Ancestry yet not one shred of proof. One thing that must be established is that we can not be exact on dates. For instance I have one document showing Nathaniel Christian being born about 1730 while other documents show him born around 1726, all documents however show him as having died in 1779. I am matched with Nathaniel Christian by DNA Y-Chromosome,both via Y-Search and Ancestry.Com, handed down from father to son etc. My Y-Search DNA match is with Nathaniel Christian from the G. Payne family tree. My Ancestry.Com matches me up with Nathaniel J. Christian from the Fred Christian DNA and in the "Christian Family Tree". In my case I have a rather unique problem in that since 1850 my family surname has been Simpson not Christian. A joke I like to tell everyone is that when someone calls me a bastard I say yes but only on one side of the family. (A little Genealogy joke). My DNA test shows th!
at there hasn't actually been a Simpson on my male descendency for over 350 years. I can document via others who share the same DNA my connection to Charles Hunt Christian of Charles City Virginia and back to the Isle of Man. I can document the existence of two DNA matches that come down from Charles City Virginia and Goochland via the off spring of Slaves and members of the Christian family. Up to this date, my closest DNA match is in fact a descendent of a slave girl and James Allen Christian the son of George Daniel Christian, the Son of Charles Christian from Virginia. This is facinating because this link and one other are African American while I am what most people would refer to as White Anglo Saxon. I am satisfied with my connections to these families since they are supported by DNA evidence.
Please indulge me in the following since I have most likely stated it before. Fred Christian was the son of Marshall Ellis "Dick" Christian, Tennessee. Marshall Christian was the son of William Christian, Tennessee. William Christian was the son of Isom D. Christian, Tennessee. Isom Christian was the son of Nathaniel Christian, 1794, Tennessee. Nathaniel Christian was the son of Isham Christian 1778, Virginia. Isham Christian was the son of Nathaniel Christian 1726-1779 and Jane Ewing. Virginia. Nathaniel Christian was the son of Thomas Christian 1714-1743. Charles City Virginia. Thomas Christian was the son of Thomas Christian Sr. 1667-1736, Charles City Virginia. Thomas Christian Sr. was a half brother to Charles Christian 1664-1761. Thomas Christian Sr. was the son of Thomas Christian (?) 1636-1704, England, Isle of Man. Thomas Christian was the son of William Christian 1608-1663, Balderoma, Isle of Man.
Jason Medlock Christian (MRCA of 1, per Ancestry.Com. The great grandson of James Allen Christian, Alabama. James Allen Christian was the son of George Daniel Christian, 1762-1831, born in Goochland, Virginia, and died in Alabama. Geolrge Daniel Christian was the son of Charles Hunt Christian, 1710-1763, Goochland & Charles City Virginia. Charles Hunt Christian was the son of Thomas Christian, 1636-1694, Sledgby, Isle of Man England. Thomas Christian was the son of William Christian 1606-1663, Ronaldsway, Isle of Man. William Christian was the son of Ewan Christian 1579-1655,Ewanrigg Hall Cumberland England.
Both Fred Christian and James Allen Christian match up at William Christian, Balderoma, Isle of Man and Elizabeth Collier. A very important thing to keep in mind here is that Y-Chromosome DNA is handed down from father to son, so all male members of the line would carry the same DNA. Thus our relationship may be distant cousins yet we come from the same stock.
Because I am limited to 5000 characters I will have to end here and pick up on the next message.
Important Note:
The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.