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This came from another list I am on.
Jacque
listowner
==============================================================
Subject: [ARSEVIER] Copyright Laws
> Dear Unaware:
> In case you are not aware, educational organization, whose prime
mission
> is to educate rather than make a profit can get away with murder under
> existing copyright laws, especially if they are also an NPO, as are most
> churches and that includes the LDS church.
> Even worse of the thousands of "save the butterfly" type organizations
> that have sprung up in the past 20 odd years citing the same types of
> missions as their goals -- educating people about how the reduction in the
> butterfly population would have a negative impact on planet earth.
> These organizations are supported because our current population has
> more money than brains and there are more than enough people ready, able
and
> willing to fleece them out of it. This is nothing but a new form of
> legalized larceny and these organization are using every bit of
information
> they can lay their hands on to "keep the money rolling in." In most of
them
> the donations are eaten up in staff costs and the major benefactors are
> given titular positions which makes them feel important, something they
may
> or may not be in real life.
> As an example of what happened to me, the staff of a professional
> writers organization, of which I was once a member, stole 56 million bytes
> of copyrighted material from me in 1999 and the Feds would do nothing
about
> it. I was later to learn this type of conduct goes on daily and the
reason
> they get away with it is because of the many loopholes in the existing
> Copyright laws (17 CFR 502), as well as previous rather loose decisions in
> the courts concerning these statues.
> To be honest with you, there is no such thing as protected writings,
> regardless of what you may think and copyright statutes, notwithstanding.
> The only thing these really protect is the rights of commercial entities
> from getting robbed by other commercial entities and the violation must be
> so flagrant that even OJ's jury could see it was copyright infringement.
Do
> you understand what I mean?
> The key word in copyright infringement is "profit from" and unless
> someone or some entity actually profits from your work, there is nothing
you
> can do about it and even then the penalty is through civil action. You
can
> also bet that the LDS Church, Ancestry, ETC will not profit from what you
> think is your copyrighted work. That is assured.
>
Just thought you'd be interested in reading the below article about
genealogy research online. I can't decide if I agree or disagree with the
author.
Apparently if you disagree with the author you can email her at the bottom
of the page where the article is posted.
Jacque in SE Idaho
Here is a lead in to that it is all about, link is further down in the
message.
> "Nu? What's New? News About Jewish Genealogy from Avotaynu," Vol. 2, No.
13,
> June 24, 2001, edited by Gary Mokotoff. Mokotff reports "A few weeks ago,
I
> received e-mail from a reporter for the WALL STREET JOURNAL that said: `I
am
> . . . working on a story about genealogy . . . Specifically, my article is
> about the potential drawbacks to genealogy. I'm looking for:
> * people who have discovered surprises in their past that might have been
> difficult for them . . . to deal with
> * people who have searched out long-lost relatives, only to wish they
> hadn't found them . . .
> * people who feel that they have purchased genealogy products. . . that
are
> not what they are advertised to be
> * people who have had their DNA tested as part of their genealogy research
> . . .'
>
> Mokotoff continues, "My response to her was: `Frankly, I find your article
> has a very negative slant that will leave the
> reader with a misimpression that genealogy is not a joyful experience. Why
> don't you write instead about the members of
> your profession that are pedophiles, rapists and wife beaters.'The
reporter
> did not heed my advice. Her views on the
> disadvantages of genealogical research appeared in the WALL STREET JOURNAL
on
> June 15 and can be found on the Internet at
>
http://interactive.wsj.com/public/current/articles/SB992558970976621678.htm
> [TWO-LINE URL]
> She was rewarded for her efforts by appearing on the TODAY SHOW. If you
> disagree with her article, why don't you e-mail her and express your
> thoughts. Her e-mail address is at the end of the article." [Your editors
> think a message to the editor and publishers of the WALL STREET JOURNAL
might
> be more effective.]
>
>
>
>
> ==============================
> Ancestry.com Genealogical Databases
> http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist2.asp
> Search over 2500 databases with one easy query!
>
Thank you for that information. There is other information coming in about
all this and as I understand it and get it, I will try to keep you posted.
I would like to forward your below message to other lists, etc., but would
probably be infringing on some copyright law in doing so, althought you did
state the article, pages, etc. I don't know.
Jacque
----- Original Message -----
From: <Ghursey2(a)aol.com>
To: <CHATHAM-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2001 2:51 AM
Subject: Re: [CHATHAM] Disheartening news, to say the least
> Following is an article that you may wish to get and copy all of it.
