Hi Bangs Descendants,
While doing other Bangs / Carruthers research, I re-discovered this msg,
the subject of which has not been resolved, and two (2) BANGS Trees. Have
the intervening years served to cause a softening or acceptance of the Bangs
/ Carruthers relationship? There is NO doubt that Jonathan Bangs travelled
south fm Mass. w/John Carruthers in 1738 to New Bern NC, where he bought
land near to John Carruthers: (almost certainly for a seafaring enterprise
out of New Bern):
"Jonathan Bangs and John Carruthers bought land 1738 in New Bern, Craven
Co., NC next to each other and moved in 1739 from Mass to Nc."
From: "JackVButler" < jackvbutler(a)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Witherington] Query Bangs - Carruthers Evidence Proofs
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2002 09:22:22 -0500
References: <F114KTDYL05CfGHM2A7000060c5(a)hotmail.com>
Frankly, you both seem to be jumping to unsupported conclusions on the
lineage of Thankfull Covell.
Anne's position seems to be that because a female has not been previously
documented in various published works, she must not have existed - a
position that no one past the beginning stages of research should
comfortably support.
Barry, on the other hand, assumes that because Jonathan Bangs calls her
sister in his will that she must have been a Bangs. Now I admit that I have
not followed the Bangs thread, but her appearance in the will with the title
of sister could just as easily mean that she is the sister of Jonathan Bangs
wife, or the wife of a brother.
What you have here is an opportunity to expand the research on the Bangs
lineage, and it is a little silly to be forging fortifications from behind
which you will each challenge the other's position. So far, neither of you
really has a serious foundation for a strong position. You need more data.
----- Original Message -----
From: Barry Wetherington < cbarrywether(a)hotmail.com>
To: < WITHERINGTON-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2002 4:29 AM
Subject: [Witherington] Query Bangs - Carruthers Evidence Proofs
Hi Anne,
I do understand your scepticism, but you have a difficult burden, trying to
prove a negative. We may test your good nature ('criticism w/a smile'). I
also think you must directly address the NC Wills abstracts copied by Betty;
in particular:
=============
ABSTRACT OF NORTH CAROLINA WILLS, 1690 - 1760 p. 16
BANGS, Jonathan Craven Co Oct 7 1743 June 15 1744 Wife Abiah
Daughter: Betty BANGS, Sister: Thankfull COVELL.
Executors: John CARRUTHERS(uncle), Abiah BANGS(wife).
Witnesses: Francis BRINKLEY, Jno. CARRUTHERS, Jo. Rd. HICKSON.
Clerk of the Court: W. ROUTLEDGE.
Coat of Arms on seal.
and also:
BANGS, Abiah, widow of Jonathan Craven County June 3, 1755.
Cousin: Elizabeth HOBBS ("my lot in Newbern Town").
Daughter: Betty BANGS.
Sisters: Elizabeth and Mary CARRUTHERS.
Brothers: John CARRUTHERS, William CARRUTHERS.
Executors: William CARRUTHERS (brother), Robert JONES, "oturney at law."
Witnesses: William CREEKMORE, Rubin HAMMONTREE, William CARRUTHERS, Sr
No probate.
=============
We've known about Abiah Bangs for a long time, which is why, a few
months ago, I started looking in the Bangs Archives, and discussed
w/Christine since we had been aware of this clue for some time but had not
pursured it. You mention Bangs is well documented - There are either 3 or 4
Bangs documented here:
BANGS, Jonathan Craven Co Oct 7 1743 June 15 1744
Wife Abiah (Bangs?)
Daughter: Betty BANGS
Executors: John CARRUTHERS(uncle), Abiah BANGS(wife).
and Sister: Thankfull COVELL.
Are these facts consistent w/that documentation? If not, then it may be
time to question the 'documentation' - speaking of which, I understand there
are some 60 boxes in the Yale collection. I doubt that collection been
reviewed for this issue.
