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Happy New Year folks
The apparent brother of one of ancestors was convicted
at a place which looks like "Suny Assizes". I am not
familiar with this as an abbreviation for a town or
Any suggestions ?
A VERY HAPPY NEW YEAR. to you and yours.
I wonder if you have any record of:
Philip Bevan convicted in April 1788, at Breconshire, Wales, of Sheep
stealing and sentenced to 14 years.
The PJ Lists New Year Resolutions :) or the 10 Commandments
But firstly a *wish* that we have a good downpour of rain in the fire
ravaged areas of NSW
* We will break down so many brick walls that we will be known as Convict
Demolition Experts (although in 2001 we did not do too badly!)
* We will make this the best convict List of the Internet
* We will continue to make this list a fun one and a "Bad Language Free
* We will not talk about any virus
* When submitting information for further advice or look-ups, we will
advise which resources we have already checked
* When people have assisted - we will thank all those who responded. (If
you obtain information that you already have, but forgot to advise in the
original email - please still thank everyone (preferably privately)
* We will post our responses to the List so that others will not waste time
looking for, and posting the same information
* When a posting of general information, such as HRA or Sydney Gazettes, we
will not respond to the whole group with a remark (unless it is very witty
or relevant) and we will delete most of the email to which we are
* When responding to a question we will only retain the part of the email
that we are responding to, and we will not include umpteen other emails
attached eg >>>>>>
* We will be asking the PJ List questions, not To Lesley or to Lesley
Think that's it :)
~~~~~Have a great 2002~~~~~~
CLAIM A CONVICT
Thank you for your help. I will now dig around the Musters and the ships
records to see what I can find out about Ann Hughes.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lesley Uebel" <ckennedy(a)bigpond.net.au>
To: "alan doughty" <a.doughty(a)optusnet.com.au>;
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2001 3:19 PM
Subject: RE: [PJ] INDENT INFORMATION.
> Many of the old Assignment records were long ago lost. Some assignments
> be obtained by checking the Col. Sec Index under the ships name and some
> other early assignments were noted on the actual Indent. The only
> Assignment Register to survive is that from 1821 - 25. Later assignments
> can be found in the Government Gazettes and newspapers.
> Early Musters and the 1828 Census can also be used....but your Ann Hughes
> would have been free by 1811.
> Happy hunting - but don't like your luck
> 13 April 1806
> Ship News
> On Friday arrived the WIlliam Pitt with female prisoners, in a general
> of good health. She sailed from England the First of September last; made
> of island of Madeira the 1st October, and stopped three days. In Company
> with an out-ward bound East India convey she reached Cape of Good Hope
> in January, and from thence sailed for this port.
> 1 June 1806
> Our report of the arrival of the William Pitt stated the death of three
> female prisoners during the passage, having landed 117 out of 120 women
> received on board. This account was not perfectly correct, as out of the
> above number received only two were lost, the third having discharged the
> vessel shortly prior to her departure.
> Lesley Uebel
> CLAIM A CONVICT
> My CD-ROMS
> Convicts to Port Jackson 1788 - 1842 CD-ROM
> Convicts Permissions to Marry 1826 - 1851 CD-ROM
> Convicts Death Index 1828 - 1879 CD-ROM
Thank you ever so much for the sites suggested re Moulds and Davis - so much work has been done. For those interested in my connection to this group of settlers.
Simon Moulds and Ann Davis (my gggg grandparents) daughter
Susannah Moulds married Francis Sherwood (ggg grandparents)
Their son Samuel James Sherwood married Elizabeth Whitmore (my gg grandparents)
Son Herbert married Sarah Bowerman (my grandparents) and their dau Mavis is my mother.
I have had some success with the Bowerman tree but unable to locate much on Elizabeth Whitmore except she was born 21//8/1848 in Dooral NSW.
Thank you all - Lorraine
Lesley and Listers,
Happy New Year to all the Listers and may 2002 be kind to you and your families.
Thank you very much for the information regarding the McGuiness family.
Now we require more help. Back to Mary Lees 37 and her partner in crime Ann Hughes 27, stealing printed calico from the store of Hugh Bennett and Joseph Benton - in Manchester, both held at Lancaster Castle and tried on 29th March 1804 in the Assizes Court.
