Dear Robin,
You asked ...
1. Do you know what is the source of the birth year 1745, not 1730? Not
that I doubt it...ABC has lots of such errors, but as I annotate, I like
to cite how/why a change is made.
Answer ...
1) Judge John Carpenter or John the Distiller was born 23 Feb 1745 in
goshen, Orange county, NY. George B. Carpenter of Chicago made a
corrective note on page 834 of the Carpenter Memorial (1898) that the 23
Feb. 1745 birth date was correct. The CM gives 3 June 1730 and Feb.
1745 on page 83 for this John. The 3 June 1730 date is speculated as an
earlier John Carpenter in that family who died as a child.
I agree that the notes I had did not reflect the changes correctly. I
made a note of the above.
You asked ...
2. Do you know what is the basis for connecting John in Orange Cty with
John in Washington Town near Albany?
Answer ...
2. While not clear in the Carpenter Memorial, it was stated in the notes
for John Carpenter that he "represented Orange County in the Colonial
Assembly in 1778 and he was also a Judge at one time in Orange county.
He moved to Washington Town, north of Albany, NY and went into the
distillery business and accumulated much property. He was a
man of note and held many important offices."
Amos B. Carpenter, the compiler of the CM and George B. Carpenter (#
4352 in the CM), the great grandson of the John Carpenter in question
felt that the data was accurate. As in many genealogies of the time,
where the data came from was not considered important. That corrections
were made to adjust errors in print suggests the data is more accurate
in this portion of the CM.
Misc 1 ...
Also, in case you fuss with such things as I do, the OC town Haverstraw
has a typo (missing S), and "Cromwall" should be Cornwall.
Ans. 1 ...
The typos are direct from the Carpenter Memorial. I have made a note of
the misspellings.
Misc 2 ...
Finally, it is my belief that Carpenter's Hall in Philadelphia is named
for carpenter tradesmen, not a surname.
Ans. 2 ...
You are right! See Web Page at:
http://www.ushistory.org/tour/_carpen.html
It reads partly ...
When Benjamin Franklin needed an architect to build his house, he turned
to master builder Robert Smith of the Carpenters' Company. Smith not
only belonged to the Carpenters' Company -- he designed their
headquarters, Carpenters' Hall. Founded in Philadelphia in 1724, the
Carpenters' Company was organized to share information about the art of
building, determine the value of completed work, hone architectural
skills, and help indigent craftsmen. Simulating the trade guilds of 18th
century England, the Carpenters' Company has held regular meetings for
over 275 years, making it the oldest trade guild in the country.
I am grateful for your asking. The corrections you helped bring forth
makes the data clearer and more accurate not only for Margaret Cass, but
for others.
Thank You!
John R. Carpenter
La Mesa, CA
Robin Carpenter wrote:
Hi John:
A couple of questions:
1. Do you know what is the source of the birth year 1745, not 1730? Not that I doubt
it...ABC has lots of such errors, but as I annotate, I like to cite how/why a change is
made.
2. Do you know what is the basis for connecting John in Orange Cty with
John in Washington Town near Albany?
Also, in case you fuss with such things as I do, the OC town Haverstraw
has a typo (missing S), and "Cromwall" should be Cornwall. Finally, it is
my belief that Carpenter's Hall in Philadelphia is named for carpenter
tradesmen, not a surname.
Robin
At 11:33 AM 2/20/00 -0800, you wrote:
>Dear Margaret,
>
>Here is what I have on Judge John.
>
>John R. Carpenter
>La Mesa, CA
>
> INDIVIDUAL DATA RIN:13065
>------------------------------------------------
> Name:John CARPENTER Judge Sex:M ID No:
> Birth:23 Feb 1745 Place:Goshen,Orange,NY
> Chr: Place:
> Marr: 1772 Spouse:Francis JOHNSON-13073
> Marr:31 Jan 1777 Spouse:Abigail MOORE-13074
> Marr: Spouse:
> Death:10 Feb 1800 Place:Jamestown,Chautauqua,NY
>Burial: Place:
>Father:John CARPENTER 3rd-12755 Mother:Ruth COE-12756
>Notes ------------------------------------------------
>!Number 300 in the Carpenter Memorial. Page 83. Birth is 1745 not
>1730.
>Family on page 152 (#129) John Carpenter, Jr.
>Also known as "John the Distiller" John of Havertraw, NY represented
>Orange county in the Colonial Assembly in 1778 and he was also a Judge
>at one time in Orange county. He moved to Washington Town, north of
>Albany, NY and went into the distillery business and accumulated much
>property. He was a man of note and held many important offices. He
>was approved to make gunpowder with a partner for the Colonial Congress
>(27 April 1776 (Journel of Provincial Congress, Vol. 1, page 223). The
>powder mill was in Salisbury in the precinct of Cromwall, a part of the
>orginal precinct of Goshen.
>Page 309 of the same record (19 Feb 1776) the congress was advised that
>someone on the ship "Asia" was indebited to John Carpenter for a slave
>bill of sale or some security for said debt. John was given permission
>to go secure the debt.
>Among the citizens of Goshen who signed a pledge to fight against the
>Britsh were John, John Jr., Elijah, Benjamin, Timothy, Noah, and William
>Carpenter.
>A letter dated Cumberland County, Westminister, NY, 1 Feb 1776 to
>Provincial Congress from Benjamin Carpenter, Chairman of County
>Committee, announces nomination of field officers, among whom was
>Benjamin Carpenter, Esq., Second Colonel (prob. #309).
>!He was also into the manufacturer business with Henry Van Rensselaer.
>Grandson Sands Coe Carpenter wrote that this John Carpenter built and
>apporopiated for the Hall at Philadelphia historically known as
>CARPENTER'S HALL for the use of the Convention that formed our Nation.
>SOURCE: Letter of Sands Coe Carpenter to his cousin George B. Carpenter.
>A Patriot in New York State, DAR PATRIOT INDEX.
>
>
>Maragret Cass wrote:
>>
>> A very old list from the Elizabeth Horton Collection at the Orange Gen.
>> Soc. in Goshen, NY gives a birthdate for John Carpenter, son of John
>> Carpenter and Ruth Coe as Feb 23, 1745 at Jamaica, LI died Jamestown, NY.
>> On page 83 of The Carpenter Memorial the author gives two birth dates, 1730
>> and 1745. Does this mean that 1745 is the correct one?
>> Can this birth be found anywhere in records of Jamaica, LI?
>> Is there a record of his death in Jamestown, NY?
>> Margaret Cass
>> cassm(a)voicenet.com
>
>