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could help with a lookup of st clears , with baptisms of any JOHN LEWIS
with father as JOHN LEWIS
Many thanks & awaiting your reply
PATRICK rossiter(a)one.net.au
Hi Pat
Thanks for the e-mail - I have had a look in Pembrey for John Ann and David
William/s and I cannot find them - you give the ages of the people you
require - is this the age they would have been in 1861?? These are very
popular names - I have tried to find them altogether as one family but they
are not there.
Give me the approx birth date of these people and I'll see if I can find
them for you......you state that David was born in Pembrey - could you give
me when - thanks was it in 1859 as this is how I have read it from your
letter
speak soon
Pauline James
Carmarthenshire FHS
-----Original Message-----
From: Alsiapat(a)aol.com [mailto:Alsiapat@aol.com]
Sent: 26 August 1999 10:39
To: CARMARTHENSHIRE-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Lookup 1861 Census Williams Pembrey
Hello Pauline.
Would it be possible to look up the following family in the 1861 Census for
Pembrey:-
WILLIAM(S) John 27 Born GLA Margam
Ann 32 Born CGN Troedyraur
David 2 Born CHH Pembrey.
A second son Daniel was born in Cwmavon c 1861 so I do not know if they
moved
before or after the census. By 1871 they had returned to Taibach Glamorgan.
Ann ELIAS was from a Calvanistic Methodist Family in Troedyraur but as yet
I
have not found her marriage to John WILLIAMS. Would it be possible to look
in
the Pembrey Registers. In 1881 John Williams was described as a copper
smelter.
Thanks
Pat Morris
Wrexham.
==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
Be specific when requesting a lookup, make it short & to the point.
Do not ask for multiple requests, or you may be refused a lookup.
Hi Cynthia
This is just a very quick message whilst I remember - I'll read the rest of
your mail later.
I have solved the Ann Griffith mystery of Robert Griffith and Ann - I have
checked the baptism entry and it reads
1810 Ann daughter of Griffith Robert and Ann
I have the date but that is in my brief case which is in the boot of my car
at present - just got in - so the father was not Robert Griffith but
Griffith Robert - I thought it strange that I had no entry of a Robert
Griffith in any of my records - back to the drawing board.....
I have a Griffith Robert in the 1841 census of Pembrey with a wife Margaret
and 5 other Robert's living with them - they were in a place called
Danybank - so this proves that the baptism was to a Griffith Robert -
Try not to tug your hair toooooooo much
speak later
Pauline
-----Original Message-----
From: N & C Collison [mailto:ccolliso@mania.com.au]
Sent: 26 August 1999 00:34
To: CARMARTHENSHIRE-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: GRIFFITH/S, Pembrey
Hello, Pauline,
Many thanks, once again, for your kindness in response to my voicing my
frustrations at reaching brickwalls in every line I pursue in order to
document my ROWLAND/S line of descent, from Pembrey parish backwards to
Aberdare, Glamorgan thence to St. Mellon's, Monmouthshire.
The GRIFFITH connection: William ROWLAND, a stonemason), according to
all Census records was born at St. Mellon's, Monmouthshire, c 1812-13. No
baptism found, so no parents known. Brickwall No. 1).
On 31 July, 1831, at Pembrey parish church, he married ANN GRIFFITH/S.
Witnesses were William GRIFFITHS and Richard WILLIAMS. Two baptism have
been found for an Ann Griffith, Pembrey, the first 1811 to William/Jane,
the second 1810, to Robert and Ann. The first has been eliminated as she
married a POWELL and remained at the home of her parents according to
various Census records. Found a Robert Griffith bapt. 1791 St. Ishmaels
but no marriage for a Robert and Ann who could be Ann GRIFFITH/S parents.
Cannot find them in Census records. No wills. (Brick Wall No. 2)
William and Ann had children Jane, bapt. 1832 Pembrey, WILLIAM bapt. 1833
Pembrey, Edward b. c1836 and John,b. c 1840. Family was in Aberdare
1841, 1851.
Son WILLIAM (b. 1833), also a stonemason, married Elizabeth DAVID,
18855, Aberdare, Glam. (b. Pembrey, parents may be John DAVID and Sophia
EDMUND m. 1826 Pembrey). Have not found baptism for Elizabeth to prove
for certainty parents were John and Sophia although her marriage
certificate states father JOHN. John and Sophia not in Pembrey Census
1841, 1851 to see if Elizabeth is there and any other siblings. Not
located family in Aberdare 1851 Census. (Brickwall No. 3)
William ROWLAND and Elizabth moved to Pembrey where most of their 11
children were born.