And what about Christine's statement:
"Jonathan Bangs and John Carruthers bought land 1738 in New Bern, Craven
Co., NC next to each other and moved in 1739 from Mass to Nc."
There is more, more that is strong, but these statements would seem to
shift the burden to those who question the connections. A spirited but
professional discussion is an excellent method, an adversarial approach to
establish issues, such as the Genealogy of the Bangs - Carruthers Lines, and
those associated w/them.
Best wishes,
Barry
From: Grammgault(a)aol.com
To: cbarrywether(a)hotmail.com, Bangs-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: Bangs - Carruthers Evidence Proofs
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2002 00:05:54 EST
Hi Barry,
I am still a bit mystified on the proof that Content was a Bangs and
sister to Jonathan. I have checked all of the published books on the Bangs
family and have not been able to place the "Content" that has been mentioned
with this family. Bangs is a family that has been reasonably well
documented. in NEHGR, The Mayflower Series, Bangs Family in America by Dean
Dudley, "Great Migration Begins" by R.C. Anderson. I even checked the
Internet sites to no avail.
It is documented that the immigrant Edward (1) had 3 sons, John(2),
Joshua(2), and Jonathan(2), however only Jonathan(2) had sons that lived to
marry and have children.
They were Edward(3) who m. Ruth Allen, Jonathan(3), who m. Elizabeth and
Elizabeth Berry, and finally Samuel(3) who m. Mary Hinckley.
Edward(3) had a son Jonathan(4) bp. 23 May 1707 who m. Phebe
Hopkins(wid. of Samuel Bangs Jr.). This Jonathan died 7 Dec. 1745.
Jonathan(3) had a s. Jonathan b. Dec. 1698. It is possible that this is
the Jonathan who m. Abiah Carruthers and noted a sister Thankful Covell in
his will. However there is no mention anywhere of a sister Content either in
his will, his fathers will or in any of the books on the Bangs family.
Samuel(3) did not have a son named Jonathan.
So, of the 3 sons, only one could have contributed the Jonathan in
question which if there is clear documention per his will connects back to
the original Edward. A marriage contract to Abiah would be added proof.
However, it still leaves the parentage of Content. I respectfully
question the supposition that she was a Bangs based solely on her marriage
to a Carruthers. Has a marriage contract been found that lists her as Bangs
or a will that lists her as formerly a Bangs.
I welcome all comments and criticisms with a smile.
Regards Anne
Barry
Barry Wetherington
PS: Here [BELOW] are 2 Bangs Trees and a msg from Debbie to me FYI, see
website / Links below, from an earliier email:
" . . . Would like to know your thoughts on this, have received family
sheets and on one it has a William Carruthers Married to and Elizabeth
Jones in 1762 in Bath Co. North Caroline Their children were William, John,
Abiah, Sarah, Prudence , Mary and Elizabeth, and it states that Abiah was
married to Jonathan Bangs and list his death as 1796- with will. Sarah
Carruthers married to a Soloman Rew and them to a Vineyard Bond . And John
married to an Elizabeth Dawson and them to a Patty Carraway. This was from
a family sheet I received along with others name on papers was a Bill J
Crouthers, sources are early records NC vol 1 , page 5 Return of probate of
wills & administration-Beaufort co NC -1763- 1772."
Excellent stuff Debbie, & following up recent (today) Carruthers msgs, I
believe we were looking at ~ "wills & administration-Beaufort co NC,-1763-
1772" type Carruthers data recently:
http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/CARRUTHERS/2005-04
http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/CARRUTHERS/2005-05
http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/CARRUTHERS/2005-03/1112335416
==================
Jonathan Bangs will of 1743; Abiah BANGS will 1755, widow of Jonathan BANGS
http://www.lib.ecu.edu/ncc/historyfiction/document/gra/entire.html
Hi bbb, Very informative, well put together Bangs site:
http://nancin0.tripod.com/Genealogy/id3.html
Your family? Can you identify this Jon Bangs? (see below)
http://htmlgear.tripod.com/guest/control.guest?a=sign&u=nancin0&i...
