----- Original Message -----
From: "abixby" <abixby(a)home.com>
Dear John,
I wrote to you about a year ago concerning Thomas Carpenter who married
Lucretia Quintard in 1781. He was listed in the parish records as an
Ensign and Adjutant in Gen. Delancey's 2nd battalion ( later the 3rd).
Due to my own problems including a 2nd rotator cuff surgery in one year
on my left shoulder last March and then in October my dogs bolted after
a squirrel in downtown LA and I was holding both their leashes in my
right hand and couldn't get free so I broke my right shoulder ( 8 yrs.
from the day I broke the left one!) So now I am finally recovered. I
had two other courses to complete which I finally finished after several
extensions ( and learning how to use the mouse with my left hand and
type with one arm in a sling!) So I am back to my one unit to complete
for a class that included 2 units for the annual conference ( in 1999!)
and other work to go with it. I have had 2 extensions to finish this
last unit which involves the error in the Carpenter genealogy (
descendants of William). It was hard to cut off that entire branch of
the family tree but it became more obvious as I went along that the
Thomas Carpenter who married Anne Stocker and had a son named Thomas was
not the same one who married Lucretia Quintard. I spent 5 days at the
Family History Library in SLC in October ( primarily to complete another
course)but also worked on researching this one. I was in the library at
least 10 hours a day
and would have liked to spend another week! ( or month even!) However,
I read the history of St. George's Church in Hempstead, LI which
remained loyal to the Church of England throughout the Revolution. In
reading through the parish records many of which are on microfilm and in
the New York Genealogical and Historical Society records, I wrote down
the names of each Carpenter who had married at St. George's and with the
exception of perhaps 1 or 2 that I could not identify their wives'
families, they married wives whose families were members of St. Georges-
such as Anne Stocker- there are baptismal records for her and at least
one sister there. My conclusion was that most of the Carpenter family
in Oyster Bay or on Long Island were not members of St. Georges. I
believe that the genealogy mentioned that Joseph Carpenter may have been
a Friend ( or Quaker) and the names of his children had been recorded at
the local meeting house including Thomas born in 1726 and I know that
Thomas Carpenter Jr. was said to have become a staunch Methodist in
Brooklyn, New York. The history states that during the Revolution
the minister was very busy marrying British soldiers to local girls!
and that the names of those soldiers can still be found in Hempstead.
There is a sharp increase in marriages starting in 1777 and many new
names that did not show up in the parish in previous years appeared- no
doubt soldiers. They apparently only listed the officers ( their titles
anyway) and there were quite a few including Ensign-Adjutant Thomas
Carpenter and Lucretia Quintard. I think it would be safe to say that
he does not belong in that genealogy. I have been in touch with two
other descendants of this couple who did not know much about him either.
I even have a photo of a portrait painted of him when he was 66 yrs old.
Todd W. Braisted of the The On-Line Institute for Advanced Loyalist
Studies website wrote to me over a year ago that Thomas was a member of
an elite Brigade of Foot Guards. I have since learned that he was in
the First Regiment of Foot Guards now known as the Grenadiers- they are
known as one of the Household Regiments since they guard the Queen and
do the changing of the guard, etc. in London among other duties.
When I first read this letter, I put it aside b/c I was still trying to
figure out whether Thomas Carpenter was a loyalist etc. ( and why since
with the exception of Aechulus ( sp?) Carpenter who was living in
Westchester County at the beginning of the Revolution and Willet who I
think was his son, I have not found many Carpenters who were loyalists-
in fact, I don't think there were any others on Long Island. Have you
found any others in that area? In any case, this is the information I
received from Todd Braisted.
" Thomas Carpenter is one of a small group of unique persons holding
commissions in the Provincial Corps. Carpenter was not a Loyalist from
America, but rather a regular British soldier, a Sergeant from the elite
Brigade of Foot Guards. The Guards arrived in America in the summer of
1776 and served in all the major campaigns. To reward faithful service
and advance promising Sergeants ( something almost impossible in the
Regular Army) , some were made officers in Loyalist regiments. This
provided for experience and professionalism in the new corps and
rewarded the service of the good NCOs. Carpenter was commissioned an
Ensign on 25 June 1780 in the 3rd battalion of Delancey's Brigade,
commanded by Col. Gabriel Ludlow. Source: 1783 North American Army List,
New York Historical Society. According to a list prepared at the end of
the war, Carpenter is listed as a native of England and mentions him
being a Sergeant from the Guards. Source: Great Britain Public Record
Office, Colonial Office, Class 5, Volume III, folio 231. His military
career after joining DeLancey's was rather uneventful, the corps engaged
only in garrison duty on Long island for the remainder of the war. In
1782, Delancey's 3rd battalion was renumbered 2nd battalion. I have no
indication that he was promoted to Lieutenant. The final half-pay list
at war's end still lists him as an ensign."
