Enough already, can we please just get back to genealogy now.
On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 8:54 AM, Robin C via <carpenter(a)rootsweb.com> wrote:
Hello Sherri:
Hang in there!. I've been on this list
for a lot of years. Mostly the list is
silent. Sometimes it's highly
informative. Occasionally it's mis-used or
abused....but it's pretty costless to delete
unwanted diatribes, so long as they aren't too
common. Antagonistic exchanges always subside in due course.
I have a loose rule-of-thumb that if a
message goes on for more than about 100 words
without naming a name, or specifying a location
or date, it's probably off-topic. (In general,
the longer the message the more likely it's a polemic.)
Now we've lost our best
genealogist. I'm sad about that, too. I'd hate to lose more.
Robin
P.S. I know just how you feel when you walk your
ancestors' land. I've done that in Orange County
NY, and it really brings abstract history into the present.
At 11:03 AM 1/19/2015, you wrote:
>Fellow genealogists, I am very sad. I am fairly
>new to genealogy and had hoped that this forum
>would be helpful in my pursuits. It seems that
>the last month or so, I haven't seen much other
>than folks disagreeing with each others
>worldviews and what should/should not be in this
>forum. I see both sides, but am not interested
>in defending either. Generally (in any forum),
>if someone posts something I don't agree with, I
>don't respond (and here I am responding!)
>because that adds fuel to the fire. In short,
>I am new to this and am considering
>unsubscribing and looking for another list to
>join. (I do appreciate the information about
>the DNA projects, but that's a little over my
>head for now.)I have traced my Carpenter lineage
>from William of Rehoboth, and living in
>Massachusetts has enabled me to go to Rehoboth
>and Putney, Vermont to verify information I've
>found. I have a sister on the west coast and
>relatives in between that have helped me to
>locate documents and verify other
>information. I do not know if my research
>lives up to the expectations of some on this
>forum, but I have enjoyed it thoroughly and was
>able to present my father with a notebook loaded
>with stuff for his 80th birthday. I was able to
>locate and walk the land that my 4th
>great-grandfather farmed in Putney. I had
>hoped that this forum would be encouraging and
>informative. So far, I have found little of
>that here. But I am patient and full of hope
>that this group can put aside differences so
>that novices like myself can learn and grow in
>the important endeavor of documenting our common
>(and uncommon!) histories. Sherri Carpenter
>DunganSpringfield, MA On Monday, January
>19, 2015 3:20 AM,
>"carpenter-request(a)rootsweb.com"
><carpenter-request(a)rootsweb.com>
>wrote: Today's Topics: Â 1. Re: Darkness &
>light (Robert & Donna Klaesson) Â 2. I'm Out
>(GeneZub(a)aol.com)
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Message: 1 Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2015 14:52:02 -0800
>From: Robert & Donna Klaesson
><angelheart9(a)sbcglobal.net> Subject: Re:
>[CARPENTER] Darkness & light To: John R
>Carpenter <jrcrin001(a)cox.xn--net>,-pza Â
>Â "carpenter(a)rootsweb.com" Â Â
>Â <carpenter(a)rootsweb.com> Message-ID: Â Â
>Â
><1421621522.20694.YahooMailNeo(a)web185305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 What a
>blessing you are to so many, John! Thank you
>for being YOU and for sticking up for yourself
>and those of us who STILL want to have FUN with
>our genealogy:) Donna Klaesson On Sunday,
>January 18, 2015 4:10 PM, John R Carpenter via
><carpenter(a)rootsweb.com> wrote: Â The last
>paragraph of Michael J. Leclerc's Genealogy News
>(Blog) cited by Gene. "Worse still is that many
>of these individuals are actively working
>against the promotion of quality research. They
>attack anyone would dare to question inferior
>research techniques as ?elitist.? By the same
>token, many experts are too quick to denigrate
>anyone who questions anything new and different.
>We must find a balance, and do our best to
>promote quality research techniques so that even
>beginners can understand how to be confident in
>their research findings." In American society
>there is a gathering dis-trust in government and
>our leaders. Those in the used car profession
>now have higher respect than most of
>Congress. Add in those professionals
>(professors, doctors and such) who side with and
>distort their works toward the political and we
>have many having far more distrust in our
>leaders. There is a feeling among many that
>those we used to look up to no longer have the
>common good and the betterment of the Country.
>Many feel betrayed, disrespected and resent
>being told that they "can not understand such
>complicated things" because they are not
>educated enough, smart enough or in other words
>not an elite. I have two people who I know that
>are biologists. Both of them dislike each
>other because the other is "stupid." Both are
>Mensa level smart. Each has a specialty that
>is so unique that the number of peers in that
>specific area is in the low hundreds from around
>the world. Out of the 7 billion (7,
>000,000,000) people around the world only a very
>small fraction can understand and work at their
>level. In their minds, even people with science
>degrees in biology and those with masters and
>even doctorates are not at those levels. I.e.