Good news from our contact in the UK, she got in touch with someone in Manchester and we have found out that the store is recorded in the Bancks's 1800 Manchester & Salford Directory - Bennett & Benton, Linen Drapers, Exchange Street on the corner of St Ann's Square and to top it off it is still there today in the centre of Manchester. It appears it was not destroyed by the bombing in the War, which much of Manchester was.
We have now confirmed that Ann Hughes received 7 years and also traveled with Mary Lees on the William Pitt in 1805.
Can anyone help regarding who Ann Hughes was indented to. We know Mary Lees was indented to William Roberts, publican. It appears that Ann kept up her friendship with Mary over the years, as she was the witness on 13.3.1832 to the marriage of Thomas McGuiness 22 yr and Sarah Blackman 17 yr - Rev Richard Hill - Witnesses: Samuel Blackman (Sarah's father) - Ann Hughes - (this is 27 years after arriving in the Colony with Mary).
Thomas McGuiness's younger sister Elizabeth married John Pearce and Mary Lees youngest son Richard, my (Alan's) ggg grandfather.
Alan and Janice.
----- Original Message -----
From: "alan doughty" <a.doughty(a)optusnet.com.au>
Sent: 31 December 2001 08:33
Subject: [PJ] CENSUS 1828
> We am trying to find out where Eliza McGinnis
(Elizabeth McGuiness) - Friendship - 1818, her
daughter Elizabeth the younger and her son Thomas
where living when the >1828 Census was carried
She is recorded as Elizabeth MCGUINESS . She was
living with her family in Castlereagh St. Son
Thomas McG, 22 yrs is recorded just as a shop
> We have found out that Thomas had a business in
Castlereagh Street, we think it was a pub in 1828,
it could have been the Horse and Carriage Inn? It
appears he lied about his age as he claimed he was
22 in 1828, but on his marriage certificate to
Sarah Blackman in 1832 he claims he is 22 and on
his gravestone on his property at Sandy Creek in
Bigga it states he was born 1810, making him 8
years of age when he arrived on the Friendship
with his mother and little sister. So the age on
the marriage certificate appears to be his correct
one, making him only 18 when he started his
No harm in changing your age up or down a notch or
Any ref to him in the Colonial Secretaries
Correspondence indexes ?
Central Coast Family History Society
I see on you posted list of Children into PJ you have under Miscarriages
&/or Stillbirths one John Collpitts. Could you tell me if there is a date
for this happening? Ann Colpitts 'Lady Penryhn' was married to a Thomas
Colpitts aka Stuart before her transportation. She is also known to have
lived with Pvt. John Coulthread and said to have had 2 sons to him in the
Colony. The first only lived a short time and was named John, the second
survived and was also named John. Could the John Collpitts on the voyage be
a baby she was carrying when she embarked on the voyage or the first of John
Couthreads babes. There was also an older son, James Couthread, with him on
Hi Alan & Janice,
From the 1823/1824/1825 General Muster .....
McGINNES, Elizabeth = no age given = TL = Friendship
= 1818 = 14 years = Housekeeper = Castlereagh St, Sydney.
McGINNES, Thomas = 18 = Friendship = Son of Elizabeth
McGinnes = Castlereagh St, Sydney.
McGINNIS, Elizabeth = 15 = Child of E. McGinnis, Sydney
Orphan School = Parramatta.
----- Original Message -----
Subject: RE: [PJ] CENSUS 1828
> Elizabeth Senior stated to be 53 and Elizabeth Junior was 15, both living
> with Thomas, (22yo) the Shopkeeper in Castlereagh St.
> The 1822 Muster does not state his age.
> Lesley Uebel
> -----Original Message-----
> Subject: [PJ] CENSUS 1828
> We am trying to find out where Eliza McGinnis (Elizabeth McGuiness) -
> Friendship - 1818, her daughter Elizabeth the younger and her son
> Thomas > where living when the 1828 Census was carried out.
> We have found out that Thomas had a business in Castlereagh Street,
we think > it was a pub in 1828, it could have been the Horse and Carriage
Inn? It > appears he lied about his age as he claimed he was 22 in 1828, but
on his > marriage certificate to Sarah Blackman in 1832 he claims he
is 22 and on his > gravestone on his property at Sandy Creek in Bigga it
states he was born > 1810, making him 8 years of age when he arrived on the
Friendship with his > mother and little sister. So the age on the marriage
certificate appears to > be his correct one, making him only 18 when he
started his business life.
> Alan and Janice
I am now beginning to trace my husbands brickwalls, and require any help available.
