Hi Sharon,
The probable Edward Catley + Mary Greenhill marriage plus Thomas'
christening at Gt Chishall seems a very likely lead, especially as we
already have a Barley//Gt Chishall Catley connection with another Edward m
Rebecca Nunn there in 1816.
As for someone doing a lookup in the Essex Records in Chelmsford, I can not
remember if we have a willing Lister in that part of the Country or not.
Are there any UK Listers out there in easy reach of Chelmsford who could
take this job on please?
Regards
Tim
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com]On
Behalf Of Sharon White
Sent: 27 August 2008 11:35
To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] Hertfordshire Visit
Hi again Tim
I've just discovered that in fact the records for that period of time for
Great Chishill are in the Essex Record Office which is located in
Chelmsford! Do you know if there's anyone that maybe lives near there that
could just look up the marriage and christening(s) at all? It might not
yield anything but it seems that Edward and Mary (Greenhill)'s marriage and
Thomas's (and possibly others) christening could well be there.
Sharon
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com] On
Behalf Of Tim Cattley
Sent: 27 August 2008 08:50
To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] Hertfordshire Visit
Hi Sharon,
Glad you managed to track down the Meesden Records at HALS, I recall Tom D
indicating that they were going to be sent there, so it is good to learn
that this has now taken place.
Also glad to hear that the HALS/Catley Tree info "fits" but I take it this
does not in any way answer the queries we have from the Barkway//Valerie
Olesen data, if it had, am sure you would have said so by now?
Good news re Edward Catley and recognition by the CWGC, it is just a pity
that we have not been able to find any of his descendents but at least we
have 'closure' and hopefully his name will now be added to the Memorial in
Manor Park Cem.
Won't ask any more questions as do not wish to delay you but like Elaine, am
looking forward to your end result "round up" of data gathered.
Best wishes
Tim
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com]On
Behalf Of Sharon White
Sent: 26 August 2008 17:22
To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] Hertfordshire Visit
Hi Tim
Yes, Clavering is down on my list for the next visit (along with some other
places), as we didn't get there! Although it's close to Meesden, we had a
complete nightmare trying to find Meesden Church which could not be seen
easily at all. Eventually we found it hidden within an avenue of trees going
up a hill!! Basically, we spent a lot of time tracking it down and
afterwards went back to Anstey, so it's still 'pending'.
David Cattley not only showed me a copy of the Tamplin Tree, he also gave me
a copy of it! How lucky was that?! I studied it in some depth a couple of
nights ago and double checked everything else that I had about the Tree, and
apart from the one error, the rest of it IS basically accurate.
The HALS Catley Tree info DOES fit in....whew!! It also appears there is
another Catley descendant still in Anstey, Jennifer Ginn nee Catley and I
shall try to make contact with her in the near future.
I have now looked at everything we extracted and I need to now transmit all
this information so that it can be shared - I have to say though, that a few
more problems have been generated by the records too!! I'll come on to that
when I've put the data together to send as an attachment. I've also taken
164 photos(!) and I'm thinking of creating a website to share those and also
this recent information but I have to say I'm relying on Martin here,
because although I've got the ideas, I'm not sure I know how to do this!
Certainly I have managed to prove the link with Charles. It took some doing
though as the parish registers weren't listed as being at HALS and they only
went up to 1812 so you can imagine my complete dejection! Anyway, I asked at
the desk whether they had any recent acquisitions from Meesden and if not,
whether they had the vicar's phone number because I knew I had to see them
one way or another. Luckily, the baptisms for 1813-2007 had been deposited a
couple of months ago but hadn't yet been microfilmed so they got the
original register out for me - what a relief!!
Anyway, there it was! The Charles of Meesden was christened 1819 and was
definitely the son of John and Mary (Aylott) who had married in 1815. This
Charles is the one who married Susan Bentley (nee Martin) and then Mary
Chappel (nee May). So basically, looking at the Tamplin Tree, all that info
on the right hand side, linked to Charles b.1823 Anstey should be on the
left hand side, and the Anstey Charles definitely married Elizabeth (nee
Tolfts/Tofts)!
The other thing I have found is that concerning the surname, there are more
spelling variations than were first thought. Certainly the same person is
listed in one of the registers as CATLING, CATELEN and CATLEY. There is also
the spelling CHATLEY, CATLYN, CATLIN, CATLINE, CATELEY, KETLEY, and these do
seem to vary so much and are in the same registers, that they need to be
looked at I think. I do feel that Liz could have been on to something when
she found the marriage of James CATLINE to Alice JACKSON and I want to look
at the records of Buckland and Therfield in some depth to try to see what
might be thrown up there.
I did find the Removal Order for John Catley from Rushden to Barkway in
1719, but it didn't throw up much of a clue as to where he had originated
from, although he was married to Anne at the time. Searching the Rushden
records didn't yield anything either and we covered a wide range of years. I
did take a copy of it though anyway.
Question for Anthony: Did you ever get hold of the Settlement Notice for
William Catley, Naomi and family from Wheathampstead to St Katherine's
Creechurch at all? If not, I got copies of that while I was up there too as
I came across it.
The Royston Crow:
Original newspapers are not held for the period of time we wanted to search.
The only way of seeing the photo of Charles in 1919 was to look at the
microfilm, so I did that, took another copy of it from the film and also
photographed the screen to see if it would come out any better. It's not bad
actually, and I'll post it on my 'soon to be created website'! One tip I was
told is that if you photograph a newspaper photo on a microfilm, it can
become of a better quality if you print it and then scan it in on grayscale
and up the resolution as apparently it fills in any of the white dots from
the newspaper. I haven't tried this yet.
It was just such a worthwhile trip, though, Tim, and one of the best record
offices I have ever been in, in terms of service and ease of finding things.
I've had an e mail from the CWGC as well, and Edward HAS been recognized
following their submission to the Ministry of Defence, so that's good news.
I need to get back to them, which I will do this evening, to ask if Charles'
surname spelling is being altered too as they made no mention of that.
I'd better close for now as I've just noticed the time and I need to cook
the tea before the girls start moaning at me!!
Sharon
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com] On
Behalf Of Tim Cattley
Sent: 26 August 2008 15:04
To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] Hertfordshire Visit
Hi Sharon,
Just got back from four days at The County of Salop Steam Rally and read
your e-mail from Saturday.
Thought you would be impressed by how some of those Herts villages have
changed so little although the same can not be said for Clavering.
As for The Rev Tamplins Tree:- I take it that David Cattley showed you a
copy of it? Whilst it looks almost certain now that his tree IS incorrect,
I think that the general substance of it which centres upon the generations
Cat*ley parishioners of Anstey, is substantially accurate, he having taken
the Parish Records as his source, but he made the classic mistake of
assuming that the Charles born Meesden was infact an Anstey born one which
of course radically alters everything!
Glad to learn that you met up with David and his clan and that he acted as
guide for the day, he has been volunteering his services for quite some time
now, so it is good to hear that the link-up went ahead .........
Hope that the HALS Catley tree info "fits in" with what we have?
One question:- did you manage to prove the link re Charles?
That is:-- that Charles who married Susan Bentley 1849 was infact the son of
John Catley 1794-1837 who m Mary Aylott at Meesden in 1815?
Regards
Tim
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com]On
Behalf Of Sharon White
Sent: 23 August 2008 20:00
To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: [CATLEY] Hertfordshire Visit
Hi Tim and all
Well, we're back! We had a really fantastic time in Hertfordshire - the
villages are almost as they would have been over 100 years ago and they are
very peaceful! We got hold of lots of information at HALS too, and my huge
job tonight is to go through the records we extracted in some depth and
transfer all the data. From the information though, it is pretty conclusive
that the Tamplin Tree is in fact incorrect and that all his information had
been attached to the wrong Charles Catley!
I took absolutely loads of photos too and I think the best way of maybe
transmitting all of them will be to create a website and download them to
that so that everyone can view them. Martin and I also met David Cattley,
who was just wonderful! He was enormously helpful in taking us around the
villages and pointing out local landmarks, and poor David also had to suffer
trudging round the different graveyards too getting covered in mud looking
for the Cat(t)ley and other family members' graves! He gave up virtually a
whole day to help us in this way, so he deserves a very big thank you. We
also met David's brother Dennis, his wife Elaine and their cousin Edna, all
of whom were lovely. I cannot thank all of them highly enough and also the
staff in HALS who were excellent! I also managed to track down the Catley
descendant who works there, who produced her Tree for me to look at too!
So all in all, it was just a brilliant trip, so worthwhile and I really want
to go back up there as there was so much, believe it or not, that we still
need to do as my 'shopping list' was just so huge!
I will start to sort everything out tonight so that I can share everything
as soon as I can!
Sharon
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