> This was sent to me by someone else, so I don't know how much
> more was in the article......
>
> In the August 2001 issue of Smart Computing, pgs 89-91, there is an
article
> titled, "Legal Safeguards for Artists & Authors,"......
>
> (excerpt)
>
> "Information available on the Internet, if protected
> at all, is protected not by patent, but by copyright.
> Simply put, if an individual creates (or pays someone
> else to create) a work, then that individual has rights
> in that intellectual property. If you create such a
> property and place it on a Web site, then you are
> allowing viewers to download that property. But that
> does not mean you've transferred the rights to the person
> who's downloading the information. So, you cannot place
> on your Web site an intellectual property, such as a text,
> video clip, or graphic, that belongs to someone else,
> regardless of how you may have acquired it, and no one
> else can take your copyrighted property from your Web site
> and use it on his or hers."
>
> "Any work published since Jan. 1, 1978 need not contain a notice
> of copyright to be considered protected. Works created after
> Jan. 1, 1978, the copyright lasts for the lifetime of the creator,
> plus 70 years."
>
> "The bottom line is that if you create a work, that work is your
> property. If copyright can apply to it, it does apply. The author
> need not register it, and the work need not include a copyright
> notice."
>
> "Certain things are not copyrightable. Facts and ideas, titles,
> names, short phrases, and blank forms are by their very nature
> not eligible for copyright protection."
>
> In a message dated 06/26/2001 8:44:57 PM Central Daylight Time,
> hopkinsj(a)ida.net (Jacque Hopkins Wolski) writes:
>
> << Subj: [CHATHAM] Disheartening news, to say the least
> Date: 06/26/2001 8:44:57 PM Central Daylight Time
> From: hopkinsj(a)ida.net (Jacque Hopkins Wolski)
> Reply-to: CHATHAM-L(a)rootsweb.com
> To: CHATHAM-L(a)rootsweb.com
>
> I know as the listowner, I haven't posted much or made an appearance on
> these lists I host/own, but thought the below message was something all
> subscribers should be aware of if you were/are concerned about whether or
not
> any message you post to any mailing list or genconnect board that is
hosted
> by rootweb.com is copyrighted by you or rootsweb.com/myfamily.com. It is
> rather a rude awakening to me and because I am posting this message to a
list
> hosted by rootsweb.com I may not be your listowner if they get wind of
this.
> Some of you may not have a clue as to what is going on or don't care to
know
> about the politics within rootweb.com/myfamily.com and how the system
works,
> but for those of you who do, I am posting the forwarded message below.
>
> Jacqueline Hopkins Wolski
> hopkinsj(a)ida.net
> listowner
> ====================================================================
> Subj: Fwd: [ALPERRY] We all have been 'suckered' into the MyFamily
vortex!!
>
> -----------------
> Forwarded Message:
> Subj: [ALPERRY] We all have been 'suckered' into the MyFamily vortex!!
> Date: 6/25/2001 5:37:01 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>
>
> From: wandajoe(a)m-y.net (wandajoe)
> Reply-to: ALPERRY-L(a)rootsweb.com
> To: ALPERRY-L(a)rootsweb.com
>
>
> Hi, all listers!! This exchange of messages showed up on the SC
> board,
> today, and I am sure that you all, and many others, will want to see
> where
> the 'friendly take-over' by Ancestry and MyFamily has brought us!!
Can
> we allow it?? Exchange follows:
>
> """I thought this exchange might be of interest to anyone who had
posted
> *anything* on the GenConnect boards at Rootsweb (which is now owned by
> MyFamily.com). If you haven't visited the boards lately, Rootsweb's
> GenConnect boards have been merged with the message boards at
> Ancestry.com
> and MyFamily.com. There's a number of problems with the new set up,
some
> of which are just technical bugs, but some of which seem to be a bit
more
> troubling. Not the least of which is the copyright issue.
>
> Under Rootsweb's Terms of Service, the message poster owned their own
> post
> and retained copyright. This is the response from MyFamily.com
> concerning
> the new boards:
>
> Original Message Follows:
> | ------------------------
> | Ancestry.com contains graphics, information, data, editorial and
> other
> | content accessible by any Internet user and similar content which is
> | accessible only to our subscribing members, (the Content.) Whether
> in
> | the free section or in the subscription section of the Service, all
> | Content is owned and/or copyrighted by MyFamily.com, Inc., its
> | subsidiary CamRon, Inc , or third party providers and may be used
> only
> | in accordance with this limited use license. Ancestry.com is
> protected
> | by copyright as a collective work and/or compilation, pursuant to
> U.S.
