Hello Cousins!
Recently I person mentioned to me that it was inconceivable to him that someone would
place a grave marker with error filled information. He thought that the new marker
probably was more accurate.
I disagreed.
The DAR has actually issued a warning in the past that newer replacement grave markers are
not acceptable as proof because of the high error rates in the replacement markers.
I too have seen this same problem from people with good intent but using undocumented and
unresearched information. Especially from undocumented internet genealogies.
The key to any accurate grave marker is documentation! The same is for any replacement
marker!
In our genealogy ... Document, Document and Document!
Below is the example he and I discussed. The following is from my email with him.
Let us review what we know ...
In the 1900 US Census Jiles Bryant “Pap” Carpenter-199465 is listed as being born in Feb
1853.
His death record indicates he was born Feb 1853 and that he died on 26 Oct 1929.
His original (aka older) grave marker shows 22 Feb 1853 as birth. Not 1863. And death as
26 Oct 1929.
The older marker birth date is supported by the Death record and 1900 Census showing Feb
1853.
The older marker death date is supported by the Death record showing 26 Oct 1929.
(FYI – I add in that the census records from 1860 to 1920 indicate his birth year mostly
as 1853 with one 1854 and one 1855. The 1853 in this case is consistent with those that
have their birthdays before the census date. Those born after the census date are often
listed as one year younger.)
The newer (smaller) marker shows birth as 22 Feb 1852 and death as 10 Oct 1929.
I would say the newer marker is in error.
Why is the newer marker in error? When I looked at a few on line genealogies, I found
those exact dates without documentation. Call them typos, call them what ever you want,
but they are undocumented.
And you know, I will always go with the documentation and not some undocumented internet
genealogies.
BTW – I made some suggested edits for the Find A Grave entry at:
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/33670206/jiles-bryant-carpenter
Please see the images there. You can see the old marker and the newer replacement marker
there.
John R. Carpenter
La Mesa, CA USA
Carpenter Cousins Project - Our main support page!
https://carpentercousins.com
Supporting documents
CENSUS: 1860 US Census - with parents
CENSUS: 1870 US Census - with parents
MARRIAGE: 1872
Name: Jesse B Carpenter [Jiles B Carpenter]
Gender: Male
Marriage Date: 11 Apr 1872
Marriage Place: Crenshaw, Alabama, USA
Spouse: Elizabeth Bracken
Film Number: 001288731
Source Information
Ancestry.com. Alabama, County Marriage Records, 1805-1967 [database on-line]. Lehi, UT,
USA:
Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2016.
Original data: Marriage Records. Alabama Marriages. County courthouses, Alabama.
CENSUS: 1880 US Census
Name: Giles Carpenter [Jiles Carpenter]
Age: 25
Birth Date: Abt 1855
Birthplace: Alabama
Home in 1880: Oaky Streak, Butler, Alabama, USA
Dwelling Number: 410
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Self (Head)
Marital Status: Married
Spouse's Name: Cherety Carpenter
Occupation: Farmer
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Giles Carpenter 25
Cherety Carpenter 30
John R. Carpenter 6
Liler Carpenter 4
Obond Carpenter 2
Elias Carpenter 2
Coleander Carpenter 1/12
Source Citation
Year: 1880; Census Place: Oaky Streak, Butler, Alabama; Roll: 4; Page: 498B; Enumeration
District: 042
Source Information
Ancestry.com and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. 1880 United States
Federal Census [database on-line]. Lehi, UT, USA:
Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2010. 1880
U.S. Census Index provided by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints © Copyright
1999 Intellectual Reserve, Inc. All rights reserved. All use is subject to the limited use
license and other terms and conditions applicable to this site.
Original data: Tenth Census of the United States, 1880. (NARA microfilm publication T9,
1,454 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National Archives,
Washington, D.C.
CENSUS: 1890 US Census - burned
CENSUS: 1900 US Census
Name: Jiles Carpenter
Age: 47
Birth Date: Feb 1853
Birthplace: Alabama
Home in 1900: Lumbes Mills, Butler, Alabama
Ward of City: 4863
Sheet Number: 10
Number of Dwelling in Order of Visitation: 162
Family Number: 163
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Married
Spouse's Name: Clara A Carpenter
Marriage Year: 1873 <----------- 1872 - see MARRIAGE
Father's Birthplace: GA
Mother's Birthplace: Georgia
Occupation: Farmer
Months not employed: 0
Can Read: Yes
Can Write: Yes
Can Speak English: Yes
House Owned or Rented: O
Home Free or Mortgaged: F
Farm or House: F
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Jiles Carpenter 47
Clara A Carpenter 51
Opelia Carpenter 28
Elnora Carpenter 20
James I Carpenter 16
William B Carpenter 18
Juristho M Carpenter 12
Source Citation
Year: 1900; Census Place: Lumbes Mills, Butler, Alabama; Page: 10; Enumeration District:
0012; FHL microfilm: 1240004
Source Information
Ancestry.com. 1900 United States Federal Census [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA:
Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2004.