Although I should have accepted this information as being more
noteworthy than I did at the time, I still was uncertain as to how I
could connect this Ensign Thomas Carpenter to Lucretia Quintard. The
marriage records from the church pretty well convinced me. He was 26 yrs
old in 1783 so he was born in 1757. Another researcher ( it is his
wife's family) who lives in CT has been very helpful. The IGI lists an
Eliza and an Isaac Carpenter as having been baptised at an Episcopal
Church in New Haven in 1786 and 1788 respectively. He went to the
church and looked up the records and found the names of the parents and
godparents, etc. and they were obviously Thomas and Lucretia's first 2
children. The one thing I have had a problem with is a land grant for a
Lieut. Thomas Carpenter in Nova Scotia and then New Brunswick which he
was given in 1783-84. Is this the same person? On the marriage records
he is listed as Ensign and Adjutant ( and I found that Adjutant could
mean Lieut.) so perhaps that is where it came from. However, when I sent
for a copy of the grant, I was informed there were about 500 names
listed for this same land grant in Parr Town, Sudbury, New Brunswick but
without any further biographical information. Then I found a ship list
at the FHL for the "Cy" who were refugees from New York to Nova Scotia.
It included Aechulas (sp) and several names under his- as children
presumably all from Westchester County, NY plus a Thomas Carpenter from
England. I have contacted the First or Grenadier Brigade of Foot Guards
website Lt. Col. Winston Stone who is looking up more information for
me. ( They do reenactments of different regiments) He did say there was
a Sgt. Thomas Carpenter in the Grenadier Guards but he is going to send
me any other info he may have about him. One source claims he was born
in Minorca which if true, may have meant his father was in the military
also. He would have been 19 yrs old when he arrived in America so
perhaps he was a son of another member of the Guard. I have found two
Thomas Carpenters born in England in 1757 in the IGI one from Astley or
Shotley- Herefordshire? Have you ever done any military backgrounds on
the Carpenters in England? One thing that is intriging although it is
probably coincidence is that the First Regiment was one of five
regiments organized in Brugges in 1656 by Charles II while he was in
exile in Belgium to fight with Spain against the alliance of Cromwell
and King Louis XIV. One of these 5 regiments were 400 of the Kings most
loyal supporters and became known as the Royal Regiment under the
Command of Lord Wentworth. The Royal Regiment was still in France when
Charles was restored to the throne in 1660 - in 1665, they were brought
to England and upon the death of Lord Wentworth, they were linked
together to become the first regiment of foot guards. They earned the
title of Grenadier as a result of their bravery at Waterloo- the only
regiment of the British Army to have directly gained its title from the
part it played in battle. Although I don't see the mention of Flanders
here, didn't you have some of the Carpentiers coming from Flanders? or
France?
>From what I have read, the officers consisted of the landed gentry, all
considered to be "gentlemen." I wondered if Thomas's father may have
been in the Guards b/c it seems like the type of regiment that might
be traditional in a family? Although he arrived as a sergeant in 1776,
since he was only 19 yrs old, he may not have been old enough or
experienced enough to be an officer but was recruited to join Gen Howe
on Staten Island in July 1775. However, I don't know what it required to
join the Foot Guards but obviously they didn't take just anyone who came
along since they were the personal guards of the King or Queen. The ones
with the bear-skin hats and red uniforms. If he did go to Nova Scotia or
New Brunswick, he must have returned to America pretty rapidly in order
to have fathered a child in 1786 and then in 1788. It is our opinion
that he may have gone to Nova Scotia alone to either be mustered out-
get his pension or whatever was required since he was British and not
American.
That is what I am trying to find out now- where he was mustered out-
and it would seem that it would have been on British territory. Then, he
returned- how I don't know or whether this would have created a problem.
The godfather of their first child was Isaac Quintard, however, we don't
know if it was Sr. or Jr. b/c one wonders how an ex-captain in the
Revolution on the patriot side ( Isaac Jr.) having joined at age 16
would feel about his brother-in-law, who was a British soldier? I cannot
find any further references to his birthplace on records during his
lifetime. Although according to the church records in Hempstead, it
appears that British soldiers did settle there and remained there with
their wives after the war, so there must have been some acceptance of
this situation. The Quintards were a mixture of loyalists and patriots.