> | copyright laws, international conventions, and other copyright
> laws...
> |
> |
> | I would like clarification on this copyright law.
> | Does this mean you think you "own" the postings made to the
> | MyFamily.inc sites?
> | Thank you,
> | Ramona Gayle Bayes Woods
>
> Dear ramonawoods(a)adelphia.net,
> |
> | Thank you for your e-mail. Yes we do.
> |
> | If there is anything else we can assist you with, please let us
> know.
> |
> | #Dave
> | Customer Solutions
> | MyFamily.com / Ancestry.com"""
>
> I am here to tell you, and #Dave at Customer Solutiions, this
statement
> of
> fact.
>
> Any information which I have placed, by query, or otherwise, on any
> rootsweb posting board, at any date, on any surname, or any group of
> surnames is MY PROPERTY!!
>
> Not only that, but any responses to my queries which I have received
from
> other posting members of the originally 'free' rootsweb boards, and
any
> responses to the queries of others from me are also MY PROPERTY!!
>
> Good old Dave and his bosses at MyFamily will have a very hard time
> convincing me of any other status for my writings and the writings of
> others which concern my own family tree!!
>
> If I find any information has been 'pirated' by them to any
publicatiion
> other than that authorized by me, in writing, there is likely to be
legal
> action, and that, very quickly!!
>
> When I came into the rootsweb orgaization as a 'user' and (I presume,
> also
> a 'member'), all the posting boards were free for the use of the
members.
>
> Then, along came Ancestry and MyFamily and bought the Rootsweb
services.
> At the time that happened, word was passed around that the rootsweb
> services would still be free. However, I can see that, if Dave and
his
> employers prevail, we all will soon be paying our annual 'dues' for
the
> Rootsweb 'free' services.
>
> Based on hind-sight, I really wish that the independent Rootsweb
group,
> several months ago, had asked users for a membership dues payment, to
> support their activities. Had that been done, we would not now be so
> concerned about the 'wolf in sheep-skin' which Ancestry and MyFamily
are
> now become!!
>
> So, fellow listers, let us be heard!! Unless you would rather be
> flim-flammed into having a free service, for a fat fee!!
>
> My regards to you all!! Joe DUKE >>
>
>
> ==== CHATHAM Mailing List ====
>
>
>
> ==============================
> Shop Ancestry - Everything you need to Discover, Preserve & Celebrate
> your heritage!
> http://shop.myfamily.com/ancestrycatalog
>
Following is an article that you may wish to get and copy all of it.
This was sent to me by someone else, so I don't know how much
more was in the article......
In the August 2001 issue of Smart Computing, pgs 89-91, there is an article
titled, "Legal Safeguards for Artists & Authors,"......
(excerpt)
"Information available on the Internet, if protected
at all, is protected not by patent, but by copyright.
Simply put, if an individual creates (or pays someone
else to create) a work, then that individual has rights
in that intellectual property. If you create such a
property and place it on a Web site, then you are
allowing viewers to download that property. But that
does not mean you've transferred the rights to the person
who's downloading the information. So, you cannot place
on your Web site an intellectual property, such as a text,
video clip, or graphic, that belongs to someone else,
regardless of how you may have acquired it, and no one
else can take your copyrighted property from your Web site
and use it on his or hers."
"Any work published since Jan. 1, 1978 need not contain a notice
of copyright to be considered protected. Works created after
Jan. 1, 1978, the copyright lasts for the lifetime of the creator,
plus 70 years."
"The bottom line is that if you create a work, that work is your
property. If copyright can apply to it, it does apply. The author
need not register it, and the work need not include a copyright
notice."
"Certain things are not copyrightable. Facts and ideas, titles,
names, short phrases, and blank forms are by their very nature
not eligible for copyright protection."
In a message dated 06/26/2001 8:44:57 PM Central Daylight Time,
hopkinsj(a)ida.net (Jacque Hopkins Wolski) writes:
<< Subj: [CHATHAM] Disheartening news, to say the least
Date: 06/26/2001 8:44:57 PM Central Daylight Time
From: hopkinsj(a)ida.net (Jacque Hopkins Wolski)
Reply-to: CHATHAM-L(a)rootsweb.com
To: CHATHAM-L(a)rootsweb.com
I know as the listowner, I haven't posted much or made an appearance on
these lists I host/own, but thought the below message was something all
subscribers should be aware of if you were/are concerned about whether or not
any message you post to any mailing list or genconnect board that is hosted
by rootweb.com is copyrighted by you or rootsweb.com/myfamily.com. It is
rather a rude awakening to me and because I am posting this message to a list
hosted by rootsweb.com I may not be your listowner if they get wind of this.