My grandfather was their 7th child, WILLIAM b. 1865, a stonemason,
married, 1897, Siloh Chapel, Llanelli, Margaret DAVIES, b. c 1868
Pembrey. Her parents were;
David DAVIES (No. 3) b. c 1827,(father DAVID DAVIES (N0. 2)
monumental mason, Lammas St., Carmarthen, formerly at
Llangunnor). Can't find David (N0. 3's) baptism as I do not known his
mother's name. (Brickwall No. 4) and
mother, Mary, nee THOMAS b. Llandyfaelog c 1831. Have not found
marriage of David DAVIES to Mary THOMAS. (Brickwall No. 4) Llandyfaelog
is a big parish so I don't known in which town or village she was born..
Have found a Mary THOMAS born to Thomas THOMAS and Sarah DAVIES 27 Dec.,
1832, Llandyfaelog, but would need David and Mary's marriage to find
out if her father was indeed Thomas THOMAS.
(If only the UK death certificate was as informative as the Australian
one we could be more positive each step of the way that we are
researching the correct person. As a matter of interest an Australian
death certificate gives the following information (as per my late
father's death certificate):
"Surname, other names, occupation, sex, marital status, date of death,
place of death, usual residence, place of birth, how many years has the
person lived in the state, father's surname and other names, mother's
maiden name and other names, place the deceased married in, to whom,
names of children of the marriage and their ages, informant's name and
address, cause of death, duration of illness, person who certified death
certificate, particulars of burial/cremation."
. As my father died when I was only sixteen, this certificate gave me a
starting point to his place of birth in Wales and the name of his father
and and more importantly, his mother's maiden name.
Any ideas on how to overcome any of the above problems would be most
gratefully appreciated.
Kind regards,
Cynthia Collison (nee ROWLANDS)
Australia
==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
have you got a one name database? Add it to the Lookup Databases Pages
Do you have an Index? Volunteer to carry out Looks Ups for Subscribers.
I have been browsing the site and have found a list of volunteers who may carry out some searching.
Presumably one needs to be a member of the FHS?
Would you please advise?
Thank you.
A special thank you to Art SMITH and Janet Foster McKEE and of course,
our wonderful Pauline, for their kinds words of encouragement after my
cry of frustration after, once again, coming to another dead-end in
trying to trace my Welsh father's forebears.
The people contributing and listening in to the CARMARTHENSHIRE list are
truly wonderful. The kindness of many on the list has to be experienced
to be fully appreciated. My appreciation is warm and sincere.
Kind regard, and many thanks, once again, Art, Janet and Pauline.
Cynthia Collison (nee ROWLANDS)
Australia
Hello Pauline.
Would it be possible to look up the following family in the 1861 Census for
Pembrey:-
WILLIAM(S) John 27 Born GLA Margam
Ann 32 Born CGN Troedyraur
David 2 Born CHH Pembrey.
A second son Daniel was born in Cwmavon c 1861 so I do not know if they moved
before or after the census. By 1871 they had returned to Taibach Glamorgan.
Ann ELIAS was from a Calvanistic Methodist Family in Troedyraur but as yet I
have not found her marriage to John WILLIAMS. Would it be possible to look in
the Pembrey Registers. In 1881 John Williams was described as a copper
smelter.
Thanks
Pat Morris
Wrexham.
Hello, Pauline,
Many thanks, once again, for your kindness in response to my voicing my
frustrations at reaching brickwalls in every line I pursue in order to
document my ROWLAND/S line of descent, from Pembrey parish backwards to
Aberdare, Glamorgan thence to St. Mellon's, Monmouthshire.
The GRIFFITH connection: William ROWLAND, a stonemason), according to
all Census records was born at St. Mellon's, Monmouthshire, c 1812-13. No
baptism found, so no parents known. Brickwall No. 1).
On 31 July, 1831, at Pembrey parish church, he married ANN GRIFFITH/S.
Witnesses were William GRIFFITHS and Richard WILLIAMS. Two baptism have
been found for an Ann Griffith, Pembrey, the first 1811 to William/Jane,
the second 1810, to Robert and Ann. The first has been eliminated as she
married a POWELL and remained at the home of her parents according to
various Census records. Found a Robert Griffith bapt. 1791 St. Ishmaels
but no marriage for a Robert and Ann who could be Ann GRIFFITH/S parents.