==================
BANGS, JONATHAN.
Craven County.
October 7, 1743. June 15, 1744. Wife: ABIAH. Daughter: BETTY BANGS. Sister:
THANKFULL COVELL. Executors: JOHN CARRUTHERS (uncle), ABIAH BANGS (wife).
Witnesses: FRANCIS BRINLEY, JNO. CARRUTHERS, JO. RD. HICKSON. Clerk of the
Court: W. ROUTLEDGE. Coat of arms on seal.
. . . .
BANGS, ABIAH, widow of JONATHAN. [nee Abiah Carruthers]
Craven County.
June 3, 1755. Cousin: ELIZABETH HOBBS ("my lot in Newbern Town"). Daughter:
BETTY BANGS. Sisters: ELIZABETH and MARY CARRUTHERS. Brothers: JOHN
CARRUTHERS, WILLIAM CARRUTHERS. Executors: WILLIAM CARRUTHERS (brother),
ROBERT JONES, "oturney at law." Witnesses: WILLIAM CREEKMORE, RUBIN
HAMMONTREE, WILLIAM CARRUTHERS, SR. No probate.
==============
ABSTRACT OF NORTH CAROLINA WILLS
COMPILED FROM ORIGINAL AND RECORDED WILLS IN THE OFFICE OF THE SECRETARY OF
STATE BY J. BRYAN GRIMES SECRETARY OF STATE
PUBLISHED UNDER AUTHORITY OF THE TRUSTEES OF THE PUBLIC LIBRARIES
RALEIGH: E. M. UZZELL & Co., STATE PRINTERS AND BINDERS. 1910.
http://www.lib.ecu.edu/ncc/historyfiction/document/gra/entire.html
Barry
Barry Wetherington
http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/surname/c/carruthers.html
http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/surname/b/bangs.html
http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/surname/h/hobbs.html
============================
Descendants of Edward Bangs (3 wives)
Generation No. 1
EDWARD BANGS (JOHN , EDWARD RICHARD , THOMAS ) was born October 28, 1591 in
Panfield, Essex County, England, and died February 16, 1677/78 in Eastham,
Barnstable, Massachusetts. He married:
(1) UNKNOWN Bet. 1610 - 1615 in England. She was born 1596 in England, and
died Bet. 1623 - 1626 in Plymouth, Massachusetts, USA. He married:
(2) LYDIA HICKS 1627 in Plymouth, MA., USA, daughter of ROBERT HICKS and
MARGARET WINSLOW. She was born September 06, 1612 in Chichester, Sussex,
England, and died 1677 in Plymouth, PC. He married:
(3) REBECCA HOBART February 1676/77 in Eastham, Barnstable, Mass. She was
born December 26, 1611 in Wymondham, Norfolk, England, and died 1679 in
Eastham, Barnstable, Massachusetts.
. . . . . . . . . .
Children of EDWARD BANGS and LYDIA HICKS are:
vii. JOHN BANGS, b. Plymouth, PC; d. May 17, 1708, Eastham Barnstable, Mass;
m. HANNAH SMALLEY, January 23, 1660/61, Eastham, Barnstabe, Mass; b. June
14, 1641, Plymouth, PC.
viii. REBECCA BANGS, b. Abt. 1635, Eastham, MA., USA; d. October 19, 1677,
Massachusetts; m. CAPT. JONATHAN SPARROW, October 26, 1654, Pllymouth, PC;
b. October 26, 1633; d. March 21, 1705/06, Eastham Barnstable, Mass.
ix. SARAH BANGS, b. 1638, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. February 1682/83,
Yarmouth, Barnstable, MA; m. CAPT. THOMAS HOWES, 1656, Pllymouth, PC; b.