Some of you may not have a clue as to what is going on or don't care to know
about the politics within rootweb.com/myfamily.com and how the system works,
but for those of you who do, I am posting the forwarded message below.
Jacqueline Hopkins Wolski
hopkinsj(a)ida.net
listowner
====================================================================
Subj: Fwd: [ALPERRY] We all have been 'suckered' into the MyFamily vortex!!
-----------------
Forwarded Message:
Subj: [ALPERRY] We all have been 'suckered' into the MyFamily vortex!!
Date: 6/25/2001 5:37:01 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: wandajoe(a)m-y.net (wandajoe)
Reply-to: ALPERRY-L(a)rootsweb.com
To: ALPERRY-L(a)rootsweb.com
Hi, all listers!! This exchange of messages showed up on the SC
board,
today, and I am sure that you all, and many others, will want to see
where
the 'friendly take-over' by Ancestry and MyFamily has brought us!! Can
we allow it?? Exchange follows:
"""I thought this exchange might be of interest to anyone who had posted
*anything* on the GenConnect boards at Rootsweb (which is now owned by
MyFamily.com). If you haven't visited the boards lately, Rootsweb's
GenConnect boards have been merged with the message boards at
Ancestry.com
and MyFamily.com. There's a number of problems with the new set up, some
of which are just technical bugs, but some of which seem to be a bit more
troubling. Not the least of which is the copyright issue.
Under Rootsweb's Terms of Service, the message poster owned their own
post
and retained copyright. This is the response from MyFamily.com
concerning
the new boards:
Original Message Follows:
| ------------------------
| Ancestry.com contains graphics, information, data, editorial and
other
| content accessible by any Internet user and similar content which is
| accessible only to our subscribing members, (the Content.) Whether
in
| the free section or in the subscription section of the Service, all
| Content is owned and/or copyrighted by MyFamily.com, Inc., its
| subsidiary CamRon, Inc , or third party providers and may be used
only
| in accordance with this limited use license. Ancestry.com is
protected
| by copyright as a collective work and/or compilation, pursuant to
U.S.
| copyright laws, international conventions, and other copyright
laws...
|
|
| I would like clarification on this copyright law.
| Does this mean you think you "own" the postings made to the
| MyFamily.inc sites?
| Thank you,
| Ramona Gayle Bayes Woods
Dear ramonawoods(a)adelphia.net,
|
| Thank you for your e-mail. Yes we do.
|
| If there is anything else we can assist you with, please let us
know.
|
| #Dave
| Customer Solutions
| MyFamily.com / Ancestry.com"""
I am here to tell you, and #Dave at Customer Solutiions, this statement
of
fact.
Any information which I have placed, by query, or otherwise, on any
rootsweb posting board, at any date, on any surname, or any group of
surnames is MY PROPERTY!!
Not only that, but any responses to my queries which I have received from
other posting members of the originally 'free' rootsweb boards, and any
responses to the queries of others from me are also MY PROPERTY!!
Good old Dave and his bosses at MyFamily will have a very hard time
convincing me of any other status for my writings and the writings of
others which concern my own family tree!!
If I find any information has been 'pirated' by them to any publicatiion
other than that authorized by me, in writing, there is likely to be legal
action, and that, very quickly!!
When I came into the rootsweb orgaization as a 'user' and (I presume,
also
a 'member'), all the posting boards were free for the use of the members.
Then, along came Ancestry and MyFamily and bought the Rootsweb services.
At the time that happened, word was passed around that the rootsweb
services would still be free. However, I can see that, if Dave and his
employers prevail, we all will soon be paying our annual 'dues' for the
Rootsweb 'free' services.
Based on hind-sight, I really wish that the independent Rootsweb group,
several months ago, had asked users for a membership dues payment, to
support their activities. Had that been done, we would not now be so
concerned about the 'wolf in sheep-skin' which Ancestry and MyFamily are
now become!!
So, fellow listers, let us be heard!! Unless you would rather be
flim-flammed into having a free service, for a fat fee!!