Cannot find them in Census records. No wills. (Brick Wall No. 2)
William and Ann had children Jane, bapt. 1832 Pembrey, WILLIAM bapt. 1833
Pembrey, Edward b. c1836 and John,b. c 1840. Family was in Aberdare
1841, 1851.
Son WILLIAM (b. 1833), also a stonemason, married Elizabeth DAVID,
18855, Aberdare, Glam. (b. Pembrey, parents may be John DAVID and Sophia
EDMUND m. 1826 Pembrey). Have not found baptism for Elizabeth to prove
for certainty parents were John and Sophia although her marriage
certificate states father JOHN. John and Sophia not in Pembrey Census
1841, 1851 to see if Elizabeth is there and any other siblings. Not
located family in Aberdare 1851 Census. (Brickwall No. 3)
William ROWLAND and Elizabth moved to Pembrey where most of their 11
children were born.
My grandfather was their 7th child, WILLIAM b. 1865, a stonemason,
married, 1897, Siloh Chapel, Llanelli, Margaret DAVIES, b. c 1868
Pembrey. Her parents were;
David DAVIES (No. 3) b. c 1827,(father DAVID DAVIES (N0. 2)
monumental mason, Lammas St., Carmarthen, formerly at
Llangunnor). Can't find David (N0. 3's) baptism as I do not known his
mother's name. (Brickwall No. 4) and
mother, Mary, nee THOMAS b. Llandyfaelog c 1831. Have not found
marriage of David DAVIES to Mary THOMAS. (Brickwall No. 4) Llandyfaelog
is a big parish so I don't known in which town or village she was born..
Have found a Mary THOMAS born to Thomas THOMAS and Sarah DAVIES 27 Dec.,
1832, Llandyfaelog, but would need David and Mary's marriage to find
out if her father was indeed Thomas THOMAS.
(If only the UK death certificate was as informative as the Australian
one we could be more positive each step of the way that we are
researching the correct person. As a matter of interest an Australian
death certificate gives the following information (as per my late
father's death certificate):
"Surname, other names, occupation, sex, marital status, date of death,
place of death, usual residence, place of birth, how many years has the
person lived in the state, father's surname and other names, mother's
maiden name and other names, place the deceased married in, to whom,
names of children of the marriage and their ages, informant's name and
address, cause of death, duration of illness, person who certified death
certificate, particulars of burial/cremation."
. As my father died when I was only sixteen, this certificate gave me a
starting point to his place of birth in Wales and the name of his father
and and more importantly, his mother's maiden name.
Any ideas on how to overcome any of the above problems would be most
gratefully appreciated.
Kind regards,
Cynthia Collison (nee ROWLANDS)
Australia
Hi Tom,
I don't see any connection in our ancestors at this time. I did want to tell
you that my BOWEN line from south lines, my ggf from Pengam, Bedwellty
Parish, in Monmouthshire was born c. 1828. At some point he came to this
country through Philadelphia, to southern Ohio. His family were all coal
miners, in fact, until fairly recently. I was born in Harrisburg, Illinois,
close enough to Herrin to be in the same football conference. I don't know
an Elizabeth BOWEN from there, but will keep my eyes open.
Good luck.
Jodie BOWEN Russu
Watergrdnr(a)aol.com
Meadows Place, Tx.
Many triple A auto club offices in the US have bound books of UK Ordnance
Survey maps priced at around $ 10.00. I haven't checked, but try amazon.com
Art
Therese and Gerry Lewis wrote:
> Hi Tom
>
> Steam Mill was in the area between Spilman Street, Parade Road, Towy
> Side and Castle Hill. Where exactly I don't know.
>
> "Modern" UK map making was started by the British military (during the
> Napoleonic Wars) which is why it is called the Ordnance Survey.
>
> I'm sure Ordnance Survey have authorised retail outlets all over America
> - check out the their web site at www.ordsvy.gov.uk - it must give some
> details.
>
> Their e-mail address is custinfo(a)ordsvy.gov.uk
>
> Gerry Lewis
>
> ==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
> Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
> Http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
> Be specific when requesting a lookup, Do not ask for multiple look-ups
> The Look-Up Pages are for look-ups not Research requests.
Hi Tom
Steam Mill was in the area between Spilman Street, Parade Road, Towy
Side and Castle Hill. Where exactly I don't know.
"Modern" UK map making was started by the British military (during the
Napoleonic Wars) which is why it is called the Ordnance Survey.
I'm sure Ordnance Survey have authorised retail outlets all over America
- check out the their web site at www.ordsvy.gov.uk - it must give some
details.