>they are stupid. Science has exploded so fast
>and so far that most textbooks on advanced
>topics are out of date by the time they are
>published. Attitude is the little thing that has
>the biggest difference. When those so far
>advanced begin to believe they are smarter and
>know what is best for others then comes trouble.
>For example, Here in America we had eugenics
>before the NAZIs started their programs. We were
>sterilizing, lobotomizing and racially profiling
>until enough people realized that those victims
>had lost their human and Constitutional rights
>because someone thought they knew better than
>the rest of us. There has been so much change in
>science, the law and around the world that most
>people can not keep up. Too many see that the
>changes, right wrong or indifferent is placing
>more and more controls (restrictions) on them,
>their families, their work, and country. The
>media has contributed to this by the round the
>clock, 24 hours a day news cycle. In the 1970s
>and 80s we had them pushing to be afraid of
>global cooling and now it is global warming we
>must be afraid and give up our hard earned money
>for. Yes, there is a growing distrust because
>human nature has not changed very much in the
>last 10,000 years. There will always be
>someone smarter (eventually), better and
>thinking they should control others for their
>own good. Some will always vie for power over
>others and we know that power corrupts. Then we
>have those saying there is no right or wrong
>just shades of gray. We have those that say
>religion is an opiate of the people. We have a
>dumbing down and grade inflation in education
>where everyone wins a trophy (reward) and it is
>never your fault but someone else is the
>problem. We have some of the so called best
>minds seeming dumbing down society while science
>and other areas are advancing
>astronautically. We have mind numbing
>education and media and the divide seemingly
>grows worse every year. We are a people being
>pushed, and pulled two radically different
>directions and the divide and distrust is
>growing. Maybe we should just pass a law? The
>old League of Nations approved a resolution that
>disallowed or banned war. Not to long after that
>came World War II and hosts of other conflicts
>and human misery. Yes, we have a right to
>mis-trustful of those that claim their way is
>better. When elitists or "many experts are too
>quick to denigrate anyone who questions anything
>new and different." This causes distrust. And
>yes, we must "find a balance" and attitude is
>the little thing that makes a big difference. It
>works both ways. Personally I think science
>should never be influenced or dominated by
>political correctness. Personally, I think the
>rights of the common man are equal to the rights
>of the smartest and dumbest of
>all. Personally, I believe the Constitution of
>the United States of America and its Bill of
>Rights puts restrictions on governments and the
>people and encourages others to respect others.
>Today the balance is out of whack. Maybe in some
>areas we need to slow down, stay focused on the
>basics and be conservative in interpretation of
>the facts and more tolerant for rights granted
>under the Constitution. Maybe we need less
>tribal affiliation and more working toward the
>common good. Attitude works both ways. We need
>to educate ourselves and learn. All of us learn
>at different rates and have different interests.
>If we forget or allow our common ground or base
>to be disrupted or destroyed then comes chaos. A
>little here and a little there makes a huge
>difference over time. This is true in
>genealogy, family history and in life. If you do
>not have a candle, find another way to enlighten
>the darkness. Become involved in life, in what
>is going on around you and in society. You can
>have an impact. You can make things better,
>especially for our children by choosing light
>over darkness. Remember to slow down and smell
>the roses now and then, crack a smile, have a
>little fun, but never ever forget your goals! :)
>John R. Carpenter La Mesa, CA USA PS An old
>Chinese proverb says give a man a fish, feed him
>for a day. Teach a man to fish, feed him for
>life. I say give a man some genealogy, he is
>happy for a day. Teach him to do genealogy and
>he is hooked for life! -----Original
>Message----- From: Gene Zubrinsky via Sent:
>Saturday, January 17, 2015 4:28 PM To:
>carpenter(a)rootsweb.com Subject: [CARPENTER]
>Darkness There is an ancient proverb that it is
>better to light a candle than curse the
>darkness. Some folks, however, seem to prefer
>the dark, feeling, for example, that having fun
>doing genealogical research is incompatible with
>doing it right. I don?t agree, and I don?t
>believe that John R. does, either. For those
>particularly resistant to intellectual exercise,
>perhaps these postings will be somewhat
>illuminating:
>http://blog.mocavo.com/2014/04/death-expertise
>Genea-Musings: Musings On Genealogy "Expertise,"
>"Elites" and Education Gene Z.
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>------------------------------ Message: 2 Date:
>Sun, 18 Jan 2015 23:30:49 -0800 From:
>GeneZub(a)aol.com Subject: [CARPENTER] I'm Out To:
>"carpenter(a)rootsweb.com"
><carpenter(a)rootsweb.com> Message-ID:
><D9BC27B6-F85C-4850-A556-BD0654EBA137(a)aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain;Â Â Â charset=us-ascii
>Deeply saddened by this mailing list's
>degeneration into a forum for social commentary
>and anti-intellectualism, I've had it. I'm
>out. Gene Z. Sent from my iPad
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