My regards to you all!! Joe DUKE >>
I know as the listowner, I haven't posted much or made an appearance on these lists I host/own, but thought the below message was something all subscribers should be aware of if you were/are concerned about whether or not any message you post to any mailing list or genconnect board that is hosted by rootweb.com is copyrighted by you or rootsweb.com/myfamily.com. It is rather a rude awakening to me and because I am posting this message to a list hosted by rootsweb.com I may not be your listowner if they get wind of this. Some of you may not have a clue as to what is going on or don't care to know about the politics within rootweb.com/myfamily.com and how the system works, but for those of you who do, I am posting the forwarded message below.
Jacqueline Hopkins Wolski
hopkinsj(a)ida.net
listowner
====================================================================
Subj: Fwd: [ALPERRY] We all have been 'suckered' into the MyFamily vortex!!
-----------------
Forwarded Message:
Subj: [ALPERRY] We all have been 'suckered' into the MyFamily vortex!!
Date: 6/25/2001 5:37:01 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: wandajoe(a)m-y.net (wandajoe)
Reply-to: ALPERRY-L(a)rootsweb.com
To: ALPERRY-L(a)rootsweb.com
Hi, all listers!! This exchange of messages showed up on the SC board,
today, and I am sure that you all, and many others, will want to see where
the 'friendly take-over' by Ancestry and MyFamily has brought us!! Can
we allow it?? Exchange follows:
"""I thought this exchange might be of interest to anyone who had posted
*anything* on the GenConnect boards at Rootsweb (which is now owned by
MyFamily.com). If you haven't visited the boards lately, Rootsweb's
GenConnect boards have been merged with the message boards at Ancestry.com
and MyFamily.com. There's a number of problems with the new set up, some
of which are just technical bugs, but some of which seem to be a bit more
troubling. Not the least of which is the copyright issue.
Under Rootsweb's Terms of Service, the message poster owned their own post
and retained copyright. This is the response from MyFamily.com concerning
the new boards:
Original Message Follows:
| ------------------------
| Ancestry.com contains graphics, information, data, editorial and
other
| content accessible by any Internet user and similar content which is
| accessible only to our subscribing members, (the Content.) Whether
in
| the free section or in the subscription section of the Service, all
| Content is owned and/or copyrighted by MyFamily.com, Inc., its
| subsidiary CamRon, Inc , or third party providers and may be used
only
| in accordance with this limited use license. Ancestry.com is
protected
| by copyright as a collective work and/or compilation, pursuant to
U.S.
| copyright laws, international conventions, and other copyright
laws...
|
|
| I would like clarification on this copyright law.
| Does this mean you think you "own" the postings made to the
| MyFamily.inc sites?
| Thank you,
| Ramona Gayle Bayes Woods
Dear ramonawoods(a)adelphia.net,
|
| Thank you for your e-mail. Yes we do.
|
| If there is anything else we can assist you with, please let us
know.
|
| #Dave
| Customer Solutions
| MyFamily.com / Ancestry.com"""
I am here to tell you, and #Dave at Customer Solutiions, this statement of
fact.
Any information which I have placed, by query, or otherwise, on any
rootsweb posting board, at any date, on any surname, or any group of
surnames is MY PROPERTY!!
Not only that, but any responses to my queries which I have received from
other posting members of the originally 'free' rootsweb boards, and any
responses to the queries of others from me are also MY PROPERTY!!
Good old Dave and his bosses at MyFamily will have a very hard time
convincing me of any other status for my writings and the writings of
others which concern my own family tree!!
If I find any information has been 'pirated' by them to any publicatiion
other than that authorized by me, in writing, there is likely to be legal
action, and that, very quickly!!
When I came into the rootsweb orgaization as a 'user' and (I presume, also
a 'member'), all the posting boards were free for the use of the members.
Then, along came Ancestry and MyFamily and bought the Rootsweb services.
At the time that happened, word was passed around that the rootsweb
services would still be free. However, I can see that, if Dave and his
employers prevail, we all will soon be paying our annual 'dues' for the
Rootsweb 'free' services.
Based on hind-sight, I really wish that the independent Rootsweb group,
several months ago, had asked users for a membership dues payment, to
support their activities. Had that been done, we would not now be so
concerned about the 'wolf in sheep-skin' which Ancestry and MyFamily are
now become!!
So, fellow listers, let us be heard!! Unless you would rather be
flim-flammed into having a free service, for a fat fee!!
My regards to you all!! Joe DUKE