Yarmouth, Barnstable, MA; d. 1676.
x. CAPTAIN JONATHAN BANGS, b. 1640, Harwich, Barnstable Co., Mass.; d.
November 19, 1728, Brewster, Barnstable Co., Mass., USA.
xi. LYDIA BANGS, b. 1642, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. February 13, 1706/07,
Eastham Barnstable, Mass; m. BENJAMIN HIGGINS, December 24, 1661, Eastham,
Barnstabe, Mass; b. July 1640, Plymouth, PC; d. March 14, 1690/91, Eastham
Barnstable, Mass.
xii. HANNAH BANGS, b. 1644, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. 1677; m. JOHN
DOANE, April 30, 1662, Eastham, Barnstabe, Mass; b. Abt. 1635, Plymouth,
Plymouth, Mass; d. March 15, 1707/08, Eastham Barnstable, Mass.
xiii. LIEUT. JOSHUA BANGS, b. 1647, Plymouth, MA., USA; d. January 14,
1709/10, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; m. HANNAH SCUDDER, December 01, 1669; b.
1651.
xiv. BETHIA BANGS, b. May 28, 1650, Plymouth, MA., USA; d. WFT Est.
1651-1744.
xv. APPHIA BANGS, b. October 15, 1651, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. 1722,
Tauton, Bristol, Mass; m. (1) JOSEPH ATWOOD; m. (2) JOHN KNOWLES, December
28, 1670, Eastham, Barnstabe, Mass; b. 1641, Plymouth, PC; d. June 03, 1675,
Tauton, Bristol, Mass.
xvi. MERCY BANGS, b. October 15, 1651, Eastham, MA., USA; d. WFT Est.
1652-1745.
Generation No. 2
CAPTAIN JONATHAN BANGS (EDWARD , JOHN , EDWARD RICHARD , THOMAS ) was born
1640 in Harwich, Barnstable Co., Mass., and died November 19, 1728 in
Brewster, Barnstable Co., Mass., USA.
He married (1) MARY RIDER. He married (2) MARY HINCKLEY. He married (3)
SARAH UNKNOWN. She died June 11, 1719. He married (4) MARY MAYO July 16,
1664 in Harwick, Barnstable Co., Mass., daughter of SAMUEL MAYO and
THOMASINA LUMPKIN. She was born 1649 in Plymouth, MA., USA, and died January
26, 1710/11 in Brewster, Barnstable Co., Mass., USA. He married (5) RUTH
YOUNG 1720.
Child of JONATHAN BANGS and MARY HINCKLEY is:
i. CAPT. SAMUEL BANGS, b. July 12, 1680, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. June
11, 1750, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; m. MARY HINCKLEY, January 13, 1702/03,
Harwick, Barnstable, Mass; b. July 22, 1678, Barnstable, Mass; d. January
07, 1740/41, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
Children of JONATHAN BANGS and MARY MAYO are:
ii. EDWARD BANGS, b. September 30, 1665, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. May
22, 1746, Eastham Barnstable, Mass.
iii. THOMASINE BANGS, b. Abt. 1667, Eastham, Barnstable, Mass.; d. Bef.
1678.
iv. REBECCA BANGS, b. February 01, 1666/67.
v. JONATHAN BANGS, b. April 30, 1670, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d. May 11,
1670, Eastham Barnstable, Mass.
vi. MARY BANGS, b. April 14, 1671.
vii. CAPT. JONATHAN BANGS, b. May 04, 1673, Eastham Barnstable, Mass; d.
February 1736/37, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
viii. HANNAH BANGS, b. March 14, 1675/76.
ix. THOMASINE BANGS, b. May 05, 1678; m. JOSEPH BURGESS.
x. MERCIE BANGS, b. January 07, 1681/82, Eastham, Barnstable, Mass.; d. June
11, 1750.
xi. ELIZABETH BANGS, b. May 15, 1685.
xii. SARAH BANGS, b. August 1687; d. 1759; m. BENJAMIN COLLINS; b. 1687; d.