Isaac Quintard, Lucretias's father was a captain in the Stamford militia
however he was brought before the town authorities and accused of hiding
gunpowder barrels behind his inn. He wrote a long letter to the
newspaper of explanation as to how this incident occurred and
apparently, they accepted his explanation. However, his two sisters
married loyalists - one of whom- Hubbard- was later a chief justice in
New Brunswick. Of his 4 children, 2 of his daughers married "loyalists"
and Hannah, the eldest moved with her husband to Huntington, L.I. and
her sister married a Dr. John Wilson, also apparently a loyalist- but
they did not fight in the war and moved to the Albany area when the war
was over. His only son, Isaac, joined the patriots at age 16 and became
a captain during the war. His obit was in the NEHGS Register when he
died at age 90. One possibility is that Lucretia went with her older
sister, Hannah, to Huntington, LI b/c on the marriage records, it
stated that she was a native or originally from Stamford, CT and more
recently of Suffolk County, NY.
I wonder if you could look up a reference you gave me- a land sale from
an Isaac Quintard on the LI CD #173. Does it give any date? There were
several generations and even nephews etc. of the original Isaac Quintard
who fled France and originally settled in Bristol, England and married
the daughter of another French Huguenot family. He emigrated in 1695 to
New York City with his two sons, Isaac and Pierre ( Peter) who had been
born in England. He then moved to Stamford where his son Isaac inherited
his land from him. This explains some of the conflict they must have
felt about the Revolution. Isaac Sr. was listed in the Stamford records
as a "pensioner" in the Revolution ( formerly a captain in the militia)
so it appears that he was not forced to leave. But I am curious about
the property he sold in Long Island and which Isaac owned it- and
whether it was a for a "retreat" during the Revolution.
I am about to turn in what I have completed on researching this couple
b/c I want to start another course and this one unit has been "hanging
around" too long! I will continue my search for his ancestry and also to
see if there is a tie-in at all with your branch of the family.
Incidentally, he died quite a wealthy man. I copied his will plus copies
of land records that showed he started buying land in about 1815 in
Lansingburg, NY. I have traced them to Saratoga in about 1797 and then
to census records in 1810 ( and 1820-1830) in Lansingburg. He had only
one surviving daughter but there were 7-8 grandchildren to whome he left
quite a lot of property, several brick homes, capital stocks in both the
First Bank of Lansingburg and the first Insurance Company so he may have
had a part in founding the bank and the insurance company. They had 5
children: the 1st Eliza born 1786 died at 6 months. Isaac Carpenter was
born in 1788- the only son- then Elisabeth Quintard Carpenter ( my
direct ancestor) in 1791; she married Dr. John Taylor and they had 3
children; and Lucretia Burroughs Carpenter who married Andrew Thompson
and had several children and Catherine born 1799 died 1819 at age 20-
married but without any living children. However, Isaac ( who
apparently predeceased his father) left two sons William Henry Carpenter
and John S. Carpenter. I don't know when they were born but in 1831,
they were of age since their grandfather did not have to appoint a
guardian for them as he did for the 3 Taylor children. He left one
daughter and 7-8 grandchildren; all living in the area including the two
male Carpenter grandsons so
the Carpenter surname may have survived for some time after his death.
If you could look up the LI land sale for a date, I would be very
grateful. Maybe our Carpenter ancestry may come together back in England
at some point. We plan to go back to England for our 55th anniversary in
2002. We spent our 50th there and my husband really wants to go back- he
is 100% English whereas I am half French and I want to go back to France
again, also. We visited several of his ancestral villages and churches
in Suffolk County last time, however, there are still many areas we want
to visit that we missed before. I would love to get into the PRO
records. I met several people from the FHHS ( English) who were at the
FHL for the annual church conference the same weekend I was there and
they told me they plan to have every soldier in every regiment record
available soon- however, I believe the Guards are already available-
definitely the officers. I thought this might be of interest to you b/c
of your interest in their background in England and this seems to be the
first case I have found of a Carpenter in the military - esp. in such a
prestigious regiment as the Foot Guards that I would like to trace back
to see if possibly his father may have also been in the military.
Bye for now-
Annabel Bixby
abixby(a)home.com