Their e-mail address is custinfo(a)ordsvy.gov.uk
Gerry Lewis
Hello Cynthia,
I want to thank you for your note. I feel the same. I keep reading the List
hoping somebody will float by. I was encouraged by the responses you
received.
Cordially,
Janet in Oregon
JONES, THOMAS, DANIEL, AURTHAR (ARTHUR?), WILLIAMS
of Carmarthen and Llandeilo
Pauline, you said you had a copy of Robson's directory for 1840 for the
parish of Llanelly. Could you check it for a Duggan family.
I have William Duggan married to Margaret Rees in Llanelly in 1852. (St
Johns, Llanelly, Carmarthenshire #111) Margaret's residence at marriage
and in the 1871 and 1881 Census is Pen y bont Farm, (Pont y Berem)
Llanelly.
William was born to William Duggan and Elinor Davies in Carmarthen
about 1827, The family was in Carmarthen as late as 1832. I have a
marriage of one son James in Gwendraeth in 1852, and of Henry and
William in Llanelly in 1852. I am trying to narrow when they moved
from Carmarthen St Peter to Llanelli.
Does the geography of what I have make sense. I am told that some of
these (probably William and Margaret of the 1852 marriage are buried in
Pontyberem at the Capel Ifan (St John?) .
Thanks for the lookup
Jim Duggan in Cary NC
Hello everyone
Could anyone suggest a source (online? otherwise?) for a map of Carmarthen
town in the late 1800's? I am trying to pinpoint an area called Steam Mill,
which Angela told me was between St. Peter's church and the river.
Also, can someone explain what OS maps are & where they can be found? Are
these spelled "ordnance survey" as if for targeting artillery/weapons, or
"ordinance survey" as if for municipal/legal boundaries purposes?
Regards
Tom Crompton
Hi, Pauline
Was this Roda a different entry than the John & Rhoda you mentioned before
(w/o a son William)? The one you sent is VERY interesting, since it lists a
"Roda", William, and Mary all together, and they are mother/son/daughter,
plus, William's age is about right, at 8 (born in May 1873; technically still
7 at the time of the census which I'm told occurred in April), and so is
Mary's at 6 (he had said he had a younger sister Mary Jane). But there is no
John listed as father; meaning he had died between 1873-1881, or was no
longer the head of the household, or ?. I have the birth record for William,
showing that he was in fact born in Carmarthen, so I am sure that is correct.
Maybe Rhoda was born in Maesteg, and her place of birth data was applied to
all three (?); perhaps by her own accounts. I'm sure stranger things have
happened in census data, but I'm trying really hard not to speculate too
much. Thoughts or suggestions?
Regards,
Tom Crompton
Hello All
Everything should be back to normal soon with the lists because it has been
rather slow due to the holidays and children on school break for six weeks -
I know that myself I will be in full swing after next week - I think we all
deserve a break at some time - even though we have not been away on holidays
it's nice to just do what you like....
I am rather busy at present with research for people, that is why I have not
been active on the list - if anyone has anything of interest that they would
like to share with other listers I would be rather obliged....
We'll both be away for two days this week - so if you don't hear from us
don't worry - the queries will be here when we get back...
speak soon
Regards
Pauline James
Carmarthenshire FHS
http://members.aol.com/cmnfhs1/http://www.genfair.com
Hi Debbie
I've just looked through a modern map of Carmarthenshire - and although I
must admit I did not know of this place named Llanfihangel uwch-Gwili which
is as you state about three and a half miles from Abergwilli itself - thanks
for this question it's proved very useful to ourselves.
It goes to show that the more questions asked the more informed we ALL seem
to become -
thanks to all who answered this message - much appreciated.
bye
Pauline Pauline
-----Original Message-----
From: Trev Jones [mailto:VICKIE@robbie64.freeserve.co.uk]
Sent: 23 August 1999 23:35
To: CARMARTHENSHIRE-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: Llanfihangel-uwch-Gwili
Hi Richard,
Thanks for your messages, but I think I may be right in saying that this
Llanfihangel was actually in the parish of Abergwilli?
Kind regards,
Debbie,
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard James <Carmarthenshirefhs(a)tesco.net>
To: <CARMARTHENSHIRE-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Monday, August 23, 1999 9:11 AM
Subject: Llanfihangel-uwch-Gwili
> I am not familiar with Llanfihangel-uwch-Gwili church, and I cannot seem
to locate any Records or when they may have started, I will have to give
John Davies a call in the Carmarthen Record Office, and will let you know,
of this Church and any records which may be available.