1. Henry Charles Smith, born 27.1.1859 - Parents William Joseph Smith born London
Catherine Elizabeth Amos born 11.5.1834 Sydney.
Unable to locate William Joseph's arrival or death.
2. Catherine Elizabeth Amos born 11.5.1834 - Parents George Amos)
Maria Gilbert ) arrived "Richard Reynolds"
Unable to locate Catherine's death.
3. Honora O'Brien (married Henry Charles Smith) born 5.1.1864 at McLeay River
Parents Jeremiah (master Mariner) O'Brien born circa 1834 Cork
Elizabeth McCormack born circa 1841 Tipperary
Jeremiah O'Brien's parents were - Denis O'Brien and Honora O'Connor
Elizabeth McCormack's parents were William McCormack and Mary Cahill
I believe there are no links to convicts on the Amos line, but have no information on the Smiths, O'Briens or McCormacks.
Listers help would be gratefully received.
We am trying to find out where Eliza McGinnis (Elizabeth McGuiness) - Friendship - 1818, her daughter Elizabeth the younger and her son Thomas where living when the 1828 Census was carried out.
We have found out that Thomas had a business in Castlereagh Street, we think it was a pub in 1828, it could have been the Horse and Carriage Inn? It appears he lied about his age as he claimed he was 22 in 1828, but on his marriage certificate to Sarah Blackman in 1832 he claims he is 22 and on his gravestone on his property at Sandy Creek in Bigga it states he was born 1810, making him 8 years of age when he arrived on the Friendship with his mother and little sister. So the age on the marriage certificate appears to be his correct one, making him only 18 when he started his business life.
Alan and Janice
Thanks for the info re Jonathon Griffiths. I did know a fair amount of this
already but I didn't know why he moved. A lot of the shipping info is in a
book called "Macquarie Country" by D G BOWD published in 1969 and revised in
1973. Also if you look at the NSW Archives website all sorts of things can
be gleaned especially the Colonial Secretary's Papers.
A lady in NZ who has married into the Griffiths family is very helpful (her
name is also marie). She even showed me paintings by Charles Condor of the
Griffiths farm. Also she told me how his house in Tasmania is still standing
is now used as a tourist property.
Posted to incorrect address
CLAIM A CONVICT
From: leojobson [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org]
Sent: Monday, 31 December 2001 4:10
Subject: JOHN JOBSON CONVICT NSW
I am a descendant of John's eldest son John who lived in and around
Between 1820 & 1823, there were three John Jobsons tried for stealing in
England, but only one was transported to Australia.
I would like to be included in your mailing list as I have quite a list
of information that we have uncovered that may be of assistance to any
other family researcher as John Jobson and his wife, Eliza had 15
Hi Larraine and Diane,
There is also the following site:
I also have a couple of connections in my family tree:
Simon Moulds, son of Simon Moulds and Ann Davis married Rosetta James
daughter of my 4th great grandparents, Samuel James and Ann Bean.
James Moulds, son of John Moulds and Elizabeth McPeake (and grandson of
Simon Moulds and Ann Davis), married Sarah Ann Harradine, daughter of my 2nd
great grandparents, Charles Harradine and Mary Rush.
Most of my information on Samuel Moulds and Ann Davis has come from these
sites, but if I can help at all, let me know.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Diane [mailto:email@example.com]
> Sent: Sunday, 30 December 2001 8:33 PM
> To: AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS-L(a)rootsweb.com
> Subject: [PJ] Re: Parramatta - Moulds & Davis
> Hi Lorraine,
> If you have a look at this web-site :
> and follow the Simon Moulds link, you'll find some basic
> info on the family of Simon and Ann.
> ----- Original Message -----
> Subject: [PJ] Parramatta - Moulds & Davis
> > I am seeking information the family of Simon Moulds and Ann Davis who
> were born in UK and married in St. Johns Parramatta. Simon came on the
> "BARWELL" in 1798. Susannah Moulds was a daughter of this union
> and married
> convict Francis Sherwood in 1827 at St. Johns Parramatta.
> ==== AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS Mailing List ====
> Convicts to Port Jackson
> To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy
> records, go to:
Happy New Year Listers
Can't replicate the sword dance - we are short of cutlery:))
Does anyone have any info on this person - there is a reference to his assignment in Colonial Secretary's Index 1822. Can't find T/L etc for him. Seems a descendant of his married into my family.