Original data: United States of America, Bureau of the Census. Twelfth Census of the
United States, 1900. Washington, D.C.: National Archives and Records Administration, 1900.
T623, 1854 rolls.
CENSUS: 1910 US Census
Name: Jiles B Carfenter [Jiles B Carpenter]
Age in 1910: 51 <----- 57 on image
Birth Year: abt 1859 [abt 1853]
Birthplace: Alabama
Home in 1910: Mckenzie, Butler, Alabama
Street: Georgianna and Adalusia
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Married
Spouse's Name: Charity Carpenter
Father's Birthplace: South Carolina
Mother's Birthplace: Georgia
Native Tongue: English
Occupation: Farmer
Industry: General Farm
Employer, Employee or Other: Employer
Home Owned or Rented: Own
Home Free or Mortgaged: Free
Farm or House: Farm
Able to Read: Yes
Able to Write: No
Years Married: 35
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Jiles B Carfenter 51
Charity Carpenter 60
Ophelia Carpenter 27
May Cabaniss 22
Jolan O Cabaniss 2
Ruby M Cabaniss 0
Source Citation
Year: 1910; Census Place: Mckenzie, Butler, Alabama; Roll: T624_3; Page: 6B; Enumeration
District: 0018; FHL microfilm: 1374016
Source Information
Ancestry.com. 1910 United States Federal Census [database on-line]. Lehi, UT, USA:
Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2006.
Original data: Thirteenth Census of the United States, 1910 (NARA microfilm publication
T624, 1,178 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National
Archives, Washington, D.C. For details on the contents of the film numbers, visit the
following NARA web page: NARA.
CENSUS: 1920 US Census
Name: Jiles B Carpenter
Age: 66
Birth Year: abt 1854
Birthplace: Alabama
Home in 1920: McKenzie, Butler, Alabama
Street: Geargiana Mc Kenzie road
House Number: Farm
Residence Date: 1920
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Married
Spouse's Name: Carrie Carpenter
Father's Birthplace: South Carolina
Mother's Birthplace: Georgia
Able to Speak English: Yes
Occupation: Farmer
Industry: General farm
Employment Field: Own Account
Home Owned or Rented: Own
Home Free or Mortgaged: Free
Able to Read: Yes
Able to Write: Yes
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Jiles B Carpenter 66
Carrie Carpenter 70
Source Citation
Year: 1920; Census Place: McKenzie, Butler, Alabama; Roll: T625_4; Page: 14A; Enumeration
District: 19
Source Information
Ancestry.com. 1920 United States Federal Census [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA:
Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2010. Images reproduced by FamilySearch.
Original data: Fourteenth Census of the United States, 1920. (NARA microfilm publication
T625, 2076 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National
Archives, Washington, D.C. For details on the contents of the film numbers, visit the
following NARA web page: NARA.
DEATH:
Name: Jiles Carpenter
Birth Date: Feb 1853
Birth Place: Alabama
Death Date: 26 Oct 1929
Death Place: Butler County, Alabama
Death Age: 77
Occupation: Farming
Race: White
Marital Status: Widowed
Gender: Male
Father Birth Place: Alabama
Spouse Name: Charity Carpenter
FHL Film Number: 1908473
Wills and Probates: Search for Jiles Carpenter in Alabama Wills & Probates
collection
Source Information
Ancestry.com. Alabama, Deaths and Burials Index, 1881-1974 [database on-line]. Provo, UT,
USA:
Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2011.
Original data:
"Alabama Deaths and Burials, 1881–1952." Index. FamilySearch, Salt Lake City,
Utah, 2009, 2010. Index entries derived from digital copies of original and compiled
records.
GRAVE: images plus bio picture with an impressive mustache.
Jiles Bryant “Pap” Carpenter
Birth: 22 Feb 1852 <--- SEE NOTE:
Death: 10 Oct 1929 (aged 77) <--- SEE NOTE:
Burial: Elizabeth Cemetery, McKenzie, Butler County, Alabama, USA
Memorial #: 33670206
Family Members
Spouse
Charity Elizabeth Brackin Carpenter 1849-1922
Children
John R Carpenter 1874-1939
Amnitious Iola Carpenter Lee 1875-1954
Irene Ophelia Carpenter Cabaniss 1877-1967
Lyas Daniel Carpenter 1878-1957
Eldora Carpenter Mckenzie 1880-1958
Maintained by: Find A Grave (8)
Originally Created by: David Woody (46846767)
Added: 9 Feb 2009
URL:
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/33670206
Citation: Find A Grave, database and images (
https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 14
November 2018), memorial page for Jiles Bryant “Pap” Carpenter (22 Feb 1852–10 Oct 1929),
Find A Grave Memorial no. 33670206, citing Elizabeth Cemetery, McKenzie, Butler County,
Alabama, USA ; Maintained by Find A Grave (contributor 8) .
NOTE:
His original marker shows 22 Feb 1853 as birth. Not 1863. And death as 26 Oct 1929. The
newer smaller marker placed with the older one is in error.
Suggestions made.