>
> Regards
> Richard James
>
>
> ==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
> Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
> http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
> have you got a one name database? Add it to the Lookup Databases Pages
> Do you have an Index? Volunteer to carry out Looks Ups for Subscribers.
>
>
==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
Http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
Be specific when requesting a lookup, Do not ask for multiple look-ups
The Look-Up Pages are for look-ups not Research requests.
Cynthia,
Don't give up ! Just when you least expect it, another lead pops up. Re-read
your research notes, sometimes a lead stares you in the face and it takes a
review for you to notice it. Just being a member of Carms FHS gives us a leg
up on other researchers. Pauline and Richard not only have resources, but
have genealogic insight . Like you, I have had my stonewalls and other
hinderences, but I'm not going to give up. Leads have broken through too
often in the past.
Regards,
Art
N & C Collison wrote:
> Hello, Pauline,
>
> Many thanks, once again for trying to locate my GRIFFITH family, Pembrey.
> It seems I have hit another brickwall. One lister, I think GLAM. list,
> headed her query "Lost in Swansea". I feel like crying "I'M lost in St.
> Mellons (Mon.), Swansea, Aberdare, Pembrey, Llandefaelog, etc." Every
> line I trace I hit a brick wall. My only consolation is that perhaps I
> am not the only frustrated person out there trying to trace my Welsh
> roots.
> I am determined, though, that I won't give up.
>
> Kind regards,
> Cynthia (Collison (nee ROWLANDS)
> Australia
>
> ==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
> Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
> http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
> Help Pages are Also Attached to the Lookup Pages
Hi Richard,
Thanks for your messages, but I think I may be right in saying that this
Llanfihangel was actually in the parish of Abergwilli?
Kind regards,
Debbie,
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard James <Carmarthenshirefhs(a)tesco.net>
To: <CARMARTHENSHIRE-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Sent: Monday, August 23, 1999 9:11 AM
Subject: Llanfihangel-uwch-Gwili
> I am not familiar with Llanfihangel-uwch-Gwili church, and I cannot seem
to locate any Records or when they may have started, I will have to give
John Davies a call in the Carmarthen Record Office, and will let you know,
of this Church and any records which may be available.
>
> Regards
> Richard James
>
>
> ==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
> Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
> http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
> have you got a one name database? Add it to the Lookup Databases Pages
> Do you have an Index? Volunteer to carry out Looks Ups for Subscribers.
>
>
Hello Cynthia
Let's try and break this brick wall down.
I have looked for a Robert Griffith in all of my indexes i.e. Census
1841-1891 Pembrey parish, baptisms 1770-1833 Pembrey, burials 1800-1900
Pembrey, marriges 1700-1900 Pembrey - I have also searched Carmarthenshire
marriages 1754-1837 - Pembrokeshire and Cardiganshire marriages 1813-1837 -
Will indexes 1564-1858, Llanelly indexes, etc etc I cannot find him
anywhere excepting the marriage I gave you in Meidrim parish church.
I have seen the entry in 1810 for Ann Griffith to Robert and Ann Griffith in
Pembrey - this must be a B.T. I do not have this entry from the parish
registers. - the B.T's are in the NLW from 1805-1865 for Pembrey parish -
perhaps these should be searched - Carmarthen RO does not have any Bishops
transcripts available....
Maybe they came to Pembrey and left as quick - if they had stayed here there
would be some reference to them somewhere.....Do you want to try again from
the beginning??
speak soon
Pauline
-----Original Message-----
From: N & C Collison [mailto:ccolliso@mania.com.au]
Sent: 23 August 1999 23:07
To: CARMARTHENSHIRE-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Brickwalls
Hello, Pauline,
Many thanks, once again for trying to locate my GRIFFITH family, Pembrey.
It seems I have hit another brickwall. One lister, I think GLAM. list,
headed her query "Lost in Swansea". I feel like crying "I'M lost in St.
Mellons (Mon.), Swansea, Aberdare, Pembrey, Llandefaelog, etc." Every
line I trace I hit a brick wall. My only consolation is that perhaps I
am not the only frustrated person out there trying to trace my Welsh
roots.
I am determined, though, that I won't give up.
Kind regards,
Cynthia (Collison (nee ROWLANDS)
Australia
==== CARMARTHENSHIRE Mailing List ====
Carmarthenshire Roots Lookup Pages
http://members.aol.com/carmsroots/
Help Pages are Also Attached to the Lookup Pages