This descendant has given me several years' work. [still that's what it's all about]
As always any help much appreciated
Sounds very Australian too me:)
Was this the beginning of the Australian character forming ?
Bench of Magistrates
Sydney, December 3, 1808
Mr Martin MASON was brought before the Bench for disobedience
of a General
Order, directing him to attend a General Muster the 12th
Mr Mann deposed, that on the morning of Wednesday the 12
ultimo, he met Mr
Mason by accident on the Green Hills and said to him :Why, you
attended Muster ?" "No" was the reply; that the deponent then
said to him
" if you will go with me, I will take it;" but Mr Mason
making no reply to
the proposal, complained of grievances under which he said he
the seizure of a still lately taken from him was oppressive;
and added some
remarks which the deponent considered derogatory to the honour
of the Lieut.
Governor; that the deponent remonstrated against the
impropriety of such
expressions, and again urged him to attend the muster, from
motives - but, that Mr Mason replied to him 'he would be
damn'd if he would'
The deponent concluded by saying that Mr Mason did not attend,
nor did he
send any account of Stock, as the General Order had required.
admitted that he did not attend the muster, or send in any
return of his
stock, without assigning any satisfactory motive.
The Bench referred to General Orders relative to penalties
ordered in such
cases of non-attendance; and from the peculiar circumstances,
Mason to one months imprisonment.
A McDOUGAL, G. SUTTER and J. SMITH were brought before the
bench upon a
complaint similar to the foregoing. Having each acknowledged
the charge of
non attendance to the muster aforesaid:
G. Suttor assigned as his motive that it was highly
disagreeable to his
feelings to comply with the Order.
A. McDougal said, that there was no necessity for his
assigning any reason
for his non attendance; as he had previously done so; and
J. Smith declared that the same reasons which had operated
with McDougal had
influenced him likewise.
The Bench cleared upon these declarations; and on reopening
Messrs Smith and McDougal be imprisoned one month each for
the General Order in question; and G Sutter be committed to
take his trial
before a Court of Criminal Jurisdiction.
Thoma HARLEY and John HILLUS were also brought before the
Bench to answer a
like charge; when John Hillus assigned his reason for
resisting the Orders,
his having taken an oath of allegiance to Governor Bligh, and
pleaded his entire ignorance of the Order.
The Bench cleared again; and re-opening John Hillus was
month's imprisonment, and Thomas Harley discharged with an
admonition, to be
more attentive in future of Colonial Regulations.
Hello Lesley & Marg, Coralie, Liz, Alan & Janice, Warren & Neville, I hope I didn't forget anybody.
I wish to thank you all most sincerely for the great response I had regarding the ??marriage of William Mahoney and Ann Hayes. It most definitely does 'pay to advertise', and what better way than Lesley's great List.
Although I thanked them all individually, I wanted to do it publicly, as other Listers will realise what a great List they subscribe to - it really is the greatest!
Many, many thanks,
If you have a look at this web-site :
and follow the Simon Moulds link, you'll find some basic
info on the family of Simon and Ann.
----- Original Message -----
Subject: [PJ] Parramatta - Moulds & Davis
> I am seeking information the family of Simon Moulds and Ann Davis who
were born in UK and married in St. Johns Parramatta. Simon came on the
"BARWELL" in 1798. Susannah Moulds was a daughter of this union and married
convict Francis Sherwood in 1827 at St. Johns Parramatta.
This are a James and a John Byrne listed as householders in the 1841 census
in Goulburn district (one at Spring Valley, one at Long Corner). Might be
worth getting a complete listing of those resident in the households. Go to
www.records.nsw.gov.au and find 1841 census index in their online
publications. No Peter Byrne listed.
By the way if there turn out to be any BOYTONs or HAMILTONs in these
households I'd love to know (there was a Spring Valley connection).
All the best
>> I'd appreciate some help on a puzzle! I suspect that Peter Byrne (Almorah
>> 1821) who seems to have married Margaret Brennan (aka Mary, John Bull
>> 1821) twice (1st C of E, 2nd RC) may be the father of my Gggrandfather
>> Peter Byrne who died in 1884 and was buried at Cooma without leaving a
>> death certificate. Peter (junior's) marriage certificate (Married Ann
>> Leacount at Cooma in 1857) simply states that he was from Goulburn. But
>> his age matches that of Peter and Margaret's first born and they were
>> married at St Mary's RC Sydney, the same place as Anne Leacount's parents