Hi there Tim,
Re the DNA stuff I was trying to suggest the map I did in to past could be
used to geographically map the outliers from this exercise without any
reference to DNA.
Cheers
Jocelyn
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com] On
Behalf Of Tim Cattley
Sent: Sunday, 31 October 2010 1:41 a.m.
To: catley @rootsweb
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
OK Jocelyn,
I was not trying to belittle you but it will be quite time consuming.
Will send you a database update, it is not definitive but "as good as we
have got"
as far as a starting point for the exercise is concerned.
Re your previous comments on mapping the various Cat*ley trees and ditto on
the
dna analysis :- my take on the subject is that the dna tests have not told
us anything
more than we had already thought was the case.
We already knew that geographically the Cat*leys stem from a number of
widely
spaced epicentres such as Lincolnshire, Yorkshire, Somerset,
Herts/Essex/Cambs
and the London area and within these, we have some quite large trees already
researched . DNA tests have only proved that both the Lincolnshire ones are
genetically connected to each other but not to any trees out of that region.
Likewise, the Herts/Essex/Cambs ones look to be connected to eachother
but not to the Lincolnshire ones. In the case of the Yorkshire trees, again
we have
local matches which are not connected to the Lincs or Herts ones.
In the case of the Somerset Catleys, we are suffering from lack of dna
samples
with only one (Emery Catley tree done) of the "big three" trees tested but
this
one test shows us yet again, that they are of a different grouping.
The ones I feel sorry for are You/Anne and poor Bernie where your dna tree
samples match no other collections. On the bright side, we now have seven
distinct sets of different Catley dna out of eleven tests done.
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jocelyn and Bert Prvanov" <prvanov(a)xtra.co.nz>
To: <catley(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2010 10:42 AM
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
Hi there Tim,
I can promise it won't be done in 5 mins but I have the resolve to do it !
I
have
ancestry.com and whatever other freebees are out there as my tools. I
understand the importance of evidence in this exercise. Any other pointers
would be very welcome.
Jocelyn
-----Original Message-----
From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com] On
Behalf Of Tim Cattley
Sent: Saturday, 30 October 2010 10:18 p.m.
To: catley @rootsweb
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
Hi again Jocelyn,
If you are happy to undertake this, then I will provide you with data but
it
is a very time consuming task, have you the time and resolve to do it?
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jocelyn and Bert Prvanov" <prvanov(a)xtra.co.nz>
To: <catley(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2010 12:30 AM
Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
> Hi there Liz,
> I am happy to do that but I would need the most up to date spreadsheet.
>
> Jocelyn
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com] On
> Behalf Of lizcordingley
> Sent: Saturday, 30 October 2010 12:22 p.m.
> To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
>
> Hi Jocelyn,
> How about you work forwards and I'll work backwards. That way we can
> double
> check our notes. What do you think
>
> Liz
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jocelyn and Bert Prvanov" <prvanov(a)xtra.co.nz>
> To: <catley(a)rootsweb.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 9:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
>
>
>> Hi there,
>> I have often thought about this as well but doing so using an earlier
>> timeframe. If you encompassed the 1851 census it would be much easier
>> and
>> more reliable - less people, less mobile, and closer to the "source".
>> Starting closer to the source would include more Cat*ley trees as each
>> generation does not necessarily produce Cat*leys or males. A prime
>> example
>> of this is mine and Anne's Zachariah of Hackney tree. This tree will not
>> feature if you used the ~1850-1911 timeframes or even anything after
>> 1840.
>> There may will be unidentified cousins or great aunts and uncles out
>> there
>> but they could not be linked to this tree unless you looked at the data
>> prior to 1800.
>>
>> Maybe a two pronged approach would work, one prior to 1800 and the other
>> using ~1860-1911 ??
>>
>> I have often also thought about plotting the birth places of these
>> earlier
>> Cat*leys on a map much like I did with the Cat*ley DNA results. This
>> approach might be more useful if once this proposed exercise has been
>> undertaken and there are still outliers.
>>
>> Jocelyn
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: catley-bounces(a)rootsweb.com [mailto:catley-bounces@rootsweb.com]
>> On
>> Behalf Of Tim Cattley
>> Sent: Saturday, 30 October 2010 5:36 a.m.
>> To: catley(a)rootsweb.com
>> Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
>>
>> OK Liz,
>> Shall I do them in baches of ten years at a time?
>> Tim
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "lizcordingley" <lizcordingley(a)blueyonder.co.uk>
>> To: <catley(a)rootsweb.com>
>> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 5:02 PM
>> Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
>>
>>
>>> Hi Tim,
>>> Can you send me the details for the ones no accounted for only.
>>> Cheers
>>> Liz
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Tim Cattley" <felis(a)mypostoffice.co.uk>
>>> To: <catley(a)rootsweb.com>
>>> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 1:18 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi Liz,
>>>>
>>>> Glad you think it feasible and worth the effort. Am with you about
>>>> starting
>>>> at the 1911 census and tracking back from there.
>>>> So, the target window would be 1860-1910 ish.
>>>> Just had a quick reckon up with the outstanding (UK) births for this
>>>> 50
>>>> year
>>>> period and estimate it gives us about 600 to look at, which at first
>>>> impression sounds a trifle daunting but of course, is only an average
>>>> of
>>>> about 12/annum which is not bad I think.
>>>>
>>>> Tim
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "lizcordingley" <lizcordingley(a)blueyonder.co.uk>
>>>> To: <catley(a)rootsweb.com>
>>>> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 10:57 AM
>>>> Subject: [CATLEY] how many catley trees
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Tim
>>>>> I'm game. It would be helpful if you started at the 1911 census
and
>>>>> worked
>>>>> backwards.
>>>>> Liz
>>>>>
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