1756.
xiii. LYDIA BANGS, b. October 02, 1689; d. Abt. 1715; m. SHUBAEL HINCKLEY,
1712.
BETHIA BANGS (EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD, THOMAS) was born May 28, 1650 in
Plymouth, MA., USA, and died WFT Est. 1651-1744. She married REV. GERSHOM
HALL 1668 in Massachusetts. He was born March 05, 1647/48 in Yarmouth,
Barnstable, MA, and died October 31, 1732 in Barnstable, Barnstable,
Massachusetts.Child of BETHIA BANGS and GERSHOM HALL is:
i. BETHIA HALL, b. 1672, Yarmouth, Barnstable, Massachusetts; d. September
08, 1745, Harwich, Barnstable, Massachusetts.
Generation No. 3
EDWARD BANGS (JONATHAN, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD, THOMAS) was born
September 30, 1665 in Eastham Barnstable, Mass, and died May 22, 1746 in
Eastham Barnstable, Mass. He married (1) RUTH ALLEN. She was born 1669. He
married (2) RUTH MAYO January 16, 1738/39. She died August 17, 1747 in
Eastham Barnstable, Mass.Children of EDWARD BANGS and RUTH ALLEN are:
i. MERCY BANGS, m. BENJAMIN HATCH, August 11, 1715.
ii. DR. JONATHAN BANGS, m. PHEBE HOPKINS.
iii. JOSHUA BANGS, m. MEHETABEL CLARKE, June 18, 1713.
iv. CAPT. EBENEZER BANGS, m. ANNA SEARS, December 18, 1727.
v. RUTH BANGS, b. 1699; d. 1702; m. THOMAS YUNG.
CAPT. JONATHAN BANGS (JONATHAN\, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD, THOMAS) was
born May 04, 1673 in Eastham Barnstable, Mass, and died February 1736/37 in
Harwich, Barnstable, MA. He married (1) ELIZABETH UNKNOWN Abt. 1695. She
died Aft. May 1707 in Harwich, Barnstable, MA. He married (2) EXPERIENCE
BERRY 1710 in Harwick, Barnstable, Mass, daughter of JOHN BERRY. She was
born 1683 in Yarmouth, Barnstable, MA, and died Aft. March 1735/36.Child of
JONATHAN BANGS and ELIZABETH UNKNOWN is:
i. ELIZABETH BANGS, b. March 1710/11.
Children of JONATHAN BANGS and EXPERIENCE BERRY are:
ii. JOHN BANGS, b. August 11, 1714, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
iii. JAMES BANGS, b. April 04, 1716, Harwich, Barnstable Co., Mass.; d.
February 09, 1741/42, Harwich, Barnstable Co., MA.
iv. MARY BANGS, b. March 12, 1716/17, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
v. HUBBARD BANGS, b. March 12, 1716/17, Harwich, Barnstable, MA; d. March
25, 1718, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
vi. ABNER BANGS, b. August 01, 1720, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
vii. SAMUAL BANGS, b. September 23, 1722, HC, Massachusetts, U.S.A.; d.
March 01, 1787, The Oblong, Dutchess, NY; m. HANNAH WING, April 05, 1744,
Harwich, Barnstable, MA; b. May 07, 1724, Harwich, Barnstable, MA; d.
October 29, 1757, Fredericstown, NY.
viii. MERCY BANGS, b. November 05, 1724; m. JEREMIAH LINCOLN, December 06,
1744.
BETHIA HALL (BETHIA BANGS, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD, THOMAS) was born
1672 in Yarmouth, Barnstable, Massachusetts, and died September 08, 1745 in
Harwich, Barnstable, Massachusetts. She married KENELM WINSLOW January 05,
1688/89 in Harwich, Barnstable, MA. He was born August 09, 1668 in Yarmouth,
Barnstable, MA, and died March 20, 1728/29 in Yarmouth, Barnstable, MA.Child
of BETHIA HALL and KENELM WINSLOW is:
i. BETHIAH WINSLOW, b. Abt. 1691, Yarmouth, Barnstable, PC; d. June 19,
1720, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
Generation No. 4
ELIZABETH BANGS (JONATHAN, JONATHAN, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD, THOMAS)
was born March 1710/11. She married ICHABOD VICKERY 1729. Children of
ELIZABETH BANGS and ICHABOD VICKERY are:
i. DORAS VICKERY.
ii. ICHABOD VICKERY.
iii. THOMAS VICKERY.
iv. TIMOTHY VICKERY, b. November 09, 1729.
v. BENJAMIN VICKERY, b. September 24, 1731.
vi. JOSEPH VICKERY, b. March 19, 1732/33.
vii. DAVID VICKERY, b. August 18, 1738.
viii. ABNER VICKERY, b. August 26, 1740.
JAMES BANGS (JONATHAN, JONATHAN, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD, THOMAS) was
born April 04, 1716 in Harwich, Barnstable Co., Mass., and died February 09,
1741/42 in Harwich, Barnstable Co., Massachetts. He married (1) BERTHIAH
WING February 07, 1735/36 in Harwich, Barnstable, Co., Massachetts, daughter
of JOHN WING and BETHYAH WINSLOW. She was born January 22, 1715/16 in
Harwich, Massachuetts, U.S.A.. He married (2) BETHIAH WING February 07,
1735/36 in Harwich, Barnstable, MA, daughter of JOHN WING and BETHIAH
WINSLOW. She was born January 22, 1715/16 in Harwich, Barnstable,
MA.Children of JAMES BANGS and BERTHIAH WING are:
i. REUBEN BANGS, b. June 28, 1736, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
ii. JAMES BANGS, b. 1738, Harwick, Barnstabale Co., Massachetts, U.S.A.; d.
1810, Stanstead, PQ., CANADA.
Child of JAMES BANGS and BETHIAH WING is:
iii. JOSHUA8 BANGS, m. THANKFUL WING.
BETHIAH WINSLOW (BETHIA HALL, BETHIA BANGS, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD,
THOMAS) was born Abt. 1691 in Yarmouth, Barnstable, PC, and died June 19,
1720 in Harwich, Barnstable, MA. She married JOHN WING March 05, 1712/13 in
Harwich, Barnstable, MA. He was born 1680 in Yarmouth, PC, and died June 12,
1758 in Harwich, Barnstable, MA.Children of BETHIAH WINSLOW and JOHN WING
are:
i. MERCY WING, b. December 25, 1713, Harwich, Barnstable, MA; d. Bef.
November 13, 1757, Harwich, Barnstable, MA; m. SAMUEL WING, May 03, 1733,
Harwich, Barnstable, MA; b. August 1694, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
ii. BETHIAH WING, b. January 22, 1715/16, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
iii. REBECCA WING, b. March 26, 1718, Harwich, Barnstable, MA; d. Bef. 1757,
Harwich, Barnstable, MA; m. LOT CHASE, December 28, 1738, Harwich,
Barnstable, MA; b. March 11, 1715/16, Yarmouth, Barnstable, MA; d. March 25,
1749.
iv. JOHN WING, b. June 08, 1720, Harwich, Barnstable, MA.
Generation No. 5
JAMES BANGS (JAMES, JONATHAN, JONATHAN, EDWARD, JOHN, EDWARD RICHARD,
THOMAS) was born 1738 in Harwick, Barnstabale Co., Massachetts, U.S.A., and
died 1810 in Stanstead, PQ., CANADA.
He married SUSANNAH HALLET March 10, 1757 in Barnstable, MA, daughter of
SAMUEL HALLETT and SUSANNAH CLARK. She was born 1738 in Yarmouth,
Barnstable, MA, and died in Stanstead, PQ., CANADA.Children of JAMES BANGS
and SUSANNAH HALLET are:
